Westministenders: The Only Election That Matters - The Tory One

[RedToothBrush]

Fallout from the Euro Elections makes for interesting reading for the leadership hopefuls.

Its not a clear cut as some make out. There is still a case for a deal. The trouble is passing it through parliament. And there is no time to do that. Nor no will.

Any new leader's priority isn't going to be a deal. Its going to be avoiding a General Election. And thats going to be hard.

We are also realistically facing the prospect of another extension which France is likely to block leading to no deal or no deal.

Or a 2nd Referendum.

A 2nd Referendum might be the only way to avoid a General Election. And that will still have no deal on the ballot. Of that you can be sure.

Peter Foster of the Telegraph remarked this morning that in fact the only way to a deal now, might well be via no deal, because of all the routes we have exhausted through incompetence. And that will come at a very high price.

Less well off Leavers won't listen. They already think Farage is their saviour rather than the charlatan he is.

As soon as things begin to go pear-shaped after Brexit, Nige will bugger off never to be seen on these shores again!

Many prominant Brexiters have a bolthole
Some have bolted already

They'll also have followed Redwood's advice and moved their investments out of the UK,

those who haven't invested in hedge funds,
i.e. gambling that British businesses and Sterling will do BADLY after Brexit

I think it should be patently clear in light of the Bolton remarks that it was American money that paid for Brexit. They are not just seizing an opportunity to capitalise on a situation created by another player.

The US isn't even pretending not to be involved in the internal politics of sovereign states any more.

Wars for Profit don't always involve guns or bombs

Alan Duncan ( I think) on Today prog saying that one EU diplomat asked him, when he was Johnson’s deputy, what it was like “to be Boris’ pooper-scooper”.

That BBC article doesn't even quote the most damning bits of what he said, that the US looked forward to negotiating with a fully independent UK.

Of course you fucking do

Good morning, long time lurker here who really appreciates the excellent analysis and debate on this thread. I was wondering if anyone else who voted Lib Dem at the euros is now considering joining the party and voting in the leadership election. I like Jo Swinson but was concerned by what a previous poster said about her seat being far from secure and if she lost it would precipitate another leadership contest. Interested to hear anyone else’s thoughts?

I feel pretty 😡 too...
I can't believe this imperialistic stance isn't having more of an impact on leavers. It's almost like hatred of the EU is stronger than anything else.
Fwiw I know many Americans who completely disagree with brexit and their Trumpian dystopia. I know it's stating the obvious but I like to remind myself that those in power are not necessarily the US, just like Farage and the Tories aren't the UK.

The more I think about it, the more I think Labour are screwed as much as the Tories are... I just think Labour remainers and ‘one-time’ defectors to the Lib Dems are in denial about this....

Even in the unlikely event that JC said he’d support a second referendum, Labour leavers would feel completely betrayed and Labour remainers won’t believe he’s being genuine.

The defence secretary, Penny Mordaunt; the former international development secretary Priti Patel, and the hardline Brexiter Steve Baker are all still mulling over a run.** 🤮

Remarkably, this will only serve to lower the average IQ and average competence index of an already remarkably poor field.

I suppose the only consolation is that none of them will win, since the Americans are paying to elect Doris.

On the plus side, is Doris too lazy to do Brexit? There has to be a good chance of it just not happening under a Doris government.

The more I think about it, the more I think Labour are screwed as much as the Tories are... I just think Labour remainers and ‘one-time’ defectors to the Lib Dem's are in denial about this....

I agree with this. I think there was a moment, just after the EP election, when the tide might have been turned. It wasn't.

I don't know if it's just me but I am seeing a flood of new LibDem members of twitter. Hundreds in the last 2-3 weeks, more than in the last 2-3 years.

{It's almost like hatred of the EU is stronger than anything else.}
Maybe, seeing as most 'UK' people are Europeans from some time in the past, a degree of self loathing is coming out and as ex smokers tend to be more anti smoking than those who never started the reaction against Europe is greater?
There is an interesting article in the Guardian (yesterday but online) about forgetting the past. We can 'remember' 1066, but not the atrocities the UK inflicted in more recent occupation of the 'Empire'.

I feel rather about Trump interfering yet again. We are just puppets.

{On the plus side, is Doris too lazy to do Brexit? There has to be a good chance of it just not happening under a Doris government.}

But if Doris is 'under the US influence' how can he square US 'support' with remaining unless he managed a 'middle ground' to allow all that lovely chlorine chicken in?

With labour actions speak louder than words... the lukewarm statement about a pv contrasted with the rapid and cackhanded expulsion of alistair Campbell. They are making themselves look even more like stalinists. They won’t be getting my vote again for the foreseeable future

We are so screwed.

Corbyn isn't "luke warm" about a PV.
He has always opposed it
He is a longterm Lexiter

Milne makes sure he continues to oppose it
Most Labour members who voted for Corbyn didn't realise they were really voting for Milne

Channel 4 Newss@Channel4News*

"Nigel Farage is a friend of mine. Boris is a friend of mine."

Donald Trump says Farage and Johnson are "big powers" in the UK.

I can't see any Tory PM remaining - I think whoever it is will ensure we leave 31st Oct (we won't get an extension anyway by the looks of it). I think the Tory party wants it's No Deal supporting billionaire funders back from BxP and if the only way to do that is to suffer No Deal then they will. They came up with and delivered austerity so it's hardly as if they give two shiny shits about the 'people' just whether they are getting their funding. In fact if it wins back support for a snap GE just after Brexit Day...win-win for them. Then when the shit hits they are safe for another few years to spin it as nasty EU.

My dad lives in Jo Swinson's current constituency. She is indeed at major risk.

Dh and I disagree as to whether she would allow herself to be parachuted into a safer (English) seat. That would also solve the EVEL problem.

This westministenders thread has taken an interesting direction since yesterday, esp re America and the trump visit comments. For what ts worth I don’t think rDT should be saying that he prefers BJ over other candidates. The “gotcha” line of questioning from Tom Newtown Dunn which I’ve just heard on tv was disgraceful imo.

I caught a bit of C4 News last night when both Swinson and Davey were being interviewed. They both seemed reasonable and human.

Why couldn’t the Lib Dems do like the Green Party, and have 2 Co-leaders?

I think there's enough confusion in politics. The Lib dems only stand a chance if they keep a very clear stand. Co leadership is a minefield.

Btw pretty I am not an scottish independence supporter as I’m sure you know, but Jo Swinson being elected leader and then losing her seat to the SNP would be absolutely delicious! Come on SNP in East Dumbartonshire!!