I'm not afraid to admit I'm terrified

[StealthPolarBear]

I really am. It feels like we're hurtling towards no deal Brexit with a coward and idiot at the helm who couldnt organise a booze up in a brewery.
What are we heading for? Huge economic crash? War?

"So project fear is back to warmongering. I thought remainers stopped that when Cameron left?

But if its to be war then I would rather have America on our side than the EU, have they even built their army yet?"
So pathetic and hilarious at the same time.
Ever get the impression that this is what it sounds like if you are on the back foot, scrabbling for positives.

I don’t think the people using the term war-mongering know what it means! 😂

Wrong emoji!

Maybe spreading lies over social media perhaps, persuading people to vote for stupid ideas
Its the left wing spreading hate and lies on social media, anyone vaguely right wing gets banned and censored. Its very depressing that we have given up free speech and now allow Zuckerberg to control what thoughts & ideas are allowed.

But if its to be war then I would rather have America on our side than the EU, have they even built their army yet?

The nation socialist party was formed in 1919, it took a further 20 years before europe descended into war again (exc the Spanish civil war)

The USA won't be riding to anyone's rescue.

We take peace for granted at our peril and being blase about peace seems to be a Brexitier trait.

Walking, did you accuse me of war mongering? If do can you back it up please? (can't scroll, get weird red screen)

StealthPolarBear
Wasn't accusing anyone in particular of warmongering. Just skimmed through the thread and it reads like before the referendum when Project Fear was in full swing & there was talk of war breaking out if we dared to leave the EU.
Seems last nights election results have ramped up the rhetoric to stop us leaving the EU again.

Overseas staff have been employed for decade's by NHS and our standard is not same across EU either

Actually from what i remember from my NHS management days the EU and UK had standardised training and equivalent qualifications to enable HCPs to work in different countries.

I might be wrong though

I’ve have had lots and lots and lots of treatment on the NHS and most of it has been carried out by British or none EU practitioners.

I'm desperate to leave the EU and I've tried in the best of my abilities to read as much as possible about the consequences of leaving. All I can say is that based on results the EU is underperforming. Many members are suffering great economic distress. Greece specially suffers enormous unemployment. When you examine the individual economies it's hard to justify staying in the EU.
Think about British Steel we can save it but the EU unfair competition stops us from bailing them out but has bailed out German Steel industry. Japanese car manufacturers have cero tariffs with the EU no need for European factories.
For me the big item is independence from the ECJ, fiscal and custom union as we can buy goods cheaper elsewhere.
Do your own research and you'll see we are a strong economy compared to other EU countries.

@BlueJag

It’s not as simple as “we can buy goods cheaper elsewhere”.

Yes. We can buy fruit and veg from countries where they’re farmed by children who are paid 5 pence a week. Yes it’ll be cheaper, and yes it’ll still taste like a banana.

But what do you think is going to happen to our own farming industry and the thousands upon thousands of jobs that depend on it when the market is flooded with cheap produce?

Gone. Dead. They won’t be able to compete.

Rich people with the means to import a metric tonne of said cheap produce produced by modern day slaves will laugh their way to the bank.

Ordinary people in the food production industry, not so much...

Unless you can find a way to detach the UK from bedrock & tow it around the world with tug boats, our fortunes will always be intertwined with our European neighbours. World War 2 still dragged us in.

All countries trade most with their nearest neighbours.

{Seems last nights election results have ramped up the rhetoric to stop us leaving the EU again.}
The EU is not trying to stop the UK leaving.
It has always expressed the opinion that it would LIKE the UK to remain, but respect the decision. (speeches by Mr Barnier).
What the EU will not allow is the UK to damage any of the founding principles of the EU, so it will not entertain any 'side deals' or any further preferential treatment. The UK already has better terms than many other countries, probably a strong source of resentment, but principally Germany and France, probably several others think (or thought) it worthwhile for the UK to be on board.
To think of the EU in monetary terms only is missing much of the point, it is a grouping of similarly minded countries, many of which would suffer terribly by being isolated. It is bringing stability and gradual prosperity to the countries in the East, that have previously been under Russian rule. IIRC Angela Merkel is from East Germany and understands what it was like, as indeed other EU leaders.
Everyone in the world wants stability, safety, enough to eat and decent healthcare, and this is the founding principle of the EU. Unfortunately these things 'cost' so financial controls are necessary to get a degree of equality. The natural resources available to each member are different and as a result for example Greece or Portugal can never compete 'like for like' with Germany or the UK. It may be that interesting projects could be developed to alter the balance. The elderly from Northern climes spending parts of the winter months in Southern Europe would certainly help global climate by not having to heat so many buildings in winter. All manner of things COULD be done.

OK thanks walking. A couple of people have called me a war mongerer. Which just makes no sense and actually makes me really annoyed

War monger
Argh
Trying to type be for Red page of doom

My father came to the UK as a refugee in the seventies, having been imprisoned and tortured in his home country and seen many of his friends die.

I am strongly remain and I am worried about brexit, but when legacy like that exists in your family you tend to be more robust about crises.

Most people in the UK have never had to face real problems (as in societal problems) like that, so they over hype everything.

Meh I'm Italian and I feel just fine. Nobody is sending me home anytime soon.

@bobiana you know I've been able to live on British food only since the referendum. We buy local and in season. We could eat food from other parts of the world but buying British keeps jobs.
We do everything in our power to promote Britain.
We don't need the EU to survive. I would have preferred if we've been able to reform but that's impossible.
I hate the direction towards a federal Europe and full integration. What's next monetary alignment? No thank you.

{What's next monetary alignment?}
There is an exemption for this and in any case I am not sure the UK actually meets the requirements.

While you may have been able to eat only UK sourced food the issue is that there is not sufficient quantity to feed the whole of the UK on 'home' grown produce and this has been the case for a couple of hundred years. The UK was not far off starvation during WW2 when the Uboats were sinking many of the supply ships from the USA. This was when the public were urged to 'dig for victory'.

I've been able to live on British food only since the referendum. We buy local and in season

If you are able to do this, it's because other people buy food from abroad. The U.K. is far from self sufficient.

However I also think that you are either lying or kidding yourself, because many British "staples" are not produced in the U.K. Have you really not eaten a portion of rice or drunk a glass of orange juice in three years?

@Mistigri , quite.

Stealth I hear you.
And Tbh, I think most people/MPs actually agree with you re No Deal and how catastrophic this will be for the country. I feel for people like you, the friends that are just as scared as you. For my own (british) teenage children that might be faced with years for hardship and political turmoil.

As an EU citizen, the fact I can leave and settle somewhere else is bittersweet. Because in the process, I have lost what was MY country too, the U.K. Not feeling welcome anymore has been hard to process tbh. And yes my own dcs being dual national would be able to move away too. But is it fair that they might have to leave the only country they’ve ever known. Not by choice.

If we don’t Brexit on Halloween I’m just as worried, I wouldn’t trust any of those Brexit voters not to vote Farage into number 10. That would be an unmitigated disaster. Basically, we’re fucked.

@Mistigri I can live very well without many products if necessary. What makes you think Europe is our main source of food. Do they produce rice for the world? Or are they the only ones with oranges?
If we need to be more self sufficient I'll encourage that. Even if our diet isn't as diverse.
I just don't get the adoration with the EU.

BlueJag
There is not enough land for the number of mouths that need feeding in the UK. that is simple mathematics.

{I just don't get the adoration with the EU.}
I would suggest visiting places inn the EU because it is really very pleasant, but on the other hand your attitude does not sit well, so please stay at home and let others enjoy it.