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Brexit

“Project Fear” ... I’m dumbfound at the ignorance.

248 replies

Septemberissue · 07/08/2019 22:58

I am continually astounded by this government and the Brexiteers who are continually rubbishing claims and predictions by Industry leaders, experts, scientists, doctors and economists and claiming that it is part of the huge conspiracy; “project fear” should it not fit with their prosperous Eden that is post brexit Britain.

For example, Mark Carney said that the economy almost certainly would suffer as a result of no deal. But no no, he knows nothing. It’s project fear.

Dusty old Thatcherite tories (“Lord” Lamont) for example, on Newsnight last night said that Food supplies & medication would not be interrupted, despite industry leaders and experts saying it will. The Governments very own dry run of bringing the isotopes required for medical purposes such as xrays, scans, radio therapy etc. actually demonstrated that there would be delays, but again, these people are spouting lies & it’s just “project fear”. But of course, Lamont - who is arguably theee worst chancellor in British history - the man responsible for a run on the pound, is better placed to comment on this than the experts.

Another dusty old man of Tory grandeur Peter Lilley on PM tonight again dismissing claims by experts. It’s astounding.

Anyone who dares to call Brexit for what it is and gives their otherwise trusted opinion is a “remoaner” and their findings are just part of the so called project fear.

It seems that this faction want to blame anyone but themselves for this mess. It’s project fear. It’s the EU’s fault. They won’t negotiate. Our hands are clean. Hmm ... what extraordinary times we live in.

OP posts:
Dandeliontea123 · 08/08/2019 13:17

Contradictory advice coming from some Brexiteers here - we have to be stoical like in the terrors of WW2 but then things will only be a bit bumpy anyway? Make your minds up.

WiseUpJanetWeiss · 08/08/2019 13:36

this is a country which has survived several world wars / plagues / fire destroying the capital / civil war / many other wars - for anyone to consider Brexit in that light, well perhaps they are demeaning those who fought in those wars etc

You do understand that many, many people suffered and did not survive all these things? Are you really willing to sacrifice the poor and the sick for your fantasy Brexit? That would really be demeaning those who gave their lives for peace and security in Europe.

pointythings · 08/08/2019 13:37

Janista loves Britain so much they ran off to live in Oz...GrinGrinGrin

Mistigri · 08/08/2019 13:57

this is a country which has survived several world wars / plagues / fire destroying the capital / civil war / many other wars

I must have missed something. Who have we declared war on, and why?

PortLouis1996 · 08/08/2019 14:02

Who have we declared war on, and why?

Nobody. The point being made was resilience. UK, like many other places, has overcome hardships in the past and prospered as a result.

Mistigri · 08/08/2019 14:03

Why the language of belligerence then? If Brexit is so great you don't need to declare war on your own population and businesses.

PortLouis1996 · 08/08/2019 14:07

you don't need to declare war on your own population and businesses

Maybe I missed something? When was war declared on population and businesses?

bellinisurge · 08/08/2019 14:08

@PortLouis1996 this is self inflicted mass hardship. Ffs.

Mistigri · 08/08/2019 14:12

"Take Germany and Japan. Both flourished after WW2. Japan experienced a bad Tsunami, but they got over it.^"

"^this is a country which has survived several world wars / plagues / fire destroying the capital / civil war / many other wars"

So why are the leavers on this thread using the language of war and natural catastrophe?

ItsMsAtomicBobToYou · 08/08/2019 14:15

Three years down the road, investment going elsewhere, jobs going and Boris bloody Johnson as PM - a man who fucked up going down a zip line - and people are still parroting the same nonsense about wars and stoicism and everything will be FINE.

It's already not fine. Grow up and take a look around you. People are already suffering and you are fine with JRM and the rest driving the UK off a cliff. And in case anyone has forgotten, JRM's company moved its fund to Dublin. He'll be fine.

Mamamia456 · 08/08/2019 14:17

Singingbabooshkabadly - But worrying about it isn't going to change anything. Nobody definitely knows what will happen only speculate on worse case scenarios, so worrying about something that someone has said might happen is pointless.

FreshAprilStart · 08/08/2019 14:17

I work at a very senior level in economic strategy and we're being briefed to plan for 900,000 job losses by March 2020 if this goes ahead.

It is frightening.

SingingBabooshkaBadly · 08/08/2019 14:19

Japan experienced a bad Tsunami, but they got over it.

I don’t remember 52% of the Japanese electorate choosing to have a Tsunami.

PortLouis1996 · 08/08/2019 14:21

@PortLouis1996 this is self inflicted mass hardship

In the event of a no deal I agree that there will likely be some short term difficulties. BBC, who are very pro remain, have produced a list of how people may be effected if UK leaves the EU without a deal. None mention UK will experience mass hardship.

As someone who is from Irish descent, your fears about the impacts of a no deal on the island of Ireland are understandable. GFA is likely to be binned by EU regulations on basis that ROI as a member of the EU wants to protect their single market.

However, must be remembered that 17.4 million in the UK, including some from NI, voted to leave the EU. Are those 17.4 million to be told they can’t have what they voted for because NI and ROI (total population about 7 million) might be worse off?

Giving priority to 7 million in favour of 17.4 million does not sound very democratic

SingingBabooshkaBadly · 08/08/2019 14:23

Nobody definitely knows what will happen only speculate on worse case scenarios, so worrying about something that someone has said might happen is pointless.

Even the Government’s projections of the best case scenarios show we will be worse off with any version of Brexit, let alone the No Deal version we are heading for.

MaxNormal · 08/08/2019 14:24

BBC, who are very pro remain
They really are not. I've seldom seen a less questioning, less critical, toothless news service.

PortLouis1996 · 08/08/2019 14:27

Even the Government’s projections of the best case scenarios show we will be worse off with any version of Brexit, let alone the No Deal version we are heading for

Because MPs, as individuals, voted by majority for remain. It’s is their own personal interests to tell voters they got it wrong. None of them want to be upstaged by ordinary people in the street

Notonthestairs · 08/08/2019 14:27

So we are now arguing about what level of "difficulty" we face and how long it will last.

Sounds great. I'm sold.

I don't need to demonstrate my resilience to satisfy other people's political agendas.

MaxNormal · 08/08/2019 14:29

Could be irrelevant, but where does Carney's allegiance lie? With UK as a born and bred citizen of UK like his predecessor, Mervyn King, or with that of Canada and possibly Ireland if he has Irish passport.

I need to come back to this. As a naturalised UK citizen I find this really offensive.

Notonthestairs · 08/08/2019 14:29

If they ERG stood up and admitted they got it wrong I'm big enough to forgive them. Wink

PortLouis1996 · 08/08/2019 14:31

So we are now arguing about what level of "difficulty" we face and how long it will last

Sounds very like a recession. All of which in history have been temporary.

TheElementsSong · 08/08/2019 14:34

As a naturalised UK citizen I find this really offensive.

That’s because it’s a blood-and-soil dog-whistle to the True Patriots and is intended to be offensive to Citizens of Nowhere, albeit in a cowardly wide-eyed “ooh no, I’ve been misinterpreted, gosh aren’t these metropolitan snowflakes so sensitive” way.

Mistigri · 08/08/2019 14:38

As a naturalised UK citizen I find this really offensive.

It is really offensive. It's no different to the racists on twitter who won't accept that David Lammy is British.

As is the implication elsewhere on this forum today that as a Briton in Europe I am not entitled to an opinion on Brexit (presumably because I am not sufficiently patriotic).

MrPan · 08/08/2019 14:40

Port - short term difficulties? How, exactly are you measuring this?

"Difficulties" will be permanent. We are making ourselves poorer, insular, poorly-regarded (the rest of the world are astounded we'd even contemplate this), teeny-minded (rise in racists attacks), more reliant on the rest of the world for basic supplies at a higher price.

People like you limit everyone else's life chances. Fucking idiot.

jasjas1973 · 08/08/2019 15:00

@PortLouis1996

The salient point you seem to be avoiding is that the UK is doing all of this voluntarily, now with its eyes open but ignoring the experts because we know best!
No country choses a recession or a Tsunami (that was one of the more crazier comparisons to Brexit)