Westministenders: A Special Place in Hell

[RedToothBrush]

A quick start to a new thread (as I've not been paying attention this evening!).

May is looking to ditch the Malthouse Compromise. Cos its so rubbish.

The ERG look like they are splitting over it anyway.

Up to sixty Labour MPs could back the WA.

Half the ERG plus Labour Leave Rebels could be enough to get the WA over the line.

Donald Tusk, makes controversial comment by more or less stating the obvious.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/3492426-Westministenders-Abbreviation
Guide to Brexit Abbreviations and Terms

Sorry not RTFT but does anyone else listen to Remainiacs? The sweary rants of Ian Dunt are very cathartic.

Utter nonsense from Claire Perry, nothing new in that, from her. How on earth her contribution is described as “EPIC” I really don’t know, these threads really are funny sometimes

Funny in what way Louise?

I wonder if those who said that Spain need the British retirees are rethinking that
The funny thing about watching this great thread for years and years, is that that was predicted ages ago.

So much of what's happening now, was predicted by posters here.

Turning out worse than the worst predictions though.

Labour definitely is. (Although I felt as gutted by Corbyn's election as I did by brexit, I knew it would decimate the party)

I was interested in Mark Gatiss's new Dracula film he's working on. I always thought it was a metaphor for a peculiarly English male type of terror of the 'foreign'. Pleased to hear them talk about that on the Remainiacs podcast.

I've been banging on about pensioners health insurance for some time

Without state or private health insurance, expats won't be given longterm resident status
So it's not just about risking being without insurance and hoping to nip back to the UK if need be for treatment

I have private insurance and I know some longterm expats have paid into the state system of their host country.
However, many current pensioners either retired abroad - and hence only ever used the NHS before -
or gave up their private insurance on reaching UK state pension age, assuming the UK would always continue with the EU refund scheme

The WA continues the S1 scheme for pensioners, but If there is No Deal, then SI stops and EHIC - short visits - probably too.

With No Deal, at best there will be a hiatus while the UK & EU organise a continuation of the current S1 scheme

The HoC Committee have been informed that it is cheaper to pay for pensioner expats treament abroad than for pensioners living in the UK.
So, potentially 300,000 pensioners (and soon to be ones) returning to an NHS already stretched beyond its limits

@LouiseCollins28 are you sent from the "motherland" to save us?

Funny because of the constant stream of nonsense, the daily deification of Remain supporting MPs, and the utter, utter failure of so many posters to engage with the reality of the situation we are in 50 days out from 29th March.

If you want to avoid “no deal”, pressure your Member of Parliament to vote for “Deal”, it really is that simple.

If you want to stop Brexit altogether, then I wish you luck with your campaign, and as a leave voter, I still think there is a chance that it will be prevented from happening, or at least delayed.

unless there is “no deal”, we will be entering a transitional arrangement either on 29th March or at some agreed point after that. It seems likely that little would immediately change.

The seeming joy that people take in prioritising the interests of other European nations over our own and the constant criticism of our negotiators is particlarly galling.

I really don’t know Louise, these posts of yours really are misogynistic sometimes.

@mrslaughan, sorry not sure I understand the reference you make , are you suggesting that I am a Russian troll?

“Nonsense” is inaccurate.
“Deification” doesn’t happen.
“Reality” is something people here regularly engage with. Ask Mrs Destiel. Ask anyone who has family who require medication.
Many of us do pressure our MPs to vote for the deal, even though it’s not what we really want.
We don’t take joy in any of this. We despair.
Don’t patronise us. Just don’t, Louise.

LouiseCollin Do you genuinely share the unpleasant populist views of both the far left and far right
or is it - once again - you just despise anyone who was a Remainer or is a soft Brexiter now
and excuse anything from a hard Brexiter ?

Posting what idiots UK politicians are,
that they have been totally outclassed by the EU team
Posting how No Deal would hurt the country

are all facts, hence neither loyal nor disloyal.

Don't shoot the messenger

Hear, hear Born.

@BigChocFrenzy - do you know what happens if they have lived abroad for a long time? So not resident in the UK? I just remember reading a case of a couple (British nationals) who were resident abroad, travelled home at Xmas to visit family, and unfortunately went into premature labour, and delivered a baby prematurely, who needed NICU treatment. They were presented with a huge bill because they weren't resident in the uk. I found it surprising. In the article I read they said because they were British nationals, they hadn't thought they needed travel insurance.

@LouiseCollins28 "bingo"

This disaster facing the country, was created entirely by Brexiters

who decided to carry out the most massive change since WW2 without a plan
and in such ignorance of international trade & the economy that they could never create a feasible plan

Brexit was a Tory part catfight that caught out of hand
any got taken over by those who want to make big profits out of the disaster

So yes, we're very critical about Brexiters and in particular this government

the constant criticism of our negotiators is particularly galling.
Please forgive me correcting the spelling

48 days to go and............................everyone is implementing no deal plans because we don't know what is going to happen.
This is gross incompetence.

We are going from Germany+ to potentially Mauritania-
Nobody knows

@mrslaughlan
Brits abroad lose the right to vote
the right to use the NHS
the right to benefits
after 15 years

then again Americans in the USA can lose the right to vote after 6 years if they do not like any of the candidates

@DGRosetti
Chope used to be the MP for round here
when he was in charge of the Tory Canyon he was holding a press conference on a train
along the corridor a voice boomed
"Oi! Shithead! I want a word with you"
and Prescott lurched into view .....

I know people who think Chope is a great local MP
I have explained to them that they are NEVER to ring him to my house

LouiseCollins Do you want us to be "patriotic" like e.g. this Brexit donor ?
Betting huge sums that Britain will do BADLY after Brexit

Hedge-funders / gamblers like Tory & Leave donor Crispin Odey bet against UK businesses and Sterling
e.g. £220 million profit for a 900k donation to Leave 🤔

Do you really side with people who make hundreds of millions each,
when Sterling / UK businesses / UK bonds plummet in value

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/dec/28/crispin-odey-hedge-fund-bets-against-uk-economy-brexit-profit-falls

Odey was one of the most prominent supporters of the drive to leave the EU and donated almost £900,000 to pro-Brexit campaigns.

He placed huge bets against the pound and government bonds
in the run-up to the June 2016 referendum

and made an estimated £220m profit when the pound collapsed following the leave victory.

The day after the vote, he told the BBC:
“There’s that Italian expression – ‘Il mattino ha l’oro in bocca’ (the morning has gold in its mouth)
and never has one felt so much that idea as this morning.”^

Odey has boasted that each day of Brexit-related political crisis is a “good day” for him and his hedge fund.
“I have had a good day,” he told the Times last month, on a day when the pound fell 2%.
“Bad days tend to be good days for us.”

And you complain that Westministenders are being disloyal 🤯
Look at those behind Brexit !

This is depressing. I wish I could be a fly on the wall to know what is being planned.
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/feb/09/a-hidden-government-is-preparing-for-brexit-by-keeping-us-in-the-dark

But I'm trying to cheer myself up.

My political opinions are pretty complicated but IMO are neither far right nor far left. What people tend to mean by “populism”, in my view is “stuff I don’t agree with”

I really don’t despise people in politics, and I certainly don’t “excuse anything” from a Brexiteer. I think a good many of the most extreme Brexiteers are behaving very badly but there are some in the ERG who genuinely do belevie their their way forward is the best one, I don’t agree with them, but I wouldn’t castigate them for it,

Among the things i would castigate people for, are cozying up to horrible foreign governments, and yes I’d also be very harsh on members of Parliament who having said they accepted the referendum result in 2016 have since worked daily to prevent it from being given effect.

For the record, 53 MPs voted against holding a referendum, all of them I think from the SNP, this was a principled position for which I wouldn’t criticise them at all.

Whether you think all that amounts, on my part, to sharing the unpleasant populist views of the far left and the far right is for you to judge.

Btw @LouiseCollins28 - my priority is not other EU nations - my priority in the British public- the Irish, the British worker who is going to end up with less and less protection and those families who are going to end up poorer and less protected. The whole British population whose food standards are going to drop and the environmental protection's that are going to be lost.
So you may have drunk the coolaid - but it's time for you to stop swallowing the propaganda and wake up and smell the coffee......

But then ignorance is always bliss.....

@LouiseCollins28
cozying up to horrible foreign governments
Please list the foreign governments you think are NOT horrible?
And therefore that its OK to snuggle up with

TiP, MrsL My first job in Germany, I injured my knee
... and I found that the NHS & form E111 no longer covered me in Germany because I had been away more than 3 months
(fortunately I also had private insurance)

It is only those expats receiving Uk state pension who have their health costs refunded by the NHS

The EHIC card, the system that came later, is also only for temporary stays, which basically means up to 3 months abroad

I was told that as soon as I returned longterm to the UK - i.e. registered for income tax, Council tax etc - I would count again as a UK resident and would be entitled to NHS care in the UK

UK expats in receipt of state pension can return to the UK for NHS treatment without being UK residents,
but - unless the rules have changed recently - those who have not yet reached UK pension age cannot after 3 months

Let’s have a competition. Name the most horrible foreign governments. My top three:
Saudi Arabia
USA (under Trump)
Russia (not implementing adequate sanctions)
OMG we’re cosying up to all of them!

Among the things i would castigate people for, are cozying up to horrible foreign governments

Yes, indeed. We still don't know where Arron Bank's £8m donation (the largest in British history) came from. And one of his co-conspirators, Andy Wigmore, worked for the Leave campaign while simultaneously being paid as a diplomat for a foreign state. There are also lots of questions to be answered about Farage's involvement with Wikileaks.

Fine upstanding patriots of course