Westminstenders: Stuck in the Middle With TIGGERS

[RedToothBrush]

Well I don't know how we got here tonight.
We've got the feeling that something ain't right.
We're so scared as we leave the EU
And we're wondering how we'll get out of this stew

Antisemites to the left of me!
Dog Whistles to the right!
Here I am stuck in the middle whilst we leave the EU.

'Cause I'm stuck in the middle whilst we leave the EU.
And I'm wondering what it is we should do.
It's so hard to keep this smile from my face.
Losing control and running all over the place.

Clowns to the left of me!
Jokers to the right!
Here I am stuck in the middle whilst we leave the EU.

When you started off with rights
And you're starting to wonder if thats for life.
And all the politicians come crawling
Slap you on the back and say
Please . . .
Please . . .
Vote Leave and back EU Withdrawal

But we see it makes no sense at all.

Best to keep your money offshore
Than to visit the bookstore

Deniers to the left of me!
Islamaphobes to the right!
Here I am stuck in the middle with you.

Its finally happened. FINALLY.

MPs have seen that their leaders have lost the plot and are hell bent on destruction and politicial ideology ahead of practicality and will justify the unjustifable in the face of democracy and they have jumped ship.

Enter stage left and stage right: The TIGGERS - members of The Independent Group.

Will there be more. Hard to say no. It seems almost certain there will be more.

Will it make a difference? Difficult to call, but these MPs would be driven out sooner or later. Such is our accelerating politicial polarisation and narrowing of views. This is their last stand. They have nothing left to lose on a personal level.

Whether you agree with the TIGGERS or still look to the other parties for policy, I do think that the emergence of the TIGGERS marks a feeling of optimism and much needed hope for many many Remainers / Moderates, even if it ultimately does fizzle out.

A reflection from 2017: People voted for Corbyn because they were looking for Hope. When he's failed to deliver that, its led to disillusionment and he can not pull the same trick again at a future GE. This makes that doubly so. People are STILL very much looking for that hope. If Brexit does go tits up in a big fashion, then what happens? To what direction do people look? I'm sure there will be the bitterest of recriminations, but... hope is a big deal. We need something...

Tick tick tick. 37 days til Brexit.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/3492426-Westministenders-Abbreviation

red Being fair to Fox, even the most brilliant trade minister ever wouldn't have managed to roll over more than a few trade deals in these circumstances:

• The Uk in a very weak position to negotiate - much smaller than the EU and losing all its trade deals at once
• The uncertainty of what kind of Brexit terms we will have (or even if we will Brexit, until we actually do)

of course, offending Japan, China - and who knows which other countries too - by various means hasn't helped at all !
Uk politicians may hopefully learn some manners from Brexit

Being fair to Fox,

Do we have to be? pleeeeeaaaaaaasssssssseee? Can't we be spiteful? Just a little?

DG
www.birmingham.gov.uk/directory_record/9106/edgbaston_reservoir

I have a private water supply! However, don’t envy me. Last time it went wrong it cost us (the community) £14000 to fix. And that’s just the water. We live in fear of the Environment Agency condemning the sewage system (originally built in the 18th century).

The Hill @ thehill
Pompeo: US will not share information with country using Huawei systems
t.co/QSVK8WMLWK

Oh. That'll be intelligence sharing with us then.

Which is just what we want with Brexit too.

I believe Edgbaston reservoir isn't drinking water - it's used to level the canals (if there's a difference).

But thanks for the heads up. Although it's quite a popular spot for da kidz to enjoy a quiet "doobie", as I believe they are known (m'lud ).

On a serious note, because Birmingham wasn't run by a bunch of self serving cretins back in they day, it is over-served with drinking water. The city corporation bought a Welsh valley, flooded it, and piped the water to the West of Birmingham (Frankley - where Bill Oddie watched birds as a kid) to ensure clean water for millions.

I know such civic preparations and far sightedness would probably see them committed in 2019, but it's something that used to happen up and down the land.

Birmingham merely looks on askance when the rest of the country talks of "hosepipe bans". But keep it to yourself - we don't want the water-short to ask awkward questions like "why can't we do that ?" do we ?

my employer thinks that delivering chemicals within the EU will take an extra 10-12 days

That's way more delay than we're planning for. At the very worst it seems we'll be able to do a reliable 3-4 day arrival at NL/BE.

I have a private water supply!

One of my US relatives in Florida had to dig a well before he was allowed to build his house - 30m deep (apparently). All houses in his neighborhood are required to have off-grid water as part of the planning permission.

Being fair to Fox, even the most brilliant trade minister ever wouldn't have managed to roll over more than a few trade deals in these circumstances

Being fair to Fox, he said it'd be dead easy. He seemed to think he was this magic trade minister who could achieve the impossible.

So if we were being fair we'd have been all supportive and said yes Liam, we know you can do in with all our Brexitty positivity.

So if we'd have been fair, and taken that approach and took him on his word and we would be asking why he hasn't delivered.

So no, I'm not going to be fair to Liam anymore, as he had his opportunity to prove us all wrong with his Brexitty positivity and super human trade powers that defy geography.

Instead I'm just going to shrug and say 'we told you so Liam' and ask why we have to fair to Liam anymore.

Liam has failed to deliver and frankly at this junction we need a better answer than he's giving us, because the lack of all these deals is going to cripple a lot of businesses, cost a lot of jobs and put people out of their homes.

Nope. Liam doesn't get off with a 'to be fair to Liam'.

It's just not good enough.

Bottom left ...

That picture just gave me the rage again. And I was all chilled out.

Exactly Red. You don't get to tell everyone repeatedly something will be easy peasy, and then expect sympathy because it's actually not. You deserve scorn for being such an arrogant fool in the first place.

The Liam Fox paradox runs deep in Brexit. As I have repeatedly pointed out to the Brexiteer brigade, they've had everything their own way from day one. The referendum. A Prime Minister that appointed prominent Leavers into key roles. (With the wrinkle of a GE that didn't pan out. But surely that can only be "the will of the people" ?), and then replaced resigning Leavers with more Leavers. So how is it somehow anyone elses fault if the wheels are now rattling dangerously (if not overtaking us) ?

So to echo RTBs note, we're being more than fair to the Leavers in government.

Hasenstein Thu 21-Feb-19 13:15:35
Enjoying Anna Soubry on LBC
Does anyone have a link for a TIG website? Tried Googling, but find no link.

This the one? www.theindependent.group/

To be fair there's no reason why the FTA we'll (hopefully) do with the EU shouldn't be the easiest in history, considering that we're both starting from the same regulatory position. The EU have even hinted at that themselves. The problem is that we can't start negotiating it until this shitshow is over.

Why is that anyway? Just EU intransigence rules or is there a valid, practical reason why it has to happen like that?

Alex andreou @studyalex
On @BBCNews, Peter Lilley on the charge the ERG are a party within a party: “Actually we’re a Research Group. We used to meet in my room and do research. That’s why we are so much better informed than most other people on these issues.”

Issues like, errrrr, trade?

(casts eyes to the comments above about Our Liam).

To be fair there's no reason why the FTA we'll (hopefully) do with the EU shouldn't be the easiest in history, considering that we're both starting from the same regulatory position

Errr except there are lots of Brexiteers who want to bonfire this regs so we can trade with the US and err it still takes Switzerland who aligned more than we are, YEARS to sort out their trading arrangements with the EU.

What do you think makes us so special that we can defy gravity?

Wasn't there a Nottingham Research Group many years ago where blokes in green tights (allegedly) hid out in the woods. Although I think their USP was donating (some) to the poor.

Why is that anyway? Just EU intransigence rules or is there a valid, practical reason why it has to happen like that?

(channels Jack Nicholson in "A Few Good Men" ...)

You can't handle the truth !

Whatever anyone says, the real reason for that is the EU simply did not trust the UK one iota and knew from the off that if the UK were allowed to negotiate a trade deal before leaving, then it would never leave. Allowing it the exact cake-and-eat-it situation the Leave campaign sold to leave voters.

So there were 4 things that had to be settled before we talk trade. The divorce bill. EU citizens rights. The NI Border. And one I can never remember . The EU basically made it a precondition of any talks. David Davies talked the talk about getting into a fistfight over it, and then quietly agreed to that and moved on. Which is where we are now.

It's worth noting that the EU had wind of the entire UK negotiating strategy and stance from day one, thanks to our rather shouty newspapers and their rather unsporting habit of reading languages other than their own. In fact it's entirely possible, given the average lack of IQ of the more extreme Brexiteers that the EU was aware of what was going on long before a British Brexiteer had found someone to explain it to them, thanks to the Express, Sun, Mail and Telegraph.

I said there's no reason it shouldn't be the easiest in history, not that I expect it to be. It could be, if it wasn't for the bunch of twats in control.

The group that didn't do any bloody research. Give me strength.

Meet in his room and 'do research'? Doesn't sound at all dodgy, that.

It's the R of the ERG that annoys me most. They wouldn't know research if it bit them on the arse and ran away with their trade deals.

Peter Lilley on the charge the ERG are a party within a party: “Actually we’re a Research Group. We used to meet in my room and do research. That’s why we are so much better informed than most other people on these issues.”

Oh God, he’s going to sing again, isn’t he?

Meet in his room and 'do research'? Doesn't sound at all dodgy, that.

Well we all know what a bunch of wankers the ERG are but you don't have to phrase it like that!

WTF is Lilley on about? What a tool

(This is very outing ) but at Uni, I and 3 coursemates formed the "Thames Research Group". Which was invaluable in gaining access to trade exhibitions and sales material that would normally not be given to students. We went to at least 3 exhibitions in our suits and got ID badges in the TRG name. I was offered a job by Hewlett Packard, after discussing their systems with a salesman who realised I knew more than him.

It helped we shared a house . All our case studies came with tonnes of glossy brochures, tech specs and pricing matrices.

(The only internet we had was JANET ...)