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Brexit

Westministenders: Brexit Preppers Are Traitors Who Don't Believe Enough

947 replies

RedToothBrush · 01/08/2019 12:31

Believe in Brexit. Brexit will be great. If only you believe.

So this is why the pound has tanked.
This is why the Treasury has opened the piggie bank for prep. This has sparked something of a backlash amongst moderates and remain MPs.
This will go towards managing that Channel Tunnel Congestion in Kent we weren't going to have.
And to stockpiling drugs which again was just hysteria.
This is why Gove, an MP who actually does have an eye for detail, has been drafted into the Cabinet Office.
This is why after his stint at DEFRA he is planning to buy tonnes of meat at a fixed price to keep farms in business.

Johnson has been to NI. But it wasn't a publicity stunt apparently. This is a man who posed for a photo when he resigned from the Foreign Office.

He was met with protests.

He also has a phonecall with the Leo Varadkar which was 'warm', before its been said by the DUP that Dublin must be a willing partner in a Brexit Deal.

Johnson is also still sticking to the line that technology can solve the border issue. Technology which will not be available until 2030 at the earliest by the government's own admission.

Johnson has refused to meet any European leaders until they drop the backstop (I note there are no EU meetings planned until mid October just a couple of weeks before the 31st anyway, so this kind of suits him and makes him look tough when really its been timetabled that way for a while. The EU themselves say that the 'next possible contact' with Johnson isn't until the G7 at the end of August anyway too).

However his 'Brexit Sherpa' David Frost - Olly Robbins successor HAS been meeting with EU officials still...

Dr Phillip Lee has confirmed today that he is actively considering his future as a Tory and defecting to the LDs. The rumour has been going for a while, and he is in the process of being deselected by his local party. To openly say it, is quite something though.

We also have the Brecon By Election today, which if the LD win as expected, would reduce the government's majority to just 1.

It is possible that Johnson will be leading a minority government very soon, if the cards fall the right way.

The speculation is rife that Johnson actively wants to force a GE. This hasn't been helped by Dominic Cummings has ordered the preparation of a Budget in the week starting Oct 7. Which would need to be voted for through parliament.

Votes on budget and other important issues are where not having a majority become crucial.

If a budget vote got stuck and provoked a GE it would perhaps land whilst Brexit Party Supporters had returned to the Tory party but perhaps before all the shit has start to hit the fan and people get really fed up.

And even if we do have no deal, when we DO have a deal, we will have to put a bill through parliament to implement it. Whilst everyone has focused on the backstop, no one has thought about this... which is pretty important.

It is remarkable that a No Deal Supporting Government are now seemingly planning for Project Fear.

And we were the crazy ones?

OP posts:
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wheresmymojo · 02/08/2019 20:07

If only evidence based policy was more common as an approach.

Lib Dem policies are largely evidence based. Fuck knows where TWAW came from.

The policies are voted on by membership at conference though so the more GC members, the more chance of them moving away from a transactivist takeover.

Hence I have (re)joined and doing a training course on campaigning later this year with them. Plan to run for Councillor in 4 years.

wheresmymojo · 02/08/2019 20:10

I know this is a tiny sample - but this shows the degree to which Tory members are actually pretty right wing.

Much more so than David Cameron/Theresa May who are quite centrist compared to the membership it seems from my online forum encounters.

Westministenders: Brexit Preppers Are Traitors Who Don't Believe Enough
DadDadDad · 02/08/2019 20:14

Heidi Allen is my MP, and she's said some good things, but I can't vote for her. She chose to join the Conservatives and helped them to get into power in 2015 and 2017 so they could bring about this calamity we face. She needs to join the LD and do the hard graft of getting a different party into power. (In any case, the seat is 50% Conservative, and I'm not sure either LD or Lab can beat them, let alone Allen standing as an independent).

Peregrina · 02/08/2019 20:17

One thing that bothers me about this great Remain alliance is that it can look a bit like an anti-democratic stitch-up. It adds on to my doubts about the Lib Dems already and doesn't do them many favours. If Labour get involved with it closely as well it really will remove options from voters. I doubt that I'm the only person to respond like that.

I think this depends how they tackle it. A lot of ifs coming up here, but if they won an election and said they would revoke for now, but do the work which Cameron should have commissioned about what Leaving would really mean, and looked at all the options from staying in the CU and having FoM to having a hard Brexit and then put it back to a vote in due course, then people might be happy enough.

Meanwhile there needs to be a serious attempt to tackle the broken problems of the country - the NHS creaking at the seams, schools under strain and a broken housing market for an absolute starter.

SegregateMumBev · 02/08/2019 21:00

I'm not so sure about the Fintan O'Toole idea (Norn Irn, here)

What would it actually acheive? Ok technically removes the majority, but there are enough Tories willing to vote against the whip on matters of importance? So what might they be able to achieve? If TM was still around trying to push through her WA, then maybe, but we're not there any more. And anyway, no-deal is still the legal default!

And what do Sinn Fein get out of it? The Tories are currently helping them towards their goal of a United Ireland without them having to lift a finger - why would they want to come to the rescue of the rest of the UK from its own mess?

Inniu · 02/08/2019 21:06

If SF were to do that then every Tory and DUP MP could vote with the government and it could still lose.

What is in it for SF? Do they really want NI to go through the hell of a no deal Brexit in the hope of s United Ireland in the future? I don’t know if this leadership does.

Inniu · 02/08/2019 21:07

But I should add I don’t think SF would go for this plan

ImNotYourGranny · 02/08/2019 21:10

This is going to be so much worse than anyone can begin to imagine.

On Newsnight last night there was a section on the trial for importing isotopes that didn't go well and the reassurance doctors wanted that the flagged problems were being addressed, one being shortage of delivery drivers. The brexity MP just brushed it all off with a 'it'll be sorted' line. The interviewer briefly mentioned that the delivery drivers have to be trained and licensed because it's classed as a dangerous load and again it was just brushed away with a 'now we have funds we'll sort it'.

DH was horrified. He's a prof in the nuclear sector and he said neither the interviewer or interviewee grasped how serious the lack of delivery drivers is. You can't just pull people in off the street and train them. You can't even contract regular drivers and train and license them. To get a license the driver has to be trained to the level that in the event of an accident they are able to be the nuclear expert on site advising the emergency services on how to deal with it.

And what is really scary is DH told me that in his capacity as an expert adviser in nuclear matters he has been writing to various MPs warning them about the serious risk to supply and making recommendations on what needs to be done ever since the referendum. And do you know what, he's not had a single reply to his letters. The nuclear sector is quite a small family and he doesn't know of a single expert like himself who has been contacted by government for advice.

woman19 · 02/08/2019 21:24

Do reactions to that O'Toole article reflect the differences in attitudes to a UI and the SF, across the island of Ireland?

Great writer that O'Toole fellow, for a great newspaper.

In certain times, certain measures are needed, to paraphrase my new crush Heidi Allen. I agree with Hester et al up thread, she was great on remainiacs this week and channel4 news earlier.

Nice work by her and all the remain sisters in Brecon, (and their male support staff) yesterday. Wink

he's not had a single reply to his letters
Yup. We have 3 year old westminstenders archive of informed posts on Euratom, somewhere round here too. Sad Angry

Apileofballyhoo · 02/08/2019 21:27

If Sinn Fein wanted to crowdfund on that platform, I've got £10 waiting to go. I'd have to make sure the funding cut off right at the mark...

The nuclear sector is quite a small family and he doesn't know of a single expert like himself who has been contacted by government for advice. Scary but not surprising, Granny.

BigChocFrenzy · 02/08/2019 21:32

imo, it's a stitch-up that both main parties are chasing the 51.9%, but for the 48.1% it's just "fuck off and suck it up"

When the country is split, one of the 2 main parties should represent each half

borntobequiet · 02/08/2019 21:35

Imnotyourgranny that is horrifying.
On a lighter note, I like your username.

borntobequiet · 02/08/2019 21:36

Better with the caps, sorry.

wherearemychickens · 02/08/2019 21:36

What happens to the existing delivery drivers? How does no deal make them unable to carry on?

HesterThrale · 02/08/2019 21:37

Hi woman!

Ipsos MORI poll - some points:

A new poll has found that almost three-quarters of Britons do not expect a Brexit deal to be agreed between the UK and EU by October 31st.

In the event of a no-deal Brexit, 40% of the public think that they understand what will happen "very well" or "fairly well" compared to 54% that say "not well" or "not well at all".

Ipsos Mori also found an uplift in support for the Conservatives following Boris Johnson's arrival at Downing Street.
Both Labour and the Brexit Party saw a big dent in their support, with the Liberal Democrats benefiting from Labour's diminished support.

www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/poll-finds-74-britons-think-brexit-deal-is-unlikey-before-october-31st-1-6194426

Apileofballyhoo · 02/08/2019 21:38

Do reactions to that O'Toole article reflect the differences in attitudes to a UI and the SF, across the island of Ireland?

Do you mean reactions here on this post? I'm not sure what you mean, woman. I've not looked at FB or Twitter. I don't really talk to people in real life about Brexit apart from my family so I don't really know what other people think. DH thinks it's a cunning plan that has as much chance of fruition as any of Baldrick's. It just needs a turnip or two. Good solid British turnips. Handy for no deal.

BigChocFrenzy · 02/08/2019 21:40

I'm sometimes baffled by No. 10

Are they genuinely this dim, or do they think we are ?

Pippa Crerarr@PippaCrerar*

No 10 insider tells me they’re relaxed about pound falling

because it shows that business is “finally taking it seriously” that UK is leaving EU on Oct 31

Jason118 · 02/08/2019 21:50

It's consistent with the "fuck business" narrative so I'm not surprised

ImNotYourGranny · 02/08/2019 21:52

What happens to the existing delivery drivers? How does no deal make them unable to carry on?

They can't fit their lorries on the plane.

prettybird · 02/08/2019 21:54

Hellooooo woman19 - long time no see Wink Good to see you back Smile I was just thinking of you yesterday when I was pondering making some more tablet to distribute as RAOK Grin as I haven't made any in a while (although I am stockpiling condensed milk and caster sugar Wink).

Regular WMers are welcome to have some Grin

BigChocFrenzy · 02/08/2019 21:58

Owen Smith@OwenSmith_MP

9 days in the job and Boris Johnson has so far:

tanked the pound;

lost a by-election;

squandered Billions on a No-Deal Brexit No-one voted for;

and toured the UK prompting widespread calls for its break-up.

So, I expect Labour is now making big gains in the polls...?

BigChocFrenzy · 02/08/2019 22:00

At least BJ hasn't started a war
Yet

Although appointing Raab as Foreign Secretary may count as incitement

woman19 · 02/08/2019 22:03

Hi Hester Smile hello prettybird lovely to see you here to. Mmm tablet........I have it on good authority, that your tablet could be used as very effective bargaining chip to stop the brexit. Wink Once tasted no one will want to be without it . I haven't got a cat picture, but mine's decided to use my modest onion plantation as his toilet this year. Angry

Do you mean reactions here on this post Apileofballyhoo, No, just what I saw in comments in twitter to that article, and what embarrassingly limited knowledge I have of some views in the ROI.

It would be a cunning plan though, perhaps? We can but hope. Smile

Aah turnips, in the carefree days of 2017 we used to joke about them!

Iambuffy · 02/08/2019 22:04

Waves to woman

wherearemychickens · 02/08/2019 22:08

I thought direct flights were okay (temporarily anyway)?