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Brexit

Westminstenders: A False Sense of Security

995 replies

RedToothBrush · 12/04/2019 22:34

The new exit date, unless we agree a deal sooner, is the 31st October.

It seems ages away, but its runs the risk of a false sense of security too.

The first deadline is May 22nd. The Conservative Party would dearly like to avoid European Elections. They are already liable to face wipe out in the early May local elections, as the party was at its peak in 2015 under Cameron when there were last elections.

The EU elections have the added danger of proportional representation meaning UKIP and The Brexit Party could win seats from them. This is despite polling suggesting that Ukip and the Brexit Party are unlikely to reach the high watermark of 2015 and this could lead to fewer UKIP style MEPs this time round.

The liklihood of a deal by 22nd May is low though. Especially given how well Tory - Labour talks are going. The potential for a deal seems remote in the next few weeks.

The next deadline falls on 30th June. If we do have EU elections, the next target for the Tory Party is the end of June to get a deal before the newly elected MEPs can take their seats. However if the goal is unachievable before EU elections, it seems unlikely that agreement will be found in the next 30 days unless there is a major change of heart amongst the hardcore ERG and the DUP. Labour will want to see the Tories humiliated too much.

May who says she will go, will face another wave of pressure to resign during May and June. Messages out of No10, though not May herself, had indicated an exit around 22nd May on the condition a deal was done. Crafty as ever, what May actually said was she would stay on until we reached the second stage of Brexit and had effectively left. This now falls as late as Oct 31st, thus killing plans for a summer Tory leader election.

Once we get past June though, time for a deal, any deal starts to become very limited. Parliament only sits until mid July. Here May hits another problem. The two year parliamentary session ends. There has been talk of it being extended but the DUP have firmly said no to this.

This means when parliament is due to return in September we have an issue. To start a new session May will need a majority to pass a Queens Speech. If the DUP and Hardline ERGers withdraw support in protest at May still being PM what happens? Can May win support from elsewhere. It seems unlikely.

At this point the question of a General Election looms large. And we only have six weeks from then before we exit the EU. If a GE is triggered then, the risk of no deal is extremely high, which might encourage some to support May from across the aisle to prevent parliament from being shut and losing those crucial six weeks.

The danger over the next few weeks, is there is a false sense of there being lots of time left. The reality is our real deadline might be in effect the end of the parliamentary session in mid July. After that all bets are off.

The date of 31st October isn't the one you should keep your eyes on.

OP posts:
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Littlebelina · 15/04/2019 08:20

Yikes sos, I mainly lurk on these threads but couldn't pass by without saying I hope you dgd recovers quicklyFlowers

Iambuffy · 15/04/2019 08:22

My cousins dd had itp
Dr at same age as your gd
It was a terrifying time for her and her family and a splenectomy was mooted but she is fine now and at uni.
X

woman19 · 15/04/2019 09:13

Flowers sos hoping today brings better news.

@davidallengreen
Those who do not think the rising threats of political violence, strident nationalism, attempts to bypass parliamentary institutions and increasing nastiness towards minorities do not indicate the beginning of a turn towards fascism must ask themselves...

...what would?
The way fascism manifested itself in the 1920s and 1930s was not the only way it can manifest itself.

Fascism does not only exist in black and white photos and Pathe news reels.

The nastiness adapts to new promising environments.

Think, for example, of the independent institutions which extreme "will of the people" Brexiters have sought to trash:

  • parliamentary "saboteurs"
  • judicial "enemies of the people"
  • civil service "traitors"

Even demanding letters to universities.

This cannot be healthy.

There is no value whatsoever in "taking back control" if the cost of Brexit is to trash the very domestic institutions - parliament, judiciary, civil service - which we would require to function more than ever outside the EU.

DAG, is yet another commentator who was orginally in favour of leaving the EU

Moderate commentators like Michael Hesseltine and Margaret Becket are now calling this out

Molly Cato is using the hashtag #ResistFascism

For all their charm and forbearance, Tusk and Verhofstadt know exactly what the british electorate are facing

I do respect those politicians who have the courage to do this, and wonder about those who don't

All including, 18-24 and EU/UK need to register to vote, and there is a pressing need to get the vote out

www.gov.uk/register-to-vote
www.yourvotematters.co.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/255197/EU-citizen-European-Parliament-voter-registration-form-English.pdf
www.gov.uk/get-on-electoral-register

North of Ireland
www.eoni.org.uk/Utility/Contact-Us

woman19 · 15/04/2019 09:38

It's such an excellent thread, here's the end of it.

@davidallengreen
Look at the casual trashing of human rights law and legal aid.

The primary purposes of human rights law and legal aid is to support the individual against the coercive power of law.

Without them an individual is powerless in the last resort against the

And look at the routine casual insults and nastiness regarding Jewish people, Muslims, trans people.

Attacks on LGBT education.

And recall the first books to be burned: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institut_f%C3%BCr_Sexualwissenschaft#Nazi_era

Lots of "others" to be de-humanised, despised, mocked.

Look at all this - the attacks on independent institutions, the attacks on legal aid and human rights law, the attacks on the "easy" targets of minorities, and ask yourself...

...what would a rise of fascism not look like in 2019?

/ends

dontcallmelen · 15/04/2019 09:57

sos truly hope dgd is a little better today & has a speedy recovery 💐

TatianaLarina · 15/04/2019 10:15

Sorry to hear about your gd, Sos. Flowers

BlueEyeshadow · 15/04/2019 10:33

Flowers Sos and love to you and dgd

Sostenueto · 15/04/2019 10:54

Thank you all for your concerns and support.. It is truly overwhelming the love and concern on this thread. You are all such lovely people and I feel so lucky to have all your support. In fact I'm crying at the mo because of it.
I'm off to hospital to relieve my dd. Dgd can't clean her teeth and ended up with blood everywhere this morning so have gone out to buy supply of mouthwash! I have orders to take her work in and laptop so this afternoon we can watch Game of Thrones together while her mum goes home to sleep. She is black and blue with bruises and ( dgd) but thank goodness no internal bleeding. Consultant is seek g her at the mo. Will keep u all informed. Thank you once again for concern and support it is well appreciated. Keep well all of you x

OublietteBravo · 15/04/2019 11:11

Thinking of you and your DD and DGD Sos Flowers.

MaudBaileysGreenTurban · 15/04/2019 11:17

sos, sorry to hear your news - sending good wishes to you and your dgd Flowers

magimedi · 15/04/2019 11:19

Seeing as your watching Game of Thrones, Sos (& for everyone else) you might like this cartoon from today's Times:

Westminstenders: A False Sense of Security
PostNotInHaste · 15/04/2019 11:23

So sorry to hear about your Granddaughter SOS Hope there is some some positive news very soon Flowers

Littlespaces · 15/04/2019 11:29

Wishing your gd speedy recovery sos. Flowers

StripeyChina · 15/04/2019 11:31

Also sending good thoughts towards you and your gdd SOS

CrunchyCarrot · 15/04/2019 11:54

Thinking of you Sos and your gd, wishing her all the best for a speedy recovery. Flowers

TheMShip · 15/04/2019 12:06

Fx for you and your family Sostenuto.

Iambuffy · 15/04/2019 12:22

Ds1 and I will be watching GofT later and you and dgd will be in my thoughts x

It’s not much but I hope the thought of so many good wishes zooming your way helps a little x

yolofish · 15/04/2019 12:52

everything xd for you and dgd sos

vanitythynameisnotwoman · 15/04/2019 12:59

Sos how scary - hope your bright and much loved dgd recovers quickly and the cause is not sinister. Flowers for you and DD/DGD. Am glad you have been well enough for the Cambridge trip and to be sat in the hospital.

I'm not expecting to get anywhere, but I did it! I sent my Tiggers application in. It's madness when the Observer y'day reported Stephen Dorrell and some other former MP wanting to stand why they would want me with my limitations etc but... I've had a go.

I was absolutely applauding Lammy too. He's been measured but decisive on twitter and he came over well in the clips from Marr. The voting intentions are all over the show!

Iambuffy · 15/04/2019 13:00

vanity yay!!

borntobequiet · 15/04/2019 13:07

Best wishes to you and your family, Sostenueto.

1tisILeClerc · 15/04/2019 13:22

Flowers to SOS
Having had a UK 'news free' few days I was attempting to explain Brexit to some Dutch friends, who have an interesting 'concerned' view, as they can see parallels in the Netherlands, although it would be very unlikely their politicians would take the insanity so far but far right agitation and economic hits are not good. The French news last night suggesting that Mr Macron is only a point or two 'ahead' of the Nationalist party is concerning too, although apparently when it gets to serious voting the Nationalists don't do as well as predictions.

havingtochangeusernameagain · 15/04/2019 13:27

So now the UK is in trouble for voting for the new Copyright Directive. Apparently if it hadn't, it wouldn't have got through.

So we'd voted against, we'd have been criticised as obstructing the EU's work, but because we voted in favour we're criticised too.

Clearly the Copyright Directive is A Bad Thing. Except that I am a member of the Society of Authors, which thinks it is a good thing. Also Boris thinks it's a bad thing, so it can't be that bad.

But it illustrates how the UK can't win during this limbo six months.

dontcallmelen · 15/04/2019 13:35

vanity yeahy well done👍🏼

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