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Brexit

Westministenders: The Non Re-Opening Of Parliament

989 replies

RedToothBrush · 24/09/2019 19:40

Parliament will reconvene tomorrow, at 11.30am, as if proroguation never happened as the Supreme Court ruled that the government acted outside the limits of its power and this was therefore unlawful.

The most senior court in the UK has ruled unaminously to defend Parliamentary Sovereignity and the Rule of British Law.

Unusually for a Wednesday there will be no PMQ, however there will be time for Ministerial Statements, UQ and Debate under S024.
See the abbreviation thread if you are struggling with these

So tomorrow is sure to be explosive on way or another.

The Government is hitting back by questioning the Supreme Court whilst also saying they respect the Supreme Court's authority. This is an oxymoron. Its being done for political reasons and is, in its own way, a direct threat to the Rule of Law.

Robert Buckland is, again, having to do a lot in Cabinet to assert the point of the importance of the Rule of Law and how it prevents mob rule. Something that seems to keep getting forgotten by anonymous No 10 sources.

The political fallout from the ruling is sure to lead to calls for the Supreme Court to be politically elected. This has been a long term goal of parts of the hard right.

Johnson, is currently in the US, so the announcement that parliament will be back tomorrow has rather spoilt his jolly to see his mate Donnie. He will have to get on a plane smartish.

But for all the hard talk there will also be ramifications for Johnson. Whilst there will be a lot of 'nothing has changed', and there is no chance of a VoNC in the HoC being tabled by the opposition whilst no deal is still on the table on the 31st Oct, there will still be problems for Johnson.

There will be a post mortem within his own party. The next Cabinet Meeting will almost certainly be explosive. There are already attempts to set Geoffrey Cox, the Attorney General who apparently advised that proroguation was lawful, under the bus as the fall guy. This will perhaps be a deflection to try and protect Dominic Cummings, as there will be moderate Tories who will seek to use this as an opportunity to have him sacked. But more than this, its likely to result in other Cabinet Ministers being more forceful and to challenge Johnson more, both for their own political gain and for their own political protection. He will certainly be more questioned from within, about his poor judgement.

We also have him facing an investigation from the London Assembly over his conduct and suggestions of an inappropriate relationship with a busty blonde American woman.

Next weeks Conservative Party Conference is now in tatters. Whilst Corbyn has wrapped up the Labour Party Conference early to avoid a clash with Parliament being open, Johnson is stuffed. Next week's PMQ will clash with the schedule for his Party Speech. Normally parliament would be in recess for the conference season, but parliament has to vote to allow this. And there isn't a majority for the Conservatives to now be able to do this. So Parliament almost certainly will be sitting next week.

Unfortunately, the Tories are a little stuffed with their conference being held in Manchester. If (and lets face it, with the gloves off and time short) the opposition want to cause mischief, they will try and schedule crucial and embarassing debates during the party conference, to keep MPs stuck in Westminister as much as possible. And with good reason under the circumstances.

We still have the small matter of the 31st October deadline which Johnson is still sticking to saying we will either have a deal or we will leave without a deal - unlawfully.

Remember on that note, Johnson has already acted beyond his power and unlawfully on the basis of bad advice. Johnson being hulk, rather than a girly swat, relies on the advice of others more heavily than his own wisdom and experience - of which he has been exposed time and again - to be somewhat lacking in.

As a side note, its also worth reflecting on the NCA having dropped charges in relation to Leave.Eu and how the Electoral Commission has commented on this decision:
"We are concerned about the apparent weakness in the law, highlighted by this investigation outcome, which allows overseas funds into UK politics. We have made recommendations that would tighten the rules on campaign funding and deter breaches. We urge the UK's governments to act on those recommendations to support voter confidence"

In the context of an imminent General Election, this is really very concerning indeed.

Just WHO is in control? Cos it doesn't look like its Boris Johnson right now, thats for sure.

OP posts:
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RedToothBrush · 25/09/2019 09:21

Red re: JRM - do you think he will cause more moderated Tory MPs to leave/renounce the whip and become independent?

I think this is possible.

Or is he trying to undermine PM to get someone else in post?

No. I just think he's this arrogant and tone deaf.

OP posts:
W0rriedMum · 25/09/2019 09:26

Amber Rudd is definitely worried - she came out yesterday and said she'd never seen the prorogation legal evidence as it wasn't shown to cabinet.

Sadly the four main Brexit papers came out with negative Supreme Court sentiment: Daily Mail, Express, Telegraph and the Sun. The readership of these is HUGE across the country. If you're a secret Daily Mail app reader and are against a hard Brexit, just delete it as they use the reader numbers to justify their extreme right wing views.

W0rriedMum · 25/09/2019 09:28

In fact, I think there is a high chance that Amber Rudd will resign today.

Alsohuman · 25/09/2019 09:30

Excellent. The more Tory resignations the better.

LarkDescending · 25/09/2019 09:35

Didn’t Amber Rudd already resign in the first week of September?

kingsassassin · 25/09/2019 09:36

Amber Rudd has already resigned the conservative whip, so she would be standing down completely.

It would be a shame to lose a one nation liberal conservative as her replacement is likely to be a very pro-leave right winger, especially as Hastings and Rye voted 55% to leave.

BercowsFlyingFlamingo · 25/09/2019 09:39

Watching Swayne on AOP on Sky and he's giving me the rage. Just his face and voice before I heard him say the SC had overstepped.

flouncyfanny · 25/09/2019 09:42

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

flouncyfanny · 25/09/2019 09:43

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BigChocFrenzy · 25/09/2019 09:46

"she'd never seen the prorogation legal evidence as it wasn't shown to cabinet."

Ridiculous
The PM is traditionally described as "first among equals"

and particularly in a minority govt,
the entire Cabinet should be kept fully informed and consulted about major decisions, let alone when starting a Constitutional crisis

More Cabinet ministers may be considering their position,
because they were dragged into supporting what has tuned out to be unlawful decisions, withouf being gven the chance beforehand of fully informed diiscussion

prettybird · 25/09/2019 09:47

Keep an eye on Gove Hmm

flouncyfanny · 25/09/2019 09:49

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

prettybird · 25/09/2019 09:52

No - I meant as potential replacement for BJ-Cummings.

He'd be able to say that he was right about BJ's character deficiencies when he stabbed BJ in the back front in 2016.

Belindabelle · 25/09/2019 09:58

Just had the misfortune to hear Gove on LBC. He is definitely on manoeuvres. Sarah Vine will be eyeing up more furniture from OKA to refurbish that apartment above no.11.

BigChocFrenzy · 25/09/2019 10:06

@red Have you read Richard Hutton's long & detailed history of the City spivs, big pharma & big US tech money behind Brexit ?

Their financing the network of interconnected rightwing thinktanks
Then the switch to No Deal, as the potential for windfalls is realised

Fascinating how people like Leadsom could ridicule Brexit only in 2013 and then jump to U-turn

If only those who claim Remain is an "elite vs the people" would read about the massively wealthy behind Leave
The aims of slashing almost all workers rights are chilling

For everyone who likes VERY long reads with detail:

BREXIT WAS THE RESULT OF A CORPORATE LOBBYING CAMPAIGN WHICH BACKFIRED

https://richardhutton.wordpress.com/category/brexit-was-the-result-of-a-corporate-lobbying-campaign-which-backfired/

frumpety · 25/09/2019 10:07

Does the Queen still get to make a speech ? Will Boris have to prorogue again for her to do this ? Sorry if these are dim questions.

kingsassassin · 25/09/2019 10:10

Boris would have to prorogue again if the Queen's speech goes ahead.

There doesn't have to be a Queen's Speech before 31st October though and any prorogation should be kept to the absolute bare minimum otherwise its straight back to court.

OhLookHeKickedTheBall · 25/09/2019 10:11
A short extract from The Day Today (shared by Armando Iannucci) Change John Major to Boris Johnson and that pretty much sums up where we are
PerkingFaintly · 25/09/2019 10:14

Well the whole point of Johnson & Gove's support for the Leave campaign was that they were both hoping for a turn sitting in the big chair until the grown-ups came back and got on with running the country.

One might have thought Gove would have learnt how hot the chair actually is, watching Johnson's balls get roasted.

But it wouldn't surprise me AT ALL if he's in fact too arrogant to have learnt anything, and is desperately manoeuvring to get his bum on the seat the moment the music stops.

LouiseCollins28 · 25/09/2019 10:18

I think an alternate Conservative PM can only be chosen if Boris Johnson resigns. If he doesn't, he's "safe" from his own party for around 1 year I think.

JeSuisPoulet · 25/09/2019 10:20

What worries me about Gove, as well as the usual, is that he also worked with Cummings. I don't think Cummings would be going anywhere if he is on side with Gove having used Boris to try his Plan A and failed...

prettybird · 25/09/2019 10:21

We had a discussion on the last thread or more probably the one before Wink about whether or not "money is the root of all evil".

I think it was DGR who pointed out that without money to smooth transactions, we'd be back to a simple barter economy.

I'd suggest that it's not money that is evil, but gambling Sad That's what the banks started doing with their "investment" arms, which led to the financial crash Angry. That's what the hedge funders do - which is why they are so desperate for Brexit to go ahead, so that they can make millions if not billions from their positions Angry They have zero sense of responsibility towards the economy (since they can bet against it Hmm) let alone society and those whose lives they destroy Angry

The film "The Big Short" is a good exposé. I note that it is described on Wikipedia as a "comedy-drama". That is not the sense I got from it Confused: I came out the cinema angry at the extent of the corruption in the "system" - and that was despite having already read a lot about the reasons behind the crash as I'd been doing a multi-million pound deal with Iceland at the time

JeSuisPoulet · 25/09/2019 10:24

I wonder what Cummings makes of Trump. Help or hindrance? I suspect he doesn't like BoZo's ear being taken by someone so powerful who could undermine or change his own plans.

JeSuisPoulet · 25/09/2019 10:26

Not surprised Wiki (Assange) would call it a comedy drama! Another version of "silencing the will of the people" right there in one person.

OhLookHeKickedTheBall · 25/09/2019 10:27

It's only convention that the party leaders become PM. Johnson could theoretically step down as PM but remain party leader, especially if there's some sort of mini internal coup. Can't see that happening though.