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Brexit
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Westminstenders: For Whom the Bell Tolls

980 replies

RedToothBrush · 01/04/2019 22:59

Although another round of Indicative Votes is scheduled, arguably the chance for a soft Brexit has gone for two reasons.

Parliament was unable to show a majority because those on the opposition benches were too busy saying 'I want this but only on these terms' or still being too unwilling to compromise. Thus the opportunity and point for a third round starts to look weak.

The second is that Tory MPs were resolute in an opposition to a soft Brexit.

Unless May decides to be the next Robert Peel and go for a soft Brexit on the back of opposition vote its not going to happen.

This leaves May's deal as it stands or no deal.

May seems to have actually lost a few supporters of her deal since Friday, and given the performance of the opposition tonight and the prospect of round 3 of indicative votes they will still be unwilling to go for May's deal.

Which leaves no deal.

There is talk of a managed no deal. There is no such thing. The EU plan for that is essentially to push us into the deal in order to get a trading relationship.

And that will push us closer to the us. Which is what many torys want. And what polling seems to suggest they will have surprising support for.

Sorry folks but it don't look great tonight.

The opposition benches may look back on tonight and think they screwed it. I hope I'm wrong. But I fear tonight might have sealed our fate.

Tomorrow may has a 5hr cabinet. And a secret document dmfor the cabinet to study first.

It's going to get bumpy from here on in...

OP posts:
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ApocalypseLaterOn · 02/04/2019 12:51

BornToBeQuiet I have sent you a PM

horseshit · 02/04/2019 12:54

Lonely, I’ll admit I haven’t lived here long enough to make an educated guess on whose head the angry mob would like to see on a spike. However, I’m German and so naturally distrust that a country will blame the right people for the mess it’s in.

LouiseCollins28 · 02/04/2019 12:54

Fair point Cordelia. I can't see Revoke happening tbh, but it is a way to stop "No Deal".

Sostenueto · 02/04/2019 12:55

This is what I would wish Brexit was but sadly it isn't.

BigChocFrenzy · 02/04/2019 12:55

lonelytired most leavers will NOT blame the Tories / Brexiters for problems after No Deal

because it would mean that they themselves made a terrible decision voting leave and then continuting to support their Brexit heroes

Few people - especially authoritarians, which Leavers mostly are - admit to really serious mistakes in a decision and in who to trust

Hence blame the EU - "punishment" -
and scapegoat immigrants - "foreign influence" -
& Remainers - "weakened the UK negotiating position"^

Backfire effect

^www.skepdic.com/backfireeffect.html^
^
Many people who are emotionally convinced of something
will become even more convinced if they are given factual evidence that disproves what they believe^

Sostenueto · 02/04/2019 12:57

Play video from 1.40 if you don't want to watch whole video!

PinkieTuscadero · 02/04/2019 12:57

Sebastian Payne
‏Verified account
@SebastianEPayne
I understand that May will tell political cabinet if it is a choice between revocation of Article 50 and pursuing a no-deal Brexit, she would opt for no-deal.

prettybird · 02/04/2019 12:59

Not caught up all of this morning's posts but the more I think about it, the more AngryAngryAngry I get about the Conservatives whipping against Common Market 2.0 because it would make future Scottish independence "too easy" ShockAngry

So the attitude would seem to be confirmed as "we (as in England FUKD) is going to go to hell with a No Deal Brexit and we're going to damn well drag Scotland down with us " Angry

I've also picked up enough from the couple of posts that I have seen I'd that the bloody politicians played bloody politics for far too bloody long, so that even the faint chance of indicative votes being a potential way out has been snuffed out SadAngry

I really feel for Nick Boles who seems like a decent bloke (even if he is/was a Tory Wink).

MissMalice · 02/04/2019 13:00

she would opt for no-deal.

... and my fury at MPs for not backing Cherry’s motion increases.

LonelyTiredandLow · 02/04/2019 13:00

If our press wasn't so one sided I'd suggest they camp outside Farage/Mogg and Boris's door and give them as much air time post No Deal as pre. Asking direct questions about the deaths and whether they feel responsible for advocating No Deal. You know, the kind of journalism we thought we had about ten years ago...

LonelyTiredandLow · 02/04/2019 13:02

Personally I think the fact they advocated No Deal so hard people WILL remember.

lonelyplanetmum · 02/04/2019 13:02

yes but those 2 months or real hardship will be enough to show Leavers what they actually voted for

Lonelytired I don't like to disagree with another lonely but I really think that any hope that Leavers will relapse is doomed to failure in many cases.

You can see it now in any Leavers you know.

"The pound falling isn't related to their vote - it would have happened anyway. The car and aerospace manufacturing closures, redundancies, changes of investment are all due to diesel cars and would have happened anyway. The businesses closing that's not to do with the pound falling it's all internet shopping and would have happened anyway. The underfunding and understaffing in the NHS would have happened anyway that will all improve once the (0.7% GDP ) membership fee goes into the NHS. We are better off without international trade we can be entirely independent with no trading relationships a world recession would have happened anyway."

All that bollocks is hard wired. Many Leavers both voters and politicians will never acknowledge cause and effect whatever the hardship, they really won't.

lonelyplanetmum · 02/04/2019 13:02

Realise not relapse

NoWordForFluffy · 02/04/2019 13:03

I understand that May will tell political cabinet if it is a choice between revocation of Article 50 and pursuing a no-deal Brexit, she would opt for no-deal.

She's a prize twat.

MyNameIsArthur · 02/04/2019 13:03

PMK

Sostenueto · 02/04/2019 13:04

Duh! Knew that anyway. Do these politicians think we are stupid? Obviously they do same as the journalists. Why they bother tweeting the obvious is beyond me!
They forget that TM has made Brexit all about her. After all SHE must deliver what the people want PAIN and then more PAIN.
It is HER duty as PM and NOBODY can take that away from HER. In other words in TMs mind its all about me me me!

havingtochangeusernameagain · 02/04/2019 13:04

Just saw this on Twitter:

5 Stages of #NoDealBrexit
1.Denial. "There can't be a NDB!"
2.Anger. "The Govt is fkn out of their minds!"
3.Bargaining. "At least the Govt could get an extension."
4.Depression. "We're all doomed."
5.Acceptance. "Buy toilet rolls."

67chevvyimpala · 02/04/2019 13:05

The people who suffer most will remember - but they generally aren't the sane people who vote.

HazardGhost · 02/04/2019 13:06

And if May backs no deal over revoke there will be a special place in hell for her which should mean something given her religion.

C'mon Uri.

67chevvyimpala · 02/04/2019 13:07

same people

horseshit · 02/04/2019 13:08

Personally I think the fact they advocated No Deal so hard people WILL remember.

They’ll remember it, but who will they blame for the lack of success?

I’m not having a go at you, Lonely, I promise. I’m just absolutely sick with worry and have nobody to talk to irl, sad as it sounds. The B word is banned in our house because it’s negatively affecting DW’s mental health. But I need to talk to someone or it’ll eat me from the inside. Thank god for these threads.

Sostenueto · 02/04/2019 13:08

She will still have a statue of her in Westminster. I might just visit HoC when its made to accidently/purposely knock the fucker over! Along with Cameron'sGrin

Sostenueto · 02/04/2019 13:12

I think the EU better go low profile for a bit. I really believe they are worried sick secretly but hey ho! We are all in it together, at least till April 12th........

BigChocFrenzy · 02/04/2019 13:12

Bring your little dog, sos
and let it choose on which statue it does its Number 1 and which its Number 2

67chevvyimpala · 02/04/2019 13:13

horseshit
I feel the same.
I'm not sure what else I could have done to prepare for no deal tbh.
I feel so angry and baffled that its come to this....even though I've known for some time it's the only logical conclusion.
If things get bad wrt those who are remainers (threats etc) then I guess we will have to think about leaving but...
It would have to be bad. And sadly I think that could happen :(