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Brexit

Westminstenders: The Rebellion

970 replies

RedToothBrush · 23/02/2019 22:43

This week is the start of another big week. Touted (again) as high noon. However the end of February marks a watershed in many ways. Parliament simply can not kick the can further. Its last stand time.

Three Cabinet ministers are openly saying back Cooper-Boles. They are joined by other ministers and intend to vote for it regardless of the government position. And will break protocol by refusing to resign to do so. This leaves May with the option of accepting it or sacking them.

The breaking of collective responsibility would be a bit deal. But May can not easily sack them. She simply has so little power left.

These ministers are backed by up to 100 moderates too. And with the emergence of the TIGGERS the mood has changed with others emboldened in their rebellion and arguably more likely to go.

Meanwhile Corbyn is losing even more authority. In what looks like a last ditch attempt to retain remain support in the face of the TIGGERS whilst also leaving to the point where it is realistic, noises are being made that Labour are about to back a People's Vote. It sounds symbolic rather than meaningful in anyway.

The antisemitic row, however, seems to be engulfing the party even further with MPs seen as Jewish, or not loyal Corbynites subject to intense amounts of abuse for being diplomatic or sympathetic in the face of resignations. The spectacle of Labour infighting has been laid bare in a very public way and it doesn't look healthy and is swallowing all column inches over and above any policy regarding either austerity or Brexit.

What this means for votes this week is important. The power of the whip on both sides of the house is completely fractured. MPs are more likely to vote with conscience than party lines than previously.

Where this leads us is now wide open.

An extension now looks all but inevitable. But for how long, at what price and for what ends ultimately in terms of a deal or no deal.

This noise seems very much at odds with other voices.

The Government itself, however, still seems to be planning to get WA legislation through parliament at the last minute at the end of March. (This would also involve May using measures which break parliamentary constitutional arrangements). And prominent leavers are suggesting that an extention will just kill Brexit off completely.

A GE is also very much looming. The TIGGERS emergence is such a threat that both parties will now possibly want it sooner rather than later (for slightly differing reasons). They will not want them to become established or prepared for an election. But calling an election now closes parliament and enables no deal by default. A GE after an extension or Brexit is a different prospect too.

Things are likely to get very busy this week. Time to brace once again.

OP posts:
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GoldenSyrupLion · 25/02/2019 16:52

I was looking into the Greens as an option at the last election but their economic policies made my head explode.

Littlespaces · 25/02/2019 16:56

Mind you, the economics of Brexit makes my head explode!

GoldenSyrupLion · 25/02/2019 17:01

Well quite. Green economics might now seem the epitome of sanity.

Littlespaces · 25/02/2019 17:01

At long last. Someone is doing something about the No Deal Brexit advice which is being suppressed. Hurrah.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/independent-group-government-contempt-publish-no-deal-brexit-advice-a8795831.html

Motheroffourdragons · 25/02/2019 17:01

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ to protect the privacy of the user.

DGRossetti · 25/02/2019 17:07

Well the mood music from Chuka seems encouraging ...

OhYouBadBadKitten · 25/02/2019 17:14

The move by the Independent group is very encouraging!

DGRossetti · 25/02/2019 17:16

Tinfoil hat time ?

www.theregister.co.uk/2019/02/25/jolyon_maugham_v_uber_london_high_court_costs/

A millionaire barrister who started a crowdfunded lawsuit against taxi app Uber over a £1 VAT receipt has lost his attempt to stop Uber claiming legal costs against him.

In a judgement handed down today, Mr Justice Trower rejected both Jolyon Maugham QC's attempt to shield himself from a legal bill of up to £1m and his initial attempt to appeal against that rejection, a big setback for Maugham's two-year legal battle against Uber in London.

(contd) ...

bellinisurge · 25/02/2019 17:21

Contempt of what? Is there a court order?

Missbel · 25/02/2019 17:22

Meanwhile, back in the real world, there are things that really need our urgent attention www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/feb/25/uk-experiences-winter-temperatures-of-more-than-20c-for-first-time

Quote: Bob Ward, of the Centre for Climate Change Economics and Policy at the London School of Economics, said that while warmer temperatures are often welcomed, they can be deadly: “People may find it very pleasant to be in warmer temperatures but they must also remember that its the same trend that saw hundreds of people die last summer as a result of overheating.

“Over the last five years we also had two record wet winters during which there was severe flooding. This is a sign of the fundamental and profound way that Britain’s climate is changing."

DGRossetti · 25/02/2019 17:28

This is a sign of the fundamental and profound way that Britain’s climate is changing

And ? Climate has changed, climate will change. We know this (or those of us that read a lot of archaeology do).

The real answer is in building for a future where the climate has changed, not titting about with paper straws. But I suspect there's a lot more pork in useless green initiatives than there is in real measures.

BigChocFrenzy · 25/02/2019 17:28

@Tatiana ". It is in the terms of the WA that if the EU-U.K. fail to agree goes on so long that stalemate is reached, the U.K. can get out of if with the EU’s agreement, leaving NI alone in the SM-CU, the original backstop."

No, I don't see this anywhere in the WA

I see only the all-UK backstop;
the NI-only backstop was rejected by May and does not appear in the WA as an alternative

EU Summary: Protocol on Ireland and Northern Ireland:_

http://europa.eu/rapid/press-releaseMEMO-18-64233_33_en.htm

prettybird · 25/02/2019 17:34

Bellini - in contempt of Parliament. But May wouldn't care as the Government has already been found in contempt of Parliament and it made sweet FA difference Angry

...and she has shown herself personally to be contemptuous of Parliament, in he way she keeps on promising and then pulling votes Angry

When was it she first promised Parliament that it would get a "meaningful vote"? Hmm Her interpretation of that is not to let them have it until they vote the "correct" way or to not let them have it until it is too late Angry

Why bother having all those expensive MPs at Westminster if they're only allowed votes that the Government will win? ConfusedAngry

EweSurname · 25/02/2019 17:35

Faisal Islam
@faisalislam
NEW - Corbyn to tell PLP that Labour will support an amendment on a referendum: “in line with our conference policy, we are committed to also putting forward or supporting an amendment in favour of a public vote to prevent a damaging Tory Brexit being forced on the country.”

TalkinPeece · 25/02/2019 17:42

DGR
And ? Climate has changed, climate will change. We know this (or those of us that read a lot of archaeology do).
What we are currently doing to the climate is outside the limits of anything that has happened in the timeline of archaeology.

The planet will be fine.
Humans will be nadgered.
I am not willing to take that risk with my grandchildren thank you very much.

2beesornot2beesthatisthehoney · 25/02/2019 17:44

Corbyn announces labour will vote for PV amendment has just popped up as I was reading this thread. Guardian I think.

DGRossetti · 25/02/2019 17:44

I am not willing to take that risk with my grandchildren thank you very much.

Well, being blunt there's nothing you (or I) can do - maybe our children. But it will still consist of having to accommodate climate change rather than affect it.

TalkinPeece · 25/02/2019 17:45

But it will still consist of having to accommodate climate change rather than affect it.
No.
I support mitigation and radical change to prevent ecosystem collapse.
eg most of the world's oil needs to stay in the ground from now on.

Missbel · 25/02/2019 17:49

It's my understanding that the speed of climate change is the problem - and that this, along with continuing population growth, is likely to be a driver for mass migration and other potentially serious problems. Initiatives aimed at mitigating the worst effects - building for a climate change future - would be a better use of government time than the endless hours that are having to be directed to Brexshit. Still, I guess if Spain runs low on water we won't have to worry about importing fresh food from there.

2beesornot2beesthatisthehoney · 25/02/2019 17:53

Or is this an amendment for PV on his (JC) Brexit ?

Missbel · 25/02/2019 17:54

It sounds as if there are two motions coming from Labour - one for a deal on the lines they've long been promoting and the promise of support for a "popular vote"

DGRossetti · 25/02/2019 17:55

I support mitigation and radical change to prevent ecosystem collapse. eg most of the world's oil needs to stay in the ground from now on

Good luck with that.

MutantDisco · 25/02/2019 17:59

My god, at last. What now?

apple.news/AEJYFHChXQdCCWwBNkFYT9Q

BigChocFrenzy · 25/02/2019 17:59

Tusk is being very blunt again ...

Tony Connelly@tconnellyRTE

Breaking: Donald Tusk says he discussed with Theresa May the legal implications of possible extension to Article 50.

"An extension would be a rational decision but Theresa May believes she can avoid this scenario." 🤔

2beesornot2beesthatisthehoney · 25/02/2019 18:02

David Lammey has welcomed this move