COULD Varadker play a blinder?

[Miljah]

First, I have no personal skin in the game. Apart from the bomb scares of the 70s in British towns. And the nightly news.

Secondly, I have tried to keep abreast of the political landscape in NI, while understanding that there are complexities way beyond my ken at play.

And thirdly, a MN suspension, maybe six months ago, as an outsider musing whether it was deeply patronising to the people of NI to assume, as a matter of course, that the only way to broker differences was bombs and guns, there surely had to be other ways?- I was told in no uncertain terms that these were the only tools available, and that I should butt out as a non NI person....

SO. What if Varadker, highly unlikely, I know, were to offer reunification with an undertaking to respect Protestant rights? I recognise the economics, here- 70% of NI jobs are financed UK public sector. Could the republic pick up that slack? Would NI people earning that public sector cash want to jeopardise that?

But might that represent the first inkling of a way forward for NI? EU membership (and I'd bet ££ (I don't have 'euro, euro' on my keyboard! 😊) in order to sweeten that seismic shift; especially now NI must recognise that much of GB didn't even know, or care, about the GFA?

How soon before I am reported, in outrage?....

Could add that said feet are being used to kick us back down periodically.

Joxer can I ask a genuine question, what would you like to see happening, especially now with Brexit?

Yadid I don't know if your comment is meant to be ignorant or inflammatory?

Pre-partition, Northen Ireland's economy was a bit of a powerhouse.
Through decades of mis-management or failure to grow secondary to the war Troubles has led to a disproportionate reliance on the public sector.

Saying that, the most industrious people I know come from nationalist backgrounds in NI. Hardworking, very ambitious, and have developed companies that employ people on both sides of the border and internationally.

Genuinely? I want Brexit cancelled and a return to business as usual.

I know that won’t happen though. I’m not sure there is a preferable option out of what’s available to us though.

Joxer it really is a disaster isn't it. It's going to impact so many and has caused a major divide between people and countries.

@DuchessDumbarton I tried to find a clip but i couldn't sorry. It's a good watch.

I'm guessing @Yadid is in the KnowsFuckAll and OtherPeopleShouldSortMyShit categories.

My cat is definitely in the second and probably in the first category. My dd, when she was a toddler, was also in both. Good company for an adult to keep

And thirdly, a MN suspension, maybe six months ago, as an outsider musing whether it was deeply patronising to the people of NI to assume, as a matter of course, that the only way to broker differences was bombs and guns, there surely had to be other ways?- I was told in no uncertain terms that these were the only tools available, and that I should butt out as a non NI person....

I'm sure you don't mean to imply that the majority of people in NI are threatening violence if Brexit doesn't go as they wish. Because that's not what's happening at all.

The majority in NI just want to live in peace, as they have done for the past 21 years. However, they recognise that that peace is very fragile and that a very small minority is only too happy to seize any opportunity to cause havoc. And it's the people who lived through the Troubles in NI that know exactly how bad that can be.

What the vast majority in NI want is for the status quo to continue. We didn't want Brexit fucking everything up. We don't want a hard border with ROI, destroying our way of life and our economy. We don't want a border between NI and the rest of the UK. We don't want to be reminded that GB in general and the prime minister in particular don't actually give a shit about us. We don't want reunification, we're just not ready for it, the wounds need more time to heal.

We want to be left the fuck alone.

What @MindyStClaire said

Totally agree Mindy, I just wish some of those in Britain understood this. The comments at the moment about NI and Ireland are horrendous and shows they really don't have a clue and just don't care.

Surely the UK should sort out their own mess

I think this is how most of us in ROI feel. Sure it would be handy for them if we just too NI off their hands and they could on with a happy little Brexit but they don't seem to care that neither NI nor ROI want this to happen.

PandaPantaloon exactly. In ROI, Varadkar playing a blinder with respect to Brexit doesn't mean that he achieves reunification. It means the GFA is protected, that the economic damage to ROI is minimised and that ROI is successful in attracting new business that's leaving the UK.

NOBODY in the Republic wants a united Ireland. Politicians pay lip service to the idea but everyone knows it would be a disaster to import that particular can of worms.

OK.

Once again, a discussion of NI and the Irish border, and Brexit has resulted in a 'Fucking hell!' from joxer; and yes, mindy, my last thread descended into wails of "You don't understand!!!, and it was made very clear to me that messing with the GFA would, as a matter of course, naturally, obviously cause The Troubles to reignite.

Well, I'm trying, have learned some stuff (like that there's no appetite for reunification) but will bow out now.

Thank you to those who have been constructive and have articulated their views.

The one, final thing I would add is that if Varadker has played 'the blinder' as in the OP, that wouldn't be the rest of Britain making the Irish Border Question go away, would it?!

Still none the wiser as to what “Protestant rights” are

Still none the wiser as to what “Protestant rights” are

Maybe in a United Ireland, we'll finally be allowed not to believe in transubstantiation. It is after all illegal now.

yes, mindy, my last thread descended into wails of "You don't understand!!!, and it was made very clear to me that messing with the GFA would, as a matter of course, naturally, obviously cause The Troubles to reignite.

Well, yes, breaking a peace treaty tends to break the peace. The Troubles happened because of deeply held beliefs. They haven't gone away, the population of NI just agreed on a compromise.

Break the compromise and one community or the other will be unhappy. And for most people that unhappiness won't manifest in violence. But it will for a very small number of people - and then a very large number has to live with the consequences, through no fault of their own.

There have been loads of threads on this on MN, that have explained this again and again. If you really were open to learning and understanding, you would by now.

There have been loads of threads on this on MN, that have explained this again and again. If you really were open to learning and understanding, you would by now.

Well said Mindy.

Cant help a weird feeling that my views are being canvassed for more than a fellow MNer.........

I would add to the view that there is no appetite in Ireland for a United Ireland with NI.

Which is why I suggested NI becoming a separate state. Which appears to have offended some....... Nobody wants that sort of shite.
We want to be British
We want to be Irish
We want to be both.

I'm sorry, but patience is wearing thin in terms of nationalist or republican sympathy. Piss or get off the pot comes to mind.

Piss or get off the pot comes to mind.

We did. In 1998.

Again , agree with @MindyStClaire .
Maybe @Yadid is too young to remember 1998. I have other possibilities to explain why @Yadid us being such a plonker.

Jesus Yadid that's a bit harsh. The majority in NI didn't cause this yet they will have to live with the consequences. Most were happy with the way things are at present but Brexit has scubbered that. What do you expect those living in NI to do? Also those living in border counties in the ROI will also be greatly impacted. It's a total mess and there is no solution that won't cause problems. Maybe going back in time before the vote but that is as likely as the infamous border technology that keeps being promised.

Maybe getting over it?

A lot of media discussion in the UK seems to think or imply that Varadkar refusal to back down on the backstop must be because he has and ulterior motive or wants to punish the British. I mean he can't possibly actually care about an international peace treaty or the people of NI. They just cannot get their heads around the idea that he might actually genuinely give a sh** about the people of NI and GFA. They do not understand that a huge majority on the island of Ireland regardless of what political affiliations they have are fully behind him on this because we do actually remember what it was like and we never ever want to go back to those horrible dark times.