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Brexit

Westminstenders: Erskine Mayhem

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 19/03/2019 09:55

John Bercow has stepped in. We've long made the point, that the position of Speaker was utterly crucial to the outcome of Brexit. However this ruling was long warned as a possibility. It was somewhat overlooked by all (including me).

We are now faced with the bizarre narrative that May was just about to be able to get her deal through, and it's now simply Bercow who has tried to sabotage Brexit.

The reality is that his ruling has the effect of making BOTH no deal And a lengthy extension (possibly with a PV) much more likely.

May now has to embrace one of these option (by accident or design) or find a way to substantially change the terms of her deal as put to the Commons, either through negotiation with the EU or bolting something significantly different to her deal like a variation of the Kyle Amendment (a PV based on her deal or remain). Or find a majority to overturn the standing order that Bercow has cited as the reason for his block.

This block also might apply to the Benn amendment (indicative votes) or other PV amendments. Which could equally be problematic going forward.

In reality Bercow has upped the stakes and forced May to do something meaningful rather than simply holding a gun to MPs heads to vote. Hurrah for parliamentary Sovereignty and limiting the abuse of power of the executive!?!

It's a completely neutral move in practice. The HoC has tied itself in knots with how it's voted for political reason rather than for the national interest. The British Constitution has just stood up for itself. Bercow is just a useful target to blame for the incompetence of the entire house for the last 3 years.

The billion pound question this morning is where does that now leave us?

The honest answer is I'm damned if I know.

Maybe the EU will come up with a magic bullet for May, maybe the Cabinet can come up with a magic bullet, maybe May will take the political magic bullet of a long extension or revocation or maybe we'll just all shoot ourselves in the head and foot with no deal.

I have no idea.

10 days to go.

Westminstenders: Erskine Mayhem
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OublietteBravo · 19/03/2019 17:57

Did the 2017 GE really show support for anyone?

That was kinda my point about the 2016 referendum. Arguably the failure of both pro-Brexit parties to get a majority should have cancelled it out. After all, if MPs can change their minds, so can the electorate....

And of course no one actually fought the 2017 GE or the 2016 referendum on a No Deal Brexit platform. So there is definitely no democratic mandate for this outcome (especially given the recent parliamentary votes against it).

TalkinPaece · 19/03/2019 17:58

THe Yorkshire lorries will be on quiet roads as everybody else will be in London Smile

IrenetheQuaint · 19/03/2019 18:02

We need a long extension just to get rid of Fox, Grayling and Leadsom. Surely the EU would understand?

TheNorthWestPawsage · 19/03/2019 18:06

PMK

BollocksToBrexit · 19/03/2019 18:14

Sorry I'm confused. Lorries in Yorkshire are going on a go slow because they want no deal brexit? Is that right? Because if it is, it's bloody stupid. 'Let's push for no deal by giving them a taste of the chaos no deal will create'. Confused

RedToothBrush · 19/03/2019 18:15

How much per week would getting rid of Grayling save?

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LonelyTiredandLow · 19/03/2019 18:20

Oubliette au contraire - my leaver friend said that as both main party's supported leave they have written No Deal Brexit into their manifestos which is what they are elected on. She is obviously also under the impression that the TIGGERS were elected under the same mandate... Just saying, you'd be surprised at what leavers believe other people voted for in the last GE. She says it was obvious that Corbyn was a Eurosceptic, despite all evidence to the contrary from labour voters who thought he was pro-remain.

prettybird · 19/03/2019 18:26

20 years ago dh and I were one of the households included in the official employment statistics gathering exercise.

Iirc, it started with a random call to our flat and then we would get called up every month (or was it quarterly?) and we were asked detailed questions about our working status, the hours we worked and whether we wanted to work more hours. (We were both working full time about 50 hours a week in well paid jobs, so the answer was No to more hours Wink).

We then moved house to our current home - and as the information gathering was based on the physical household, we were told that it would depend on whether the new owners of our flat wanted to continue to participate.

Royal Cat Carpet Wink with a picture of the blue point that our two lilac boys replaced after he was run over by a speeding bastard Angry

Westminstenders: Erskine Mayhem
jasjas1973 · 19/03/2019 18:29

May has a lot to answer for for not investigating Banks

Chances are Banks is associated with leading tories esp those who backed Leave so strongly.

Perhaps the EU won't give us any extension? and May will not get rid of the legal date of departure?

I think the direction of travel is this and not a long delay/PV/GE, let alone a revoke, i think a lot depends on whether she can engineer another vote on her deal and if it is defeated again/by how much?

LonelyTiredandLow · 19/03/2019 18:29

Bollocks I think there was a call for this from Leave a couple of weeks ago. I imagine they think they are "doing a France"... I wonder what their employers make of it? If they are EU based I can't imagine much lenience given the current climate.

Cuddlysnowleopard · 19/03/2019 18:30

Thanks for the Hansard transcript, Red. All lawyers in my house (and a 15 year old ds who is politics obsessed), and we have been debating the legalities of this for weeks. DS greeted the Speaker's announcement yesterday with "thank goodness our legal structure is sound!".

At least Ken C knows what he is doing.

LonelyTiredandLow · 19/03/2019 18:32

jasjas well yes, they and Bannon seem keen on Boris.

But suppose, just because they enjoy it, they decide to fund Labour next time? They may already be funding momentum for all we know given the crazy going on there.

I just think we need to be very clear that we may not be a functioning democracy although us on this thread have seen that for a while.

1tisILeClerc · 19/03/2019 18:32

{ (We were both working full time about 50 hours a week in well paid jobs, so the answer was No to more hours}

You terrible people, your jobs could have been given to 25 part time workers to make the government employment figures look good.

Holidayshopping · 19/03/2019 18:32

When will her letter arrive? Is she sending it first class or second? Grin

Do we expect to have an answer from the EU this week?!

1tisILeClerc · 19/03/2019 18:38

Russia, the USA and the likes of Bannon will do whatever to create the most unrest. Part of it will be to manipulate the value of Sterling, just to keep the ERG boys happy with their side bets, just perks of the 'job'.
Russia wants the EU destabilised, the USA perhaps a bit less so and the others are just in it for fun.

MockerstheFeManist · 19/03/2019 18:42

"When will her letter arrive? Is she sending it first class or second?"

Just said on ITN the letter has been delayed because "She can't think of what to write."

AwdBovril · 19/03/2019 18:43

May I just apologise on behalf of Yorkshire. We're not all pig ignorant selfish arseholes.

Holidayshopping · 19/03/2019 18:45

Just said on ITN the letter has been delayed because "She can't think of what to write

Grin sounds like the English essays I used to sit down to start but could never thing what to say, so instead, I’d write the date and my name in calligraphy pen-it took ages! Wonder if she’s doing that!!

Icantreachthepretzels · 19/03/2019 18:46

Jumping in on page 11.

Can't believe the plan from the lorry drivers a) Westminster does not give a flying fuck about what is happening on Yorkshire roads. b) You don't gather support by pissing people off - and people hate traffic way more than they hate the EU.
Between this and Farrage's hunger march they really are making themselves look like the prize plonkers we have always known they are and have been repeatedly told not to call them.

More reason than ever to make sure there is a HUGE showing on Saturday. Any one who can possibly make it - even just for a bit - please do come.

icannotremember · 19/03/2019 18:46

I (almost) feel a little bit sorry for her. Imagine being her, having spent the last couple of years insisting that Brexit means Brexit and the date she chose is the date we leave, and now she has to write a letter asking the people she's insulted a great deal can we please, please not Brexit quite yet because she's fucked it all up...

mrslaughan · 19/03/2019 18:49

Shamelessly placemarking again!
Struggling to keep up with the thread- as I, like so many Westminster's am moving...... now knee high in boxes, which makes a change from head high, and hip high....

prettybird · 19/03/2019 18:50

It might be that it is a false memory, but I seem to recall Jacob Rees Mogg quoting Erskine May in January or February (certainly over a month ago) and complaining that the Speaker wasn't following the Erskine May "bible" Confused

Of course, Erskine May rules only apply, in JRM's universe, if they suit his own narrow purposes. Hmm----

TiddleTaddleTat · 19/03/2019 18:50

@Icantreachthepretzels I'm not near London but considering going to the March, but I'd have a small child with me. Do we think it could get nasty?

RedToothBrush · 19/03/2019 18:52

Why?

She was warned about every single one of these pitfalls.

She ignored every one.

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DGRossetti · 19/03/2019 18:55

It might be that it is a false memory, but I seem to recall Jacob Rees Mogg quoting Erskine May

If it is, it's mine too. Might explain why he's not been so vocal ?

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