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Brexit

Westministenders: The Non Re-Opening Of Parliament

989 replies

RedToothBrush · 24/09/2019 19:40

Parliament will reconvene tomorrow, at 11.30am, as if proroguation never happened as the Supreme Court ruled that the government acted outside the limits of its power and this was therefore unlawful.

The most senior court in the UK has ruled unaminously to defend Parliamentary Sovereignity and the Rule of British Law.

Unusually for a Wednesday there will be no PMQ, however there will be time for Ministerial Statements, UQ and Debate under S024.
See the abbreviation thread if you are struggling with these

So tomorrow is sure to be explosive on way or another.

The Government is hitting back by questioning the Supreme Court whilst also saying they respect the Supreme Court's authority. This is an oxymoron. Its being done for political reasons and is, in its own way, a direct threat to the Rule of Law.

Robert Buckland is, again, having to do a lot in Cabinet to assert the point of the importance of the Rule of Law and how it prevents mob rule. Something that seems to keep getting forgotten by anonymous No 10 sources.

The political fallout from the ruling is sure to lead to calls for the Supreme Court to be politically elected. This has been a long term goal of parts of the hard right.

Johnson, is currently in the US, so the announcement that parliament will be back tomorrow has rather spoilt his jolly to see his mate Donnie. He will have to get on a plane smartish.

But for all the hard talk there will also be ramifications for Johnson. Whilst there will be a lot of 'nothing has changed', and there is no chance of a VoNC in the HoC being tabled by the opposition whilst no deal is still on the table on the 31st Oct, there will still be problems for Johnson.

There will be a post mortem within his own party. The next Cabinet Meeting will almost certainly be explosive. There are already attempts to set Geoffrey Cox, the Attorney General who apparently advised that proroguation was lawful, under the bus as the fall guy. This will perhaps be a deflection to try and protect Dominic Cummings, as there will be moderate Tories who will seek to use this as an opportunity to have him sacked. But more than this, its likely to result in other Cabinet Ministers being more forceful and to challenge Johnson more, both for their own political gain and for their own political protection. He will certainly be more questioned from within, about his poor judgement.

We also have him facing an investigation from the London Assembly over his conduct and suggestions of an inappropriate relationship with a busty blonde American woman.

Next weeks Conservative Party Conference is now in tatters. Whilst Corbyn has wrapped up the Labour Party Conference early to avoid a clash with Parliament being open, Johnson is stuffed. Next week's PMQ will clash with the schedule for his Party Speech. Normally parliament would be in recess for the conference season, but parliament has to vote to allow this. And there isn't a majority for the Conservatives to now be able to do this. So Parliament almost certainly will be sitting next week.

Unfortunately, the Tories are a little stuffed with their conference being held in Manchester. If (and lets face it, with the gloves off and time short) the opposition want to cause mischief, they will try and schedule crucial and embarassing debates during the party conference, to keep MPs stuck in Westminister as much as possible. And with good reason under the circumstances.

We still have the small matter of the 31st October deadline which Johnson is still sticking to saying we will either have a deal or we will leave without a deal - unlawfully.

Remember on that note, Johnson has already acted beyond his power and unlawfully on the basis of bad advice. Johnson being hulk, rather than a girly swat, relies on the advice of others more heavily than his own wisdom and experience - of which he has been exposed time and again - to be somewhat lacking in.

As a side note, its also worth reflecting on the NCA having dropped charges in relation to Leave.Eu and how the Electoral Commission has commented on this decision:
"We are concerned about the apparent weakness in the law, highlighted by this investigation outcome, which allows overseas funds into UK politics. We have made recommendations that would tighten the rules on campaign funding and deter breaches. We urge the UK's governments to act on those recommendations to support voter confidence"

In the context of an imminent General Election, this is really very concerning indeed.

Just WHO is in control? Cos it doesn't look like its Boris Johnson right now, thats for sure.

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prettybird · 24/09/2019 20:00

Specially taken picture in preparation for cat marking my place on the new thread. Bed couldn't be made again because the boys couldn't possibly be disturbed Wink and nothing whatsoever to do with me being riveted to the TV and these threads Blush

"Gloating" is not the right word - unless you're saying that relief at confirmation that we do still live in a parliamentary democracy, in which parliament can't be prorogued on the whim of any a rogue PM is gloatingConfused

Westministenders: The Non Re-Opening Of Parliament
placemats · 24/09/2019 20:02

Now it's GBBO.

Great British Boris Obliteration.

Hoooo · 24/09/2019 20:03

Utterly exhausted Pmk

chomalungma · 24/09/2019 20:03

Guessing this was mentioned on the last thread.

But Boris said it was all about the Queen's speech and then talks about getting Brexit through after he said he disagreed with the judgement.

So it had nothing to do with the Queen's speech at all.

OhLookHeKickedTheBall · 24/09/2019 20:05

So it had nothing to do with the Queen's speech at all.
Pretty much. And shows the justices were right in the view that it was called to frustrate the ability of parliament.

Mistigri · 24/09/2019 20:05

How long will this thread last? Previous one must have been a record: about 9.5 hours by my reckoning!

Thanks Red.

yolofish · 24/09/2019 20:06

Here's a happy dog, she's a Remainer...

Westministenders: The Non Re-Opening Of Parliament
cherin · 24/09/2019 20:08

All the best are (remainers!) whooof whoof!

TheElementsSong · 24/09/2019 20:10

PMK!

"Gloating" is not the right word

Let me explain it prettybird - amongst Remainers, any kind of levity is bad because Gloating and/or Flippant, but so is any sign of stout determination because Disrespectful of Willy, and definitely no anger should be expressed because Hysterical. Oh, nor any straight-laced content-heavy factuality because Soulless.

And worst of all, NO WIT Wink

HTH.

PestyMachtubernahme · 24/09/2019 20:10

LEAVE.EU GROUP LIMITED
Company number 09763501
and
VOTE LEAVE LIMITED
Company number 09785255
Both get through as many people as TM's cabinet.

RHTawneyonabus · 24/09/2019 20:11

'The King hath no prerogative but that which the law of the land allows him'

By way of a placemat

RedToothBrush · 24/09/2019 20:12

Chris Giles @chrisgiles_
The @FinancialTimes never calls for heads to roll in editorials. It is a policy

FT editorial

  • broken today

From the article
The court’s decision was a much-needed reminder that, even in the most testing political circumstances, Britain remains a representative democracy underpinned by the rule of law. MPs are elected to exercise their good judgment and take decisions on behalf of constituents. They hold to account a government formed from among their number. The executive is accountable to parliament, and parliament to the people. Removing parliament, even for a matter of weeks, breaks the chain of accountability. The UK system cannot allow a cabal around the prime minister to determine by itself the “will of the people” and attempt to implement it, while sidelining those whom the people elected to represent them. This is the road to tyranny

And

In 1611, a court held that the King — who was then the government — “hath no prerogative but that which the law of the land allows him”.

Westministenders: The Non Re-Opening Of Parliament
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Belindabelle · 24/09/2019 20:13

JRM taking questions tomorrow and not Johnson.

Johnson has spoken to the Queen.

Alsohuman · 24/09/2019 20:13

Gladys is a remainer too.

TheABC · 24/09/2019 20:13

I am just relieved the prorogation is over. Parliament is indeed sovereign.

Like others on this thread, I don't think it will affect the very short-term outcomes on Brexit (unless there is a successful VONC, followed by some sort of coalition government). But it will have a lot of long term ramifications and I expect steps toward a written constitution to be one of them.

Bearbehind · 24/09/2019 20:13

Except it was me, a Remainer, who used the word ‘gloating’

People are really not seeing it are they?

It doesn’t matter whether the ruling was right or wrong, it’s making the likes of mummmy and grass dig in further.

I totally disagree with their views but even I can see ignoring and worse, belittling them, only serves to make matters worse.

ListeningQuietly · 24/09/2019 20:14

Johnson will call for another prorogue as the Queens speech is already scheduled
No its not
because the last Prorogue did not happen
as was Unanimously stated by the highest court in the land

TheABC · 24/09/2019 20:14

I would also love to listen in on the next conversation between Boris and the Queen. I wonder what the Palace is thinking now?

yolofish · 24/09/2019 20:16

bear I think everyone is digging in and agree that it's not a healthy situation. However, I do believe the decision of the SC is the right one, because it does NOT allow the govt of the day to ride roughshod over the law of the land - which is of course what Brexiteers hold paramount?
(don't they? or is it only if they don't like the way it goes?)

Belindabelle · 24/09/2019 20:16

Maybe Johnson is going to Balmoral to see the Queen instead of going to Parliament.

QuentinWinters · 24/09/2019 20:16

bore Grin

I loved the spider brooch

yolofish · 24/09/2019 20:17

alsohuman loving Gladys! excellent name

BercowsFlyingFlamingo · 24/09/2019 20:17

Not far off in my timing for a new thread by bedtime Smile

TheElementsSong · 24/09/2019 20:17

It doesn’t matter whether the ruling was right or wrong, it’s making the likes of mummmy and grass dig in further

If, as you say, ignoring would cause digging, but disagreement would also cause digging, what would you suggest? Agreement? Confused

They were never never never going to un-dig no matter what.

RedToothBrush · 24/09/2019 20:19

Previous one must have been a record: about 9.5 hours by my reckoning!

Nope. We've had quicker ones. I'm expecting this one to fly.

Tom Newton Dunn@tnewtondunn
NEW: Boris Johnson has rang the Queen from New York. No10 won't say whether he apologised to her: "We never discuss conversations between the Prime Minister and Her Majesty".

Parliament will return tomorrow with Commons Leader Jacob Rees-Mogg setting out the business for the week at 11.30am. A minister also likely to make a statement on the court decision (though doesn't look like it will be the PM, who flies home overnight).

Sam Coates Sky@samcoatessky
Latest

- Boris Johnson has spoken to the Queen

- Did not say if he apologised

- Jacob Rees Mogg will address Parliament tomorrow says UK official

Latest (2)

- unclear if/when Boris Johnson will address Pt

- No10 trying to hose down suggestions that they think Supreme Ct made a “serious mistake”. Say PM hasn’t said that - and he respects judiciary

Johnson either is putting up his spokesman at No10 to undermine the rule of law via plausible deniability or he's really really not in control of spokesman at No10 who is doing lots of damage to the rule of law.

Still trying to make up my mind which is worse.

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