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Brexit

Westminstenders: "He's in trouble". No he's not.

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 06/09/2019 00:48

All day I've seen nothing but comments and tweets about he Johnson is in trouble and he's losing it.

They are wrong. He's far from done.

Take a step through the Looking Glass and the world looks different.

Those tweeting and reporting all care about events and are following closely. They are unrepresentative of the population as a whole who don't give two shiny shits.

And so we have the Trump dynamic.

The Liberal elite of broadcasters and journalists who are only seeing through the lens of their own judgement, not from the repackaged marketing.

Instead they are unwittingly publishing the images and slogans in the format Johnson wants and enter the minds of the public as planned.

The media are out of step with perceptions. And that's worrying. They don't see what's coming.

Johnson will have an election at some point. With the Tory party cleansed of moderates it is the Brexit Party one way or another, whether it be by takeover or coalition. And its riding high in the polling.

Even though even his brother has abandoned him, the future looks positive for Johnson as his opponents have a complete lack of self awareness and no understanding of the opposition they are taking on; they are campaigning in a way that plays into the hands of Johnson.

Despite his lack of majority and apparently absence of plan or speech notes, the biggest mistake you can make now is to write off Johnson.

You do so at your own peril.

Pay close attention to how authoritarians work and what's already happened in the US. We are on course to repeat it.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
24
JustAnotherPoster00 · 06/09/2019 16:19

LabourLordsUK
@LabourLordsUK
· 50m
BREAKING:

  • No amendts to 3rd Reading of #BennBill, which completes its parliamentary scrutiny
  • @JeffRookerj (sponsor) moves 'This Bill Do Now Pass' motion - "CONTENT"
  • It will NOT return to MPs on Monday & Govt guarantees #RoyalAssent next week before #Prorogation

Job done!

Tanith · 06/09/2019 16:23

That CCHQ poster is just begging for a toilet seat to be superimposed on top of the shaft Grin

It’s too simplistic - poured or frittered away are too easily applicable captions.

ListeningQuietly · 06/09/2019 16:23

Job done!
I'll believe that when 1st November comes around.

Violetparis · 06/09/2019 16:23

I'm wondering if 'Corbyn is a chicken' is the new 'Strong and Stable'. That worked out well for the Tories at the last election.

Alsohuman · 06/09/2019 16:23

To be fair, Burt is better than that.

LonelyTiredandLow · 06/09/2019 16:24

The Benn bill passed (Guardian live story link)

Tanith · 06/09/2019 16:26

“"If everyone wants it to just go away, Revoke is the only way."

We know that
Most of the public - including Remainers do not

Why not? We’ve had three years, including an extension to tell them so. Where is the clear, simple message to tell them this?

LonelyTiredandLow · 06/09/2019 16:27

So do we think BoZo has now changed tack and is trying to get someone else to take the blame? The fact this bill wasn't fought against very hard could make one think they don't care if it passed or not? Will they break it or is this a plan for news spin "look who is trying to take your Brexit away!" fodder?

DGRossetti · 06/09/2019 16:28

Because his plans for re-nationalisation cannot be done within the Single Market ......

I think we're well past that at the moment. We can talk about the colour of the bunting when the ships stopped sinking.

Besides, for all this talk of what Corbyn wants, am I missing something in thinking there is a Labour party behind him who also get a say ? David Cameron wanted lots of things that the Tory party never agreed to, Tony Blair wanted lots of things that the Labour party didn't agree too, John Major .....

And as we've seen, Boris can't get what he wants either from the party.

In fact, if we want to swing a spotlight with the power of a million candles at party leaders who can push an individual agenda along, then I give you .... Nigel Farage. Who owns the BXP and all they will ever do. He doesn't need any tiresome backing from anybody. Not even Mrs. Farage.

But Corbyn is the problem ?

BigChocFrenzy · 06/09/2019 16:28

ballyhoo None of your suggestions would work:

"I'd revoke and make the Tories hold another referendum after they get

They would NOT need another ref - just win a GE and Invoke A50 immediately, saying the 2016 ref needs to be carried out
Winning a GE with that in their manifesto gives them the mandate - and hence also the HoL can't block it

" Pass some other legislation saying referendums have to be passed by a super majority like FTPA."

No Parliament can bind its successors by domestic+ legislation - it's a fundamental part of democracy
The next Parliament would require only a simple majority of MPs to repeal that law

(+Note "domestic:" any international treaty remains legally binding, so if broken by a new govt, any penalty clauses would apply, e.g. a US FTA)

LonelyTiredandLow · 06/09/2019 16:30

Tanith because Leavers loose 50% with revoke - they DON'T get what they voted for but DO get a quick fix. That's how they will see it.
Considering many of them don't believe No Deal will affect them at all it's not a great way to start. They won't read impact statements, or if they do will shrug and say it's the price they are willing to pay. It's hard to get them to empathise with anyone else's version of what they have to pay...

BigChocFrenzy · 06/09/2019 16:30

"Why not? We’ve had three years, including an extension to tell them so. Where is the clear, simple message to tell them this?"

Tanith We have obviously failed to convince them

  • probably because the message is much more complicated than "Just Leave"
LonelyTiredandLow · 06/09/2019 16:32

DGR I suspect Toadface will pop up now the bill has passed and turn against BoZo. Unless they are both on the same page and are awaiting Leaver emotional zenith...

JuliaCheeser · 06/09/2019 16:33

Name changed. I've been following, and occasionally joined in here.

I've had a message this afternoon. I read it and thought of you. Grin.
You might like a peek at what is going out to ordinary members and those on the subscribe list at Tory HQ. Interesting read given your discussions.

"RE: 2019 General Election
Boris Johnson, Prime Minister

Dear Julia Cheeser,
Four days ago Corbyn demanded an election. Two days ago, Corbyn told his MPs to block it.
So the man who has called for an election more than 30 times since 2017, is now stopping the people from having it.

Corbyn is trying to tie our hands and delay Brexit. So don’t let him. Chip in today and help us win the election – whenever it comes.
Donate £20
Donate £50
Donate £100
Donate £200
The truth is I don’t want an election. I want to get on with the job – leaving the EU by October 31st and investing in the country’s priorities. Like hospitals, police and schools.

But Labour MPs have left us no choice. They just passed a law that would force me to beg Brussels for an extension to the Brexit deadline.
This is something I will never do.

This would cause more delay and more chaos. And that means our economy would suffer and our priorities would be ignored. I won’t accept Labour’s delay.
That’s why I’m calling for an election. And as a member, your help is needed now more than ever. So will you chip in?

We’ll deliver Brexit by October 31st. No ifs, no buts.
Then we’ll get on with making it work. That means investing in the priorities we all share – like hospitals, police and schools.

And the support of members like you will make all of it possible.
Labour’s delay would leave us in limbo. So if you want to deliver Brexit by October 31st, then please chip in today.
Donate now
Yours sincerely,

Boris Johnson
Prime Minister"

DadDadDad · 06/09/2019 16:34

What I don't understand about the chicken line of attack is how it's meant to continue to work once a General Election is declared, because that would first require Corbyn to vote for a GE thus negating the charge of chicken.

LonelyTiredandLow · 06/09/2019 16:35

Hahaha "*then we'll get on with making it work" said every back of the lorry sales man ever.

SistemaAddict · 06/09/2019 16:36

So Bozo is refusing to abide by the bill?

SistemaAddict · 06/09/2019 16:36

But an election is blocked?

So now what?

BigChocFrenzy · 06/09/2019 16:37

"Because his plans for re-nationalisation cannot be done within the Single Market"

Some Lexiters keep claiming this - iirc Corbyn used to

BUT several socialist politicians in the EU have said this misunderstands the SM rules, because they have nationalised !

His plans are achievable within the SM

  • and a damn sight more achievable than after 5 years - or more - of hard right Tories dismantling, splitting, looting and wrecking what he wants to nationalise
BigChocFrenzy · 06/09/2019 16:38

Thanks, Julia
Good to have a Tory mole !

LonelyTiredandLow · 06/09/2019 16:38

IIRC Bercows he said he would ignore it, or Gove said he could...?

LizzieSiddal · 06/09/2019 16:39

Julia gosh that email.

It's a lot of ramblings!

Alsohuman · 06/09/2019 16:42

Thank you @JuliaCheeser.

DGRossetti · 06/09/2019 16:42

So do we think BoZo has now changed tack and is trying to get someone else to take the blame?

When Theresa May was PM, I kept suggesting that the reason she hadn't been replaced sooner was that nobody wanted to follow her directly, but to be the Leader after the Leader after. I suspect she kept some discipline (not enough for Boris) by simply threatening to resign and daring the party to find a replacement to carry the can.

If we look back at Boris coronation, we'll see how his rivals didn't really stand a chance do much to stop him.

Clearly I was wrong to a certain extent, as I would have wagered Boris would not immediately follow Theresa. But we live in interesting times. However, I'd be interested to know what happened in the shadows to cause me to be wrong. Whatever it was, it was around the time of the second extension. Maybe the Tories were calculating on sailing into an election just before October, but "events" worked against them ? Maybe they are playing a very long game (unlikely) ? Or maybe, as I need to remind myself sometimes, the past 3 years have seen other things change. For one things, there will be a strata in the Tories (as in all parties) that is growing increasingly dismayed that their 15 minutes might end up consumed in the clusterfuck of Brexit, instead of the trajectory they planned when entering politics ? If a week is a long time in politics, 3 years is an epoch - who has died, retired, left the scene; who has just joined, moved up, taken a new role ? All elements that conspire together to make the business of fortune telling as difficult as ever.

Basilpots · 06/09/2019 16:42

@JuliaCheeser

Would that letter be classed as a CF in Mumsnet parlance ?

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