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Brexit

Westminstenders: A fully functioning government?

960 replies

RedToothBrush · 10/05/2019 23:50

It's been a month since parliament voting on anything.

The staggering reality of May's premiership is that government has ceased to function. We are stuck not just on Brexit but every other issue, such is the weakness of May's authority.

It begs the question of how long this is tolerable by all sides of the Conservative Civil War?

May being unable to bring anything forward means no deal is probably as inevitable as if a hardliner was PM.

There was talk of May / Corbyn reaching a fudge to get a deal via the backdoor WAB (Withdrawal Agreement Implimentation Bill) as it was politically impossible for them to be seen doing a deal any other way. However news today is that despite pressure from the 1922 Committee to bring it forward, May has slapped just a one line whip on it, meaning it will go precisely no where.

The polling for the European elections is perhaps more favourable to Labour than they might have feared after last weeks local election disaster so the mutual interest for Corbyn to move forward in anyway has already gone. Seeing the Tories be humiliated at the ballot box is too much of a temptation.

The phrase about Shit Creek only gets more apt.

All that is happening is every member of the Tory Party is lining up to take part in a leadership contest. It's harder to think of a Tory who isn't considering standing. It's not just the likes of Johnson, Gove, Rudd and Hunt. It's also the likes of Johnny Mercer and Graham Brady queuing not so patiently.

And its getting harder to argue that May is better as PM than the possibility of a right right candidate, because of the paralysis. Though as Rudd rightly points out, such a PM who wanted to actively have no deal as a policy, would struggle to win a majority in the HoC for that all important Queens Speech vote - every bit as much as May. Unless they were to somehow decide they could abuse the power of the executive and ignore parliament - a feat May has repeatedly attempted but ultimately failed at.

All everything feels, is a massive sense of merely delaying the inevitable.

Remain? Hard to see how under any Tory. A Deal? Hard to see what it might be and how there will be a Parliamentary majority. A PV? Well that still has to get through parliament and needs to be arranged smartish. And might not resolve the Irish border issue if the vote goes 'the wrong way' A General Election? That still seems to be a distinct possibility. But with the seeming resurrection of the LDs that's one the Tories will be desperate to avoid. Not that Corbyn is likely to succeed either. And of course there is now the Spectre of the Turquoise Arrows lurking. The crushing of the purple pound notes feels a hollow and distinct success.

It feels like we are waiting for the political sky to fall in in some sort of never ending Brexit Purgotory.

The cataclysmic event will occur at some point. It has to. But for now, it feels that there is nothing but waiting and waiting to be done.

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1tisILeClerc · 12/05/2019 09:39

From the Guardian comments:

[https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/may/08/britain-huawei-general-electric-company-thatcherism].
While the excitement of Brexit is one thing, this (and similar) is what will drive the final nails in the coffin, and it is difficult to see how the UK can recover from it.
The family silver has been sold.

lonelyplanetmum · 12/05/2019 09:42

Could the Brexit party actually form a valid government?

Nope Of course it couldn't. The Faragit leader was always a one trick pony. The peeps haven't noticed but he has even been shifting on the one trick he stood for.

He's wriggled from Norway - to no deal - to 'this fight isn't about the EU'.There are clear signs he's wriggling away from relinquishing EU membership.But he has no policy on anything else. He'd seek closeness to Donnie - who may not be in power much longer anyway.

When your team consists of Ann Widdecombe and Neil Hamilton it's not cabinet forming is it? Its like carry on politics. I suppose there could be a govt if the ERG defected to join the Faragit party- but I can't see egos allowing for that. (What news of t'ERG - haven't they been quieter lately? Any internecine strife whilst succession planning goes on there? Sigh.)

RedToothBrush · 12/05/2019 10:01

He'd seek closeness to Donnie - who may not be in power much longer anyway.

If you think this, you aren't paying attention. Donnie isn't going anywhere.

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Peregrina · 12/05/2019 10:03

Donnie can only do another six years. We might get another Republican Horror then, but at least they will be proper politicians who know some of the rules.

RedToothBrush · 12/05/2019 10:05

Donnie can only do another 6 years under the current rules. a) rules can be changed b) rules can be broken c) national emergencies can screw every thing.

Read the manual on 'how to become a dictator'

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1tisILeClerc · 12/05/2019 10:06

{If you think this, you aren't paying attention. Donnie isn't going anywhere.}
And worse, he is stirring up shit to make a 'free UK' let loose on the open stage an exceedingly dangerous prospect.
'Piggy in the middle' between Trump and China is not a good place to be.

RedToothBrush · 12/05/2019 10:18

He retweeted a tweet by someone suggesting his current term should be extended by two years. Its clear he thinks the idea is legitimate and would consider trying to do it if possible

Jerry Falwell @ jerryfalwelljr
After the best week ever for @realDonaldTrump - no obstruction, no collusion, NYT admits @BarackObama did spy on his campaign, & the economy is soaring. I now support reparations-Trump should have 2 yrs added to his 1st term as pay back for time stolen by this corrupt failed coup

www.dailydot.com/layer8/trump-two-more-years-retweet-falwell/?amp&tw=dd&__twitter_impression=true
Trump’s ‘2 years added’ retweet incites panic over president not leaving office

The very inciteful Sarah Kendzior had been talking about it being a risk for a long time. Then he did that.

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DGRossetti · 12/05/2019 10:29

To get a third term Donnie would required the same changes to the constitution that would be needed to control gun sales and ownership.

Worth bearing in mind when next months high school massacre is being reported.

CrunchyCarrot · 12/05/2019 10:37

Hahaha well just listened to Farage on the Andrew Marr show. He got quite steamed up that the BBC is 'in denial' and 'not interested' in what's going on with his party right now, as Marr kept grilling him on his previous remarks from a couple of years ago and how he's saying the opposite now.

Farage just wants to talk about 'betrayal' and 'democracy' - failure of Tories/Lab to keep referendum promise. When asked about what the Brexit party would do to address climate change, he said putting thousands out of work over just 2% reduction globally in carbon emissions wasn't worth it. Really very hard to get anything much out of him at all on anything the Brexit party would actually do in office.

Sigh. Disastrous.

prettybird · 12/05/2019 10:51

he said putting thousands out of work over just 2% reduction globally in carbon emissions wasn't worth it

Not that he cares, but the millions, if not billions, that will suffer as a result of climate change will have a different view Angry - unless they're dead, in which case they don't matter in the Git's view of the world Sad And the ones affected are poor and mostly brown skinned so even less important Angry

His (and our) children may have a different view. His attitudes won't be forgiven. Angry

(BTW: another reason for Scottish independence as we'll have more useable land left if/when the ice caps melt Wink)

lonelyplanetmum · 12/05/2019 11:18

If you think this, you aren't paying attention. Donnie isn't going anywhere

I meant health wise ? DT doesn't look in great shape to me?

The Faragit's ability to bend POTUS's ear seems largely personal. Surely a replacement President would be less likely to entertain a maverick (scene of a car accident leaver) radio presenter/ MEP?
A new president may be more conventional and so prioritise relationships with cabinet members rather than a renegade mate of his predecessor.

lonelyplanetmum · 12/05/2019 11:30

Maybe I'm just innocent or naive or something.. I just can't believe that any serious international statesperson (other than Trump) could possibility treat that (ex ?) radio presenter with any credibility.

prettybird · 12/05/2019 11:44

.... especially when we are no longer the conduit into the world's largest trading bloc Hmm and the UK reverts to its geographic reality of a relatively small island with few natural resources (especially if Scotland finally achieves its independence Wink) off the North West coast of the world's largest trading bloc Hmm

Look at the history of Argentina and, more recently, Venezuela to see how easy it is to plummet down the GDP rankings Sad

DGRossetti · 12/05/2019 12:00

DW is just doing a YouGov survey as we speak.

One of the sections requires an answer about political statements to be given in less than 10s.

DW eyes is "well fucked" (her term) and that isn't going to happen. Of course there's no mechanism for YouGov to know this (casual ableism, like casual sexism, racism and ageism is a thing).

So bear in mind YouGov surveys may not be quite as inclusive as they seem. Something the political heavyweights that must skim forums like this would do as well to bear in mind.

ContinuityError · 12/05/2019 12:07

I meant health wise ? DT doesn't look in great shape to me?

Definitely expanding in the waistline area - and I did hear that his latest medical has him expanding height wise too, just to keep his BMI in the “overweight” category rather than “obese” one Smile

CrunchyCarrot · 12/05/2019 12:24

Ah here we are, if you can bear it, Farage's interview on Marr:

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/nigel-farage-andrew-marr-show-brexit-party-polls-interview-bbc-a8910206.html

prettybird · 12/05/2019 12:35

My last non-prize draw survey from YouGov was on 30 April Hmm

Is there something about my firm political views that they don't like? Wink or it could be that I'm close to "earning" my £50 Wink

Peregrina · 12/05/2019 12:51

My first thought on hearing that if Farage got into power he would make St George's Day a Bank Holiday, was that unless the same happened for St Davids Day & St Andrews Day he could kiss any notion of a United Kingdom goodbye - especially Scotland.

Clavinova · 12/05/2019 13:04

Icantreachthepretzels
That's fine - you go ahead and vote for Change UK - they could do with some help looking at those poll results. Remainers should spread the love and vote Change UK. Wink

Ellie56 · 12/05/2019 13:07

Oh God Farage is doing far too well in the opinion polls for my liking. Why are so many people listening to his shit?

Songsofexperience · 12/05/2019 13:20

@peregrina
I do believe St Andrew's Day is a bank holiday in Scotland.
I can't see the Scots celebrating St George's though, even with an extra free holiday!

Songsofexperience · 12/05/2019 13:25

I frankly despair of Labour. Why do they want to compete with Farage for the leave vote? They're not going to win that battle. Also why do they insist on doing the Tories' job?

Gardiner in the Guardian this morning on being asked if Labour was a pro Brexit party:

Asked if his views showed Labour was now an officially pro-Brexit party, Gardiner said the bulk of its MPs had backed remain in 2016. “But when that referendum came in, we said, ‘Look, we made you a promise that what you decided is what we would do’,”

Note the use of 'we'. It was the Tories who said that, not aware Labour were the ones calling the ref.

DGRossetti · 12/05/2019 13:30

Meanwhile (not sure where MN is hiding any discssion on this Hmm) an interesting (but hardly novel) approach to protest in GA, USA...

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-48242766

Actress and #MeToo activist Alyssa Milano has urged women to take part in a "sex strike" to protest against a new abortion law in the state of Georgia.

"Until women have legal control over our own bodies we just cannot risk pregnancy," she tweeted.

(contd)

I wonder how political discourse in the UK would be affected if women took a similar approach ? Or would the first response be to re-legalise marital rape as a "right" of marriage ?

dreichuplands · 12/05/2019 13:32

Farage has learned well while in the USA, this is the same populist nonsense we have here.
Labour should be pouring all of their fire on this, the destruction of the NHS, the climate change avoidance and the lack of any plan.
They are making this far too easy for him.
I really worry for the UK.

prettybird · 12/05/2019 13:32

Looks like St Andrews Day is only sort of a Bank Holiday in Scotland Confused - it's been designated a bank holiday but neither banks nor firms have to actually offer it as a holiday Confused

I don't remember schools being off for it either. Anyway, who wants a holiday in the middle of winter other than Christmas and New Year Wink

www.gov.scot/publications/bank-holidays/

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