I'm not afraid to admit I'm terrified

[StealthPolarBear]

I really am. It feels like we're hurtling towards no deal Brexit with a coward and idiot at the helm who couldnt organise a booze up in a brewery.
What are we heading for? Huge economic crash? War?

I just don't get the adoration with the EU

It's not about adoration, it's about what is best for the UK.... so trade, culture, technology, science, security our future is tied to europe.

Leaving the EU is a decade long project, not a 2 year back of fag packet plan.

You might be happy having a much reduced shopping basket and think Spagbol is the height of culinary cuisine but i don't & neither will the millions who work in the food and drinks industry who may will lose their jobs under your ridiculous "plans"

@BlueJag

No offence intended, but what you personally have eaten for breakfast since the referendum is completely irrelevant to my point.

People won’t buy expensive British produce, when the market is flooded with cheap alternatives.

The ERGs own economist says that a WTO Brexit would result in the necessary destruction of British farming and manufacturing.

Whether British grown produce can sustainably support the population; I’ve no idea about that.

What I do know is that it won’t matter if it can or can’t - the British farming industry simply won’t survive the market being saturated with a much cheaper product.

What makes you think Europe is our main source of food. Do they produce rice for the world? Or are they the only ones with oranges?

You claimed to have been eating British-only food for 3 years. And now you've been called out on a lie you're upset about it.

@BlueJag
Do you only take British made medicines as well?

@bluejag

Sorry, I forgot to add one thing.

We’re talking about commodities here, not luxury products.

The market treats commodities the same regardless of who they were produced by or where they were produced.

The fact that an apple is British, isn’t enough of a reason for it to sustain a higher price in that kind of marketplace.

Also, I’m not trying to be harsh or attack you, I think supporting your local farmers is admirable. It just doesn’t counter the economic damage that, with sincere respect, you don’t yet realise you’re advocating for.

I'm sure I'm going to get made fun of but I actually have a knot of anxiety in my chest all the time. Asleep or awake, whatever I'm doing.

As someone who suffers extreme anxiety regarding things I can't change, Stealth, I advise you (with kindess, not mocking), to step away from the news and from these forums.

It is not productive to constantly worry about brexit. There is very little any of us can do to change it, especially at the moment.

I don't know, I haven't got a crystal ball, but as against it as I am, I very much doubt it will be anywhere near as bad as people are saying.

@bobiana just for background my dh and I own a company that specialises on productivity, integration, lean manufacturing etc. We are fluent in French and Spanish. We've been lucky to work all over the world except for Asia.
We understand very well the challenges that represent leaving the EU but believe it or not they are keeping us small.
They are incapable of reform and they want to rule more than cooperate with member states.
The principle of the EU was great but the move towards a federal Europe with ever more integration isn't going to fly with people like me.
We don't want to be ruled or told what to do like you can't help British Steel because it's against the rules.

@KennDodd I forgot they won't sell meds to us bad Brits. I guess they don't want our money.

Ways to help British Steel could have been found any time in the last 40 or more years. With the massive increase in the availability of steel from China etc they should have looked at diversifying many years ago as it is blatantly obvious that if China or other big producers hit the market you can't really compete on MASS production.

Stealthpolarbear - that is an extreme response to a situation you have no control over and that level of stress is not good for you. I agree with pp, stay away from the news and the brexit threads. I believe Brexit will happen, it is what people voted for, but I honestly don't think it will be anywhere near as bad as people think it will be, even if it's no deal.

I know it's extreme and it's not all Brexit but Brexit is just constantly on my mind.
Staying away fro. The news isn't really practical and wondering what the hell was going on would stress me out even more.

The UK was not far off starvation during WW2
So still going down the rabbit hole claiming we will all starve to death if we leave the EU. Perhaps you should put that on a big red bus?

If the UK seriously cant feed itself then we need to sort that out now, its stupid to allow foreign countries like the EU to dictate whether or not we starve.

I wonder if these extreme remainers know what they voted for because I never hear any explanation of what it means for the future? If you love the EU so much why dont you advocate we join the Euro, Schengen, why do you keep wanting the UK to have special exemptions? Its like remainers want out of the EU but are afraid to say so.

How about remainers put together a manifesto so we know what remaining in the EU means? Will you support an EU army, a direct EU tax, enforced conversion to the Euro, allocations of unlimited refugees, greater control of the UK by unelected foreigners. And if you dont support EU changes are you happy to allow foreign countries to impose them on us? Will you just sit by and allow the EU to dictate whatever it wants?

Or maybe you would prefer the EU to be frozen and not allowed to change?

I think @Walkingdeadfangirl post gets to the nub of the problem. Most leavers refer to the EU as them, and not 'us' - and that's the fundamental problem for them and informs their complete lack of understanding of the purpose, form, and limitations of our EU.

{If the UK seriously cant feed itself then we need to sort that out now, its stupid to allow foreign countries like the EU to dictate whether or not we starve.}

The issue is the shortage of land available to grow crops or rear animals in the UK.
There are too many mouths for the land area. To be 'self sufficient' will take 1 of 3 things.

Massive ploughing up of land, although I am not sure how much more is suitable for agriculture.

Keep buying from other countries.

Eliminate between a third and a half of the UK population.

I would be OK with Shengen. The Euro is fine too. The idea of a European army is fine if it is principally a reorganisation of the army personnel that exist now.
The EP are not unelected 'foreigners' as you should have realised when voting last week or didn't you know what the voting was about?
With the elections that we have just had it is likely that the EP will change focus as it is noticeable that there are many 'change the EU and not 'leave the EU' party manifestos.

@1tisILeClerc you want us to depend on China for all our steel needs? That's crazy. The other option is to buy from Germany. They can bail out their people but we can't?
I wish the EU was the land of milk and honey but just look at how much poverty and insecurity they have.
Unemployment it's sky high.

{They can bail out their people but we can't? }
The UK government COULD have if they wanted, although as I suggested to do so is crazy in a world where other countries are doing things more economically and possibly more efficiently, although China may fail on that one.
You have to look at each European country individually to work out what the problems and solutions are.
How well do oranges olives and bananas grow in Scotland?
Leavers with their barely researched shite (if at all) bleating because Brexit hasn't happened yet although I can guarantee unless you have put your money offshore when the UK leaves you will not be happy.

Yes there are areas in the EU which are very poor, just like in the UK, so 'crowing' about that issue is hypocritical.

I don’t think anyone sees the EU as the land of milk and honey, only fanatical leavers claiming that’s what remainers think. And I think we’re doing pretty well in the poverty and inequality stakes. But the EU will seem like a utopia if we just trash our international obligations and no deal in the way that’s being put forward.

As Jas has said before, leaving should have been a ten year project with the priority being causing minimal damage to our country. This is just badly thought out carnage.

It’s impossible to “get behind” in any way at all, in the same way that it’s impossible to get behind driving your car into a brick wall at 60.

Govt bailed out BS a few weeks ago, no concern over the "rules" then, once out of the EU, we will need to impose tariffs on chinese steel, as the EU currently does, do you think a govt that was willing to allow Huawei into 5G will do that or not?

We can't make all the steel we need, much is specialised, we can't feed ourselves because we like a varied diet, much is seasonal, we would need to go to factory farming on a massive scale for chicken and pork production... people don't want this type of farming next door, nor do they want poor animal husbandry.

Once again easy simplistic ideas for highly complex issues.

I can only assume that people for Brexit are therefore against climate change? The UK cannot produce enough food to support its population (and not because the EU is holding us back. As far as I’m aware, they didn’t set the size, climate and availability of agricultural land in this country).

So we buy from non-EU countries? Fine, live with consequences of the massive carbon footprint of shipping in food from sat, South Africa, rather than the Netherlands which is on our literal doorstep. Bye bye environment.

And stronger outside the EU? The UK tried to set up trade deals with Japan. They were not interested. They did a better deal with the EU instead.

And I’ve never understood the mindset of voting Brexit to stick it to the government. By removing ourselves from the EU, therefore giving more power to our government. You know, the one you wanted to teach a lesson to. That showed ‘em!

Which is a very long winded way to say, I’m with you Stealth

Since the UK is spending shitloads of money trying to prepare to exit the EU, maybe Wakingdreadfangirl would like to explain how this will help eradicate foodbanks, improve the NHS and commence regeneration of many areas of the UK, especially since we have established that ALL of these activities are entirely under the control of the UK sovereign government. Surely after 3 years things should be improving? Why isn't it?

I do feel anxious about it on occasion but OP I really feel for you. Many people have various worries about it, some more than others. I am absolutely sure that you are not the only one. I think you need a big hug.

The positive side to pushing the Brexit deadline a bit further down the line is that the UK and other EU countries (France mainly) is getting more ready every day. There has been huge stockpiling from goods providers and I am sure that what could be stockpiled in medicines has. A very high percentage of people in the civil service have been pulled on projects for Brexit readiness, especially in departments such as transport.

I absolutely am shocked at some of the language used such as 'I will pick up a rifle' etc it is terrifying but I feel that a huge majority of people are also appalled by that kind of language. I am worried about the situation in Ireland mostly.

I think that whatever happpens common sense will prevail. in most people!

explain how this will help eradicate foodbanks, improve the NHS and commence regeneration of many areas of the UK
Well all of those things have occurred whilst we were in the EU, so leaving could well help make things better.

But I will put a bet that food banks are here forever, once people get used to a free service they will be very unlikely to give it up.

Walkingdeadfangirl
You are truly incapable of rational thought.
The standard of living has generally increased in the EU but not in the UK, It is the UK government that has fucked up, entirely independently of the EU.