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Brexit
Original poster

How will this rift ever be healed?

144 replies

Bearbehind · 29/07/2019 19:54

Emotions around Brexit are always going to run high but I genuinely don’t see how the divide can ever be bridged.

Anything less than no deal and the hardcore Leavers are never going to stop talking about breaches of democracy.

No deal and all the signs say it’s going to go to rat shit.

So where do we go?

OP posts:
Tullow2016 · 30/07/2019 13:30

But Scotland are routinely told, you're smaller than us, so we make the decisions

Happens all over the World. It is called survival of the strongest and law of the Jungle. USA have flexed their military muscle for decades.

Nothingcomesforfree · 30/07/2019 13:32

How many times, on how many threads, do you need to be told to do some research? You understand nothing of NIrish history, nor of the impact the British government has had in NI/Ireland.

And this is the exact point. How far back, how much research for either side to prove their truth. I’m glad the people that do know the history - the North Irish and The Irish are in agreement on Brexit.

EarlyModernParent · 30/07/2019 13:33

Brexit is not the problem, it is a symptom. We need a new social contract, like 1945.

Peregrina · 30/07/2019 15:48

I can only think that it's going to take some decent statesmen and women to sit down and begin to heal the rift. Those are not Johnson, Priti Patel or Raab. In the fullness of time people like Rory Stewart and Starmer may be able to start the process.

It makes me think of 1930s Germany - a lot of people were happy with what Hitler was doing then - he made them feel good about themselves etc. Then we went to War, millions killed, cities and towns ruined. The country got split and the eastern border pushed west. Eventually the Berlin Wall came down and reunification with the post war borders happened. So basically it takes about 50 years, or two generations.

InTheHeatofLisbon · 30/07/2019 16:30

Tullow2016 absolutely. Scotland has a potential way out, which is something. More than others in this current position.

If the Irish and NIrish are united on Brexit, great. What conclusion have they reached?

How far back, how much research for either side to prove their truth

Only 21 years for the crux of it. Which many people seem ignorant of, even now.

Stillstrawberrywater · 30/07/2019 18:10

People making farcical comparisons between leave and Hitler is part of problem. A referendum to leave a trading and legislative block does not make a nation comparable with the nazis for Pete's sake. The same goes for people who voted remain being tagged as snowflakes. All this tagging of people who voted differently to oneself is the problem.

MeganBacon · 30/07/2019 18:30

I take some comfort from the fact that it is only on these boards that I'm aware of any real strong feeling either way. In my daily life as I go to work and talk to colleagues, talk to people from the gym each night, friends and family, people don't seem to be remotely interested or bothered either way and certainly don't speak ill of anyone who voted differently to how they did. Especially at work where they are professionals and informed, even the Remainers seem to think we'll find a way through it. So I think that the shield of anonymity on these Boards may be allowing for some stronger wording that you'll find in real life.

bellinisurge · 30/07/2019 18:44

@MeganBacon the No Dealers I know have no idea I feel contempt for them. I live in a big Leave area so I have to assume that everyone is a no Dealer. I just smile and act like nothing has happened. I have a young Leave voting family member about to stay with an older Remain voting family member. I messaged the older one to warn them not to get into it.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 30/07/2019 19:08

So I think that the shield of anonymity on these Boards may be allowing for some stronger wording that you'll find in real life.

I disagree. I think the fact nothing is certain at the moment means the peace is generally being kept.

If no deal happens and things are even half as bad as predicted, those who are detrimentally affected by choices they opposed are not going to just keep quiet.

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twofingerstoEverything · 30/07/2019 19:32

A referendum to leave a trading and legislative block does not make a nation comparable with the nazis for Pete's sake.
I don't think people have compared the referendum with the Nazis. They have, quite rightly IMO, compared some of its extremist supporters with the Nazis. If you think that's hyperbole, go on some of the Leave supporters' Facebook pages, take a look at the Football Lads Alliance etc etc.
There was an interesting programme on More 4 a couple of nights ago called 'Nazi Mega Structures' (or something similar) and it went into details of Goebbels' propaganda techniques. Some of the parallels with today's propaganda were very concerning.

Peregrina · 31/07/2019 08:25

A referendum to leave a trading and legislative block does not make a nation comparable with the nazis for Pete's sake.

I think it's my statements being called into question. To me it feels now like it must be like the late 1920s - a number of people saying, " I don't like where this is leading." Others saying, "I am Jewish but German first, I fought with honour in WW1, things will be OK for me." Others saying the 1920s equivalent of "Whatever."

At least one posting on another thread is enthusiastic about the statements made by a member of Alternative fur Deutschland, which is recognised as being a fascist party. This means that I am happy to be in the first category and say I don't like where things are leading

InTheHeatofLisbon · 31/07/2019 08:32

A referendum to leave a trading and legislative block does not make a nation comparable with the nazis for Pete's sake.

You're absolutely right, the referendum in itself isn't comparable with the Nazis.

Some of the campaign and indeed a fair proportion of the Brexit Party candidates are. Just look at their stunt in Brussels.

The last party to do that was the Nazis.

Also, the far right nationalism of the Brexiteers is comparable in many ways, pre WWII to the propaganda machine of 1930s Germany.

The distrust of immigrants, of anyone "different", the need to blame minority groups for all the ills in society is markedly comparable to the Nazis.

Denying it is rather silly imo.

jasjas1973 · 31/07/2019 08:43

Can only speak for my little part of Cornwall and working for a multinational but i don't think there is this divide across the nation or not one that wasn't there before, ukip were high in the polls long before brexit, BXP have only 3 more MEPs

Every single leaver i know, apart from one, has lost all interest in brexit, they ve moved on!!!
Its easy to read MN or the Mail and think everyone is obsessed with Brexit, most are not.

What will re ignite these divisions is a no-deal brexit where living standards drop, jobs are lost and tax payers expected to pay more for less.

timeforakinderworld · 31/07/2019 08:49

Every single leaver i know, apart from one, has lost all interest in brexit, they ve moved on!!!
I think this is true and it's even more frustrating when Brexit has turned your life upside down and it doesn't even seem to matter for those who voted for it. Angry

RedSheep73 · 31/07/2019 08:53

Do we even want to come together? personally I'm in favour of splitting the country in half, let the leavers fuck off and the sane people get on with life....there's no way I want to be reconciled with them, or have anything to do with them, I wish they would just go away.

Coppersulphate · 31/07/2019 13:30

Red sheep, why should the leavers fuck off?
Why not the remainers who seem so enamoured with the EU.

bellinisurge · 31/07/2019 13:32

No dealers can fuck off. Until I hear otherwise not all Leave supporters are No Dealers.

Coppersulphate · 31/07/2019 13:44

Bellini, the rift will never be healed with opinions like that.

MaxNormal · 31/07/2019 13:55

Why not the remainers who seem so enamoured with the EU.
No more Freedom of Movement is why. Cheers for that.

InTheHeatofLisbon · 31/07/2019 14:26

Why not the remainers who seem so enamoured with the EU.

Because I'll be fucked if I'll leave my own country on the say so of a fucking eejit.

Oh and my country voted remain.

I'm not for telling Leave voters to fuck off out of the country either though. Just out of my earshot will do nicely.

InTheHeatofLisbon · 31/07/2019 14:27

Also, we didn't cause the rift, I'm not sure why it's now our responsibility to fix it.

bellinisurge · 31/07/2019 14:28

Unless and until I am clear that 52% of the country support No Deal, I will continue to view them as a minority cult who I need not bother with.@Coppersulphate
I have suggested a Brexit that can work- NI is made a special economic zone and we put the border in the sea. This is better than WA because mainland UK is not stuck in the backstop and it is obviously better than No Deal because that is just fucking madness.

Coppersulphate · 31/07/2019 15:43

Inthe, nobody is saying you, or other remainers caused the rift.

I think it is caused because we choose not to listen to each other and accept that other people can have very differing views to ours and that this does not make them demons.

Bellini, I agree with you about NI becoming a special economic zone.
I was brought up in the northern part of the ROI with close family on either side of the border. I am a British National but with two Irish parents. I do not intend to claim Irish citizenship although I lived there for many years and a lot of my family are still there. I lost family in the Troubles and had others interned so I feel strongly about atheism Irish situation.
However, I have read the GFA and it says nothing about a border. I don't think our politicians have actually read it.

Coppersulphate · 31/07/2019 15:44

About the Irish situation!
But atheism as well.

twofingerstoEverything · 31/07/2019 15:51

I think it is caused because we choose not to listen to each other and accept that other people can have very differing views to ours and that this does not make them demons.
I'm very able to accept people have differing views, but am not able to accept a minority of the population fucking up my life and my country, which a no-deal Brexit is likely to do. I know it's only 'experts' that say this and we really should be listening to arseholes like Farage and Tim Martin, but I wish leavers would have the grace to accept that this is not a simple difference of opinion.