The Brexit Arms

[BrexitArmsLandLady]

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Hold the line Brexiters!!

Nearly there...

Only 53 days to go!

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[Parker231]

@Cittadina - people don’t seem to realise how quickly their lives will change for the negative - how the value of their house and pension will fall, their shopping bill will increase, so many jobs lost and industries destroyed. I can’t understand why people don’t care.

[MysteryTripAgain]

Are the people who would prefer no deal to no Brexit actually thinking rationally

I am in my view. However, I am aware that some decide between rational and irrational based on whether or not they other person agrees or not.

Haven't they read the countless impartial reports

Not convinced they are impartial. George Osbourne's forecast that UK would lose up to 820,000 jobs and GDP could shrink by 6% just by voting to leave before anything happened did not materialize. Project Fear.

not any kind of trade deal

WTO kicks in.

[bellinisurge]

Wanking over the joys of WTO won't last.

[SingingLily]

Did the Benn bill have an accompanying Money Resolution?

According to the Parliament website:

A Money resolution must be agreed to by the House of Commons if a new Bill proposes spending public money on something that hasn't previously been authorised by an Act of Parliament.
Money resolutions, like Ways and Means resolutions, are normally put to the House for agreement immediately after the Bill has passed its Second reading in the Commons.

Staying in the EU beyond the 31 October would result in the spending of more taxpayers' money, not least the £1b handed over to the EU each month for any further extension.

Is there anything in the Benn law that provides for this? Or is there an accompanying Money Resolution? Genuine questions.

[MysteryTripAgain]

They opposed one before 31 October

If the opposition parties are convinced they would win an election why did they object at all?

[bellinisurge]

You know why they opposed it until after 31 October. You are just pretending you don't.

[MysteryTripAgain]

WXnking over the joys of WTO won't last

Hope nobody is Wxnking over anything or anybody. What rude thoughts go through some people's minds.

[bellinisurge]

Pearls out to be clutched at a convenient time. Johnson doesn't even know how many children he has by that's ok with you.

[MysteryTripAgain]

You know why they opposed it until after 31 October

Yes, because they know they can't win. All the BennyHill Act does is to stop Johnson from not seeking an Extension to Article 50. The Benny Hill Act does not oblige the EU to agree.

[ContinuityError]

SingingLily

Johnson refusing to send the extension letter would be misconduct in public office (which is a criminal charge) and it is the tort of misfeasance in public office (civil offence) - and he could then be personally liable for colossal losses caused by a No Deal Brexit.

Oh - and mummmy’s fantasy second letter is also a non starter (even the Torygraph has admitted this).

Plenty of info available on legal Twitter.

[bellinisurge]

No, because they can't trust this Prime Minister not to dick about with timing such that 31 October passes mid election campaign. If they could trust him, they would agree to it.

[MysteryTripAgain]

Johnson doesn't even know how many children he has by that's ok with you

How does that relate to anything?

[SingingLily]

Thank you, ContinuityError.

[jasjas1973]

If it's not a criminal law, my understanding - I'm not a lawyer but happy to be enlightened by someone who is - then neither imprisonment nor the levying of a fine can be imposed

The court orders him to comply, he refuses, he is then in contempt of court... sentence can be jail, same for anyone who refuses to obey a court ruling.

[MysteryTripAgain]

@SonEtLumiere

Jagas1973 argument is old and irrelevant. The vote was leave. Those who voted leave do not have to justify their choice to anyone which is what Jagas seemed to be suggesting.

[bellinisurge]

@MysteryTripAgain you objected to me using the word wanking to describe some people's obsession with WTO. That is why Johnson's inability to know how many children he has is relevant. If you object to wanking surely you object to people fucking around without knowing or caring the consequences.

[MysteryTripAgain]

@ContinuityError

What forces the EU to accept UK's request to extend?

The reason EU have given for extension are either referendum or GE. I f neither of those are happening what will EU say?

[Bearbehind]

Johnson refusing to send the extension letter would be misconduct in public office (which is a criminal charge) and it is the tort of misfeasance in public office (civil offence) - and he could then be personally liable for colossal losses caused by a No Deal Brexit.

Apparently he’s going to send the letter, as required by law, then follow it up with another one saying to ignore the first one.

That would be quite funny if it was t so serious.

The only option now is no deal - BJ has raised the stakes too high to back down.

There is no option that involves compromise.

[SingingLily]

The court orders him to comply, he refuses, he is then in contempt of court... sentence can be jail, same for anyone who refuses to obey a court ruling.

Thank you, Jasjas.

I understand about contempt of court. I've had to escort more than a few people to the cells in my career for precisely that. I even know how to "purge your contempt".

However, contempt of court can only be imposed if (a) it actually gets to court, and (b) the court agrees that it is good and valid law, and (c) makes an order imposing compliance, and finally (d) the defendant refuses to do so.

So the Benn law does not carry that penalty. Not without jumping through several hoops first, that is.

[ContinuityError]

MysteryTripAgain

That wasn’t the question I was answering - that question being “what happens if Johnson breaks the law?”

TBH, this country shouldn’t even be discussing what happens if the PM deliberately breaks the law.

[MysteryTripAgain]

*if you object to wXnking surely you object to people fXcking around without knowing or caring the consequences.

The potential consequences of the two activities you have referenced are quite different. One could result in pregnancy (assuming the players are different genders) whereas the other does not need two persons and will not result in pregnancy.

[MysteryTripAgain]

Apparently he’s going to send the letter, as required by law, then follow it up with another one saying to ignore the first one

Extension to Article 50 has to be done by mutual consent. EU are not obliged to say yes. The second letter is more likely to ask why EU considers an extension to be helpful if WA can't be re-opened.

[Bearbehind]

Indeed.

The bit I don’t get with all this is what we think insisting BJ asks for an extension achieves.

The EU could, and probably should tell us to piss off

They explicitly told us not to waste the last extension, which is precisely what we’ve done.

Working on my theory that this mess can only start to be repaired if we go to no deal and get on mending the aftermath of it, the EU should tell us where to shove it.

They are more prepared for no deal than we are.

[jasjas1973]

Those who voted leave do not have to justify their choice to anyone

I wasn't referring to anyone on here, we are all just wind! some more than others lol!

So, why hasn't the govt published a "Songbird report" stating the list of benefits?

Win us all round, the problem is then solved.