Westminstenders: The May Compromise

[RedToothBrush]

After a marathon cabinet meeting, which no one seems to have resigned from, May has had another podium moment.

This time instead of blaming everyone but herself, she's gone for the 'let's compromise approach' to Corbyn.

This comes after Nick Boles crossed the floor saying his side wasn't prepared to compromise on anything after May secretly whipped on a 'free' vote against him.

May also said she we needed more of an extension to the 22nd May but without promise of EU elections this means No Deal inevitable if May can't pass the WA by then. Provided EU allow an extension until then without EU elections.

She also hinted at respecting a majority idea over indicative votes, if she and Corbyn fail to agree - remembering she tried successfully to sabotage that last night.

Already many are saying this is a trap to ensnare others into the mess that is Brexit in the blame game. With no deal ultimately the end goal.

The idea that May can find a compromise with Corbyn seems a fantasy.

And the EU might have every reason to refuse a longer extension under the circumstances.

For May to compromise she surely would have to break the Tories to do it as Labour will only go for a soft option which is unacceptable to the ERG. Unless her idea of compromise is simply its the WA or No deal which it seems hard to conceive Labour going near with the realistic prospect of the next PM being a hardliner.

All in all it seems more likely to be a framing exercise in damage limitation rather than something which has more substance and a realistic prospect of working. And if that's really the case, it certainly would explain why no one's resigned yet.

Indicative Votes 3 and a pretty dodgy Cooper Amendment designed to be a last ditch attempt to prevent no deal are both scheduled.

Its desparation stakes and the EU more or less have us down as a failed state. And the pro Brexit bombs don't really add much optimist to the mood.

Literally nothing that either can agree to which achieves 22 May deadline. If they don't achieve the deadline then choice becomes Revoke vs No Deal a la Joanna Cherry.

Given there are 170 Tory No Dealers plus a few who baulk at even Customs Union TM loses 200+ votes if satisfies JC's 6 tests. Unlikely he can deliver 200+ compensating votes even if fulfils 6 tests without PV. Anyone outside PLP has too much to lose by dropping PV demand - see SNP opposing all but Revoke now.

Tories all hopping mad TM just admitted her Tory Govt is so incompetent they need HELP from JC. Vote Tory get JC is somewhat difficult when you have been running "Fear of JC" as central anti-Labour message for 4 years.

I wonder how long the soldier pictures have been sitting around waiting for the perfect detonation moment?

Surprised been a resignation. Kind of thought they would all wait till they saw if they could blame JC for unreasonableness before coalescing. Suggests Tory voters are really really really not happy if distancing this soon.

Do male MPs receive similar
I posted up thread that journalist James Chapman has had to move out of his home due to death threats. I know that Dominic Grieve has been abused verbally at the street stall in Beaconsfield. Clearly Corbyn too.
Awful news about the army, when there are so many excellent ex and current British military in the pro EU movement.

The neo nazi member of NA, who threatened Rosie Cooper, was also promoting unprintable violent threats against Jewish children too.

This thread, promoting a rally at which NA and other proscribed groups were in attendance, is still up.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3545638-To-invite-all-Mumsnetters-to-the-Brexit-Rally-in-Parliament-Square-tomorrow-afternoon-evening?pg=32

I'm not sure I'd ever get over something like that and be able to talk about it

I think all of them under death threats feel exactly the same terror that any of us would, especially as one of their Pro EU Labour Women friends and colleagues has already been assassinated.

None of this is normal.

Jack Maidment @jrmaidment
Stephen Barclay confirms a second Brexit referendum is now an option.

Tells MPs: “I don’t think we should have a second referendum because it takes us back to square one, is my personal view, but the Prime Minister will have discussions and we will see where they lead.”

Perhaps I'll write to JC and ask him to ensure that whatever he agrees with TM meets his six tests, especially the one that says the exact same benefits. I will therefore expect to retain my freedom of movement as a benefit I currently have.

While not defending the use of any particular persons image as a target you have to bear in mind that the army are expected to do things without question and with split second decision making, much of which 'usual' society couldn't even contemplate. They are necessarily in a 'bubble' of their own, almost a parallel universe. They are doing the unthinkable on our behalf. Those who deal with death and catastrophic circumstances seem to develop a 'humour' as a preservation mechanism, some of which those who don't encounter these circumstances may regard as 'unpleasant'. The fact that the government don't put enough effort into 'demilitarising' soldiers when they are demobbed is despicable.

Interesting calculations there howabout. Labour have 245 currently I believe so lots of Labour members would have to vote in line with their manifesto commitment in order to get a deal through.

PMK.

Anyone else not give a flying fuck if Boris Johnson is 'disappointed'?

This will upset the DUP no end.
They are not a reasonable bunch at the best of times ( from what I've heard and seen)
Compromise is such a lovely way to live but not everyone can do it.

1tis would the "humour" defence work if it had been TM or the Queen they were firing at? Or how about a shooting gallery reenacting Bloody Sunday?

I get they need humour but because of the split second decisions they also need absolute intuitive acceptance of where the line is. In the words of Joey from Friends they are so far over it, they have no idea where it is.

Manifesto commitments have no legal status Louise.
British Law.

I bet Boris is gutted that he has backed the wrong horse. I bet he's wishing he was fighting for a PV right now.

I've seen a few comments that if that solider video had appeared in other times there would have been a ministerial resignation.

Who is the minister who would be responsible.

Alex Sobel @alexsobel
I’ve submitted this Parliamentary Question to @GavinWilliamson ‘To ask the Secretary of State for Defence what steps he has taken to investigate a video circulating on social media that depicts British soldiers using a picture of the Leader of the Opposition as target practice.’

So an Urgent Question has been tabled and its the responsibility of Gavin Williamson.

And yes I do wonder about timing then. Williamson's usefulness owes a lot to two things: his relationship with the DUP and how he had dirt on others as a whip.

He's now one of the most vocal for no deal.

Those who deal with death and catastrophic circumstances seem to develop a 'humour' as a preservation mechanism, some of which those who don't encounter these circumstances may regard as 'unpleasant'.

Humour doesn't get you out of a court martial for unprofessional conduct.

The fact that the government don't put enough effort into 'demilitarising' soldiers when they are demobbed is despicable.

And completely deliberate, in my opinion ....

If you can ignore the provenance (and find it ) Grub Smith did a fascinating 2-part documentary (over 15 years ago) about the process of making a human a killing machine. The only glimmer of cheer from it was that all evidence available suggests that humans naturally are incredibly averse to killing. The multi-rammed rifle found beside dead soldiers in the era of musket warfare being a poignant example.

Louise for lots of them the manifesto commitment now implies the PV from Conference. (Lots also take the opposite view).

In any event I don't see how PLP could justify keeping Tory Govt on the road by delivering more votes for them than the Tory backbenches. If they want a Labour Brexit then surely they want a long delay and a GE to get a Labour Govt to deliver it?

www.scotsman.com/news/politics/nicola-sturgeon-to-meet-theresa-may-for-urgent-brexit-talks-1-4900352/amp?__twitter_impression=true
Nicola Sturgeon to meet Theresa May for urgent Brexit talks

Do you remember how Sturgeon was one of the very first people May talked to when she became PM? And it rapidly went downhill from there?

Nicola Sturgeon to meet Theresa May for urgent Brexit talks

because May wants to play the SNP against Labour to get them both onside. Same tactic with ERG and DUP ....

Timetable now (from Evening Telegraph)

Is there anything missing from this timetable?

It just gets more and more confusing.

He needs his wits about him today.

He needs Starmer and Watson about him today.

Does anyone know if their meeting will include others?

If they want a Labour Brexit then surely they want a long delay and a GE to get a Labour Govt to deliver it

70+% of Labour membership want remain. Labour leavers are conflating tory brexit with the crash out threat, which is losing the brexit even more ground in Labour.

If May and other brexiters had played her cards more carefully, we would have left the EU on Friday.

But she and they appear to at least be losing their 'brexit'.

Same tactic with ERG and DUP
But SNP have had benefits of a Scottish education.

Not going to happen DGR. Taken "Tartan Tories" 40 years to live down booting out Labour and letting in Thatcher. Besides which no mileage for NS when the Revoke prize is in sight.

Darren Grimes tweet: A coalition of chaos with Jeremy Corbyn and Nicola Sturgeon.

Thanks howabout. If lots of them think that they are wrong on the facts. Labour Party Conference may have decided to back a second referendum, making this Labour Party policy. The manifesto on which they stood in 2017 commits the party to accept the referendum result.

Agree on your second point about Labour wanting a GE, of course they would.

Quite a natty little time line from the Torygraph - do you think the layout symbolises a U turn? If only.

Is there anything missing from this timetable?

A complete omission to note that any extension is decided by the EU, not the UK.

I'm assuming thread regulars aren't taking any extension for granted ?

As far as I can tell, the default response would be "NO", unless the UK has a bloody good plan - and holds EP elections.