Westminstenders: Neglectful Drunkeness!

[RedToothBrush]

The HoC has spend the past 3 years in a state of Neglectful Drunkeness.

As it stands less then two weeks from Brexit Day, there is no deal we were promised. The Conservative and Labour Parties are more divided than ever.

The government is in disarray as 8 Cabinet ministers plus the chief whip voted against the Prime Minister including the Brexit Secretary who had minutes earlier argued for an extension only to vote against it. He is now on the brink of resignation.

The DUP look like they may be about to capitulate and vote for a deal. But it may not be enough even then.

This is what the cliff edge looks like.

Who wants to take a closer look?

Once 'doing a Brexit' becomes common parlance, we will know the idea is dead.

Mother
The problem is that a ballot to ratify something assumes that, in the event of non ratification, you revert to the status quo.

The status quo in this instance can be interpreted as revoking A50 and resuming full E.U. membership as before the ref, or reverting to the countdown to No Deal.

In its current form, the amendment will lead to another dispiriting impasse.

PMK to see what drama ensues this week

If - as has been suggested - it would be legally impossible for the EU to attach conditions to any extension, then they might find themselves offering none in order to prevent the UK being in the EU without MEPs and queering the pitch for all. A lot of talk about what the UK wants, and very little about what the EU needs ...

A nine month delay is worst of all worlds . Reading the article Peston (who in my mind is usually on the button) says that that offer from the EU will result in with many incentives, bribes and conditions DUP will agree to back WA next week rather than have no Brexit : so my hard ball rather than no ball. Not sure about those other 23 MPs though?

The thing is with any delay we return to a question I (and many others) have been raising since day 2 ... what is the shelf life of this fucking referendum ?

A 9 month extension suggests we will be enacting Brexit (if ever) over 3 years after the initial referendum. and over 2 years after the last General Election. I can't get a builder to hold to a quote for more than 28 days. WTF ?!

I just wish the EU would say that there will be NO extension and that March 29 is decision day. The UK has the 3 choices, pick one.
This whole thing is so far beyond farce. It is not statesmanship or negotiation it is simply being shitbags for the sake of it.

Once 'doing a Brexit' becomes common parlance, we will know the idea is dead.

Let's make it common parlance then!

I always thinking if doing a trump returned to its original flatulence meaning that would accelerate Donny's demise too.

PMK

Once 'doing a Brexit' becomes common parlance, we will know the idea is dead.
Now going to incorporate this into every sentence especially to DF.

what is the shelf life of this fucking referendum ?
It has mould already.

Bugger. If 9 months, we'll have to eat the stockpile and start again.

There are plenty of apt Brexit definitions already on Urban Dictionary look!

Better link without the #Brexit on dictionary.

Oops, link fail urban dictionary.

just in case it hasn't been posted yet on this thread - and even if it has: www.newyorker.com/magazine/2019/03/25/the-chaotic-triumph-of-arron-banks-the-bad-boy-of-brexit

Ian Dunt on how many times the WA vote can be held.

www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2019/03/18/exactly-how-many-times-can-may-bring-this-deal-back-to-the-c

I can't remember which PP suggested the book "Travellers in the Third Reich", but thank you. I've just read it and agree that there are several parallels between 1930s Germany and nationalist thinking in the current-day UK.

However, I also took great comfort from the differences. The first is that there is no "leader" figure here around whom a nationalist movement can coalesce. I can't see a right-wing single politician who has the stature to fill such a role. Even if May goes and an ERG loon takes over, I don't there's one of them capable of mustering the necessary widespread support.

The most comforting difference of all is that the Nazis enjoyed fervent support from young people (they obviously went out of their way to promote it, Hitler Youth, BdM and so on). This is the opposite to our situation, where it's largely older people who support Brexit, while younger people (with more direct experience of growing up with the benefits of EU membership) tend to be more pro-EU (OFOC being a good example). Maybe our younger generation will rescue the country from the palsied grip of the old (and I'm old!). This is my Pandora's box glimmer of hope in this entire shitfest and another reason I'll be on the march on Saturday.

(Goes off to listen to The Times They Are A-Changin'" again )

The EU may not be able to demand the UK sign an agreement to do certain things
but they could refuse any extension until Parliament has actually passed legislation
e.g. to hold EP Elections, or to hold a PV on a certain date with WA vs Remain

Otherwise, if they decide they really can't trust us / May / HoC then it would probably be a short - and FINAL - extension until 22 May,
to give time either for a final attempt at passing the WA, or more time for No Deal
but not risking the UK buggering up EP elections

if the WA did pass, then the WAIB might have to be passed right afterwards, "on the nod" without debate in either House
if the EU decide they really don't trust the UK not to immediately renege on the WA if they get an extension.

The EU may not be able to demand the UK sign an agreement to do certain things but they could refuse any extension until Parliament has actually passed legislation e.g. to hold EP Elections, or to hold a PV on a certain date with WA vs Remain

There must be a risk/reward curve that fits into which at some point has "too much effort" as an intersection ... bearing in mind all EU27 countries need to agree and nothing - nothing stands still.

Shelf life of the referendum ?

imo, Until those who want to Remain - whatever the deal - reaches 60% and stays there

Otherwise, even Labour politicians won't risk pissing off a substantial section of their voters

Tories may wait for Labour to Revoke, because Tory membership are about 90% Leave and tory voters about 70%,
so they may well stay a Brexit party for many years.

Most likely, we'll end up with a No Deal Brexit, though

Even if there were a Revoke, if the Tories win a good majority in a GE - even 10 years from now - with Brexit in their manifesto, they can just invoke again without any ref

and it is most unlikely that MPs who stood on that clear manifesto would vote against

The other difference with the 1930's is that a fascist state would struggle to control us on social media & would be unable to cover up nasty stuff.

The young are light years ahead in using technology.

So we need to change public opinion, not just scrape a tiny margin for a PV in the HoC,
if we actually want it to stick

imo, demographics alone would take over after about 10 years, to give us that 60% Remain.
However, "events" could make that happen much earlier or later, too.

China is pretty good at shutting off info it doesn't want its public to see, anywhere on Tinternet

The other difference with the 1930's is that a fascist state would struggle to control us on social media & would be unable to cover up nasty stuff.

There's more than one way to skin a cat. If you can't stop the signal, you can always increase the noise. The fact MN has a separate Brexit forum is testament to that. And even then some threads simply disappeared in a sea of gammon. That's before you add in the touchpaper topics that are guaranteed to break the internet - paedophiles, muslims, terrorists, trans activists ....

True, but the young tend to fight back against internet control even in places where it is stifled.

I'm not sure they would succeed with ds.