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Brexit

Why didn't we get facts like this in advance?

410 replies

Somewhereovertheroad · 16/01/2019 14:07

HMRC projects additional Brexit red tape will cost UK businesses £6.5 billion/year. NHS estimates cost of satisfying new visa requirements on behalf of staff at £490 million/year.
*
That's nearly £7 billion in annual Brexit costs, or close to the £9 billion we pay as EU members!*

Why wasn't the homework done so we could have known things like this in advance?

assuming it's true

OP posts:
ToEarlyForDecorations · 16/01/2019 14:09

Because it wasn't written on the side of a bus.

SalrycLuxx · 16/01/2019 14:10

Well, some we couldn’t know ;and give figures for) as we had no indication from government whether they planned to implement fees.

But on the whole, we did know. Experts warned us (and were told to stfu and that hey we’re just ‘Project Fear’ mongering)

TheNumberfaker · 16/01/2019 14:11

Dismissed as project fear?

recently · 16/01/2019 14:12

I think the question should be why were people gullible enough to think Brexit would save money? Surely it is obvious that ripping up a huge trade agreement and coming out of a decades long partnership and starting from scratch was NEVER going to be a money-saving option. Brexit will be making us poorer for decades to come.

SanJelliChino · 16/01/2019 14:18

Speaking as an ardent Remainer - because the Remain campaign was woefully complacent - and even though some individual Remainers said many times that bureaucracy would increase not lessen post-Brexit and that the amount we pay to be in the EU is recouped many times over by the trade and other benefits we get out of it, none of this information seemed to be heard, nor was it highlighted in the media, or converted in to clever slogans.

To be fair the information on both sides was lacking in terms of reliable detail. I think this was partly owing to the fact that certain members of the press and certain politicians were so ignorant about the way EU institutions work, that they weren't able to ask the right questions and and lazily accepted "myths" that had been written about bendy bananas in the right wing press by the likes of Bojo and friends for the past twenty years and didn't have the nouse or knowledge to challenge them.

SanJelliChino · 16/01/2019 14:21

Oh and the fact that the many negative impact assessments (the few that were carried out anyway!) were kept private until they were made to become public and then were severely redacted on publication.

recently · 16/01/2019 14:26

Oh and the fact that the many negative impact assessments (the few that were carried out anyway!) were kept private until they were made to become public and then were severely redacted on publication.
Yes, WHY aren't we allowed to know?

OhYouBadBadKitten · 16/01/2019 14:27

All of the above. Remain did try and get what was known out there, but we were shouted down. Also, it was a really crap idea to hold a referendum before a full analysis was undertaken.

1tisILeClerc · 16/01/2019 14:30

As said many (and loads more) of the facts WERE out there but you got the shouts of 'project Fear' but strangely being allowed to just say that without being challenged as to WHY it might have been wrong (which it probably isn't).
You can always argue whether it will be a 7 Billion 'loss' or a 3 Billion 'loss', the number doesn't actually matter, it is the fact that ALL reports said LOSS which is vital.

CorbynsAnorak · 16/01/2019 14:33

I think partly because nobody, including the Brexiteers, actually though it was going to happen, so nobody bothered thinking about it too much. It was a terrible gamble played by Cameron who was so arrogant that he didn’t even bother to investigate what Brexit might actually entail before calling a referendum.

GrammarTeacher · 16/01/2019 14:35

We were told. Repeatedly. But apparently people don't like to listen to 'experts' any more. So instead we told (often on here) that it was Project Fear. And England would be the land of milk and honey afterwards.

1tisILeClerc · 16/01/2019 14:38

{Yes, WHY aren't we allowed to know?}
Because having started the ball rolling those who did and do know that it is a really bad idea have been silenced.
There are something over 60 Non Disclosure Agreements, that very significant people have been forced to sign.
The head of Nissan in Sunderland, all the other car makers, Airbus, various unions all of whom are aware of the disaster but they risk prison if they tell anyone. From the few examples I have said, that represents the livelihood of maybe 3 million people in well paying jobs. Some companies have said they will close for 2-4 weeks from March 29th for 'maintenance'. Only they know whether they will actually restart after that period or issue tens of thousands of P45's.

FishesaPlenty · 16/01/2019 14:49

The head of Nissan in Sunderland, all the other car makers, Airbus, various unions all of whom are aware of the disaster but they risk prison if they tell anyone

Nobody 'risks prison' for breaking a non-disclosure agreement, it's a civil agreement between two parties with the only feasible penalties being financial or the loss of some particular privilege or right - as specified by the agreement.

NothingOnTellyAgain · 16/01/2019 14:53

Because the whole thing was done very quickly and casually in order to meet an election promise and it was not foreseen that yes could be the answer

Compare length of time UK had to think about Brexit before vote & what info was available against scottish indepedence where apaprently they got a year to run in with impartial facts in extensive booklet throuhg door,stacks of independent analysis etc on tv and so on

We got bojo standing next to a bus with a pack of lies on it and a lot of general incoherence.

NeverTwerkNaked · 16/01/2019 14:54

Because the remain campaign was too complacent.

NothingOnTellyAgain · 16/01/2019 14:54

Oh and a couple of months or whatever it was it was rushed.

No time for the campaigns to really get going / challenge some of the wilder claims etc

Also it allowed a small group of self interested poeple to control the messaging.

1tisILeClerc · 16/01/2019 14:55

OK, serious consequences if you want to be so picky.
NOTHING is 'black and white' in this disaster.
The point is and remains, the fate of a lot of the UK population is being withheld.
The few hundreds of losses being announced from time to time are just the tip of the iceberg.

Somewhereovertheroad · 16/01/2019 14:58

As a business person if I was thinking of leaving or entering a contract I would be doing something along the lines of a SWOT analysis (strengths/ weaknesses/ opportunities/ threats) and I would take advice. Consult with others etc

It just strikes me that the homework really wasn't done. Who looked at the various outcome scenarios?

It all seems to be have been based on a false premise of Europe can't afford not to do a deal with us!

OP posts:
NeverTwerkNaked · 16/01/2019 15:00

And any “experts” were shouted down by Brexit propagandists.

Even on mumnset.

Somewhereovertheroad · 16/01/2019 15:03

I also think the UK doesn't really know how to do s referendum. The question should have been much more specific.

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GrammarTeacher · 16/01/2019 15:10

We're a representative democracy we shouldn't have referenda at all.

winewont · 16/01/2019 15:16

Remainers voted for the known, Leavers voted for the unknown. From discussions I’ve had with Leavers some really thought the consequences would just be more money for the NHS and lower immigration and oh the intangible “sovereignty”. It scares me that these people have a vote

BackInTime · 16/01/2019 15:33

Any negatives were shouted down as ‘project fear’. Any mention of Northern Ireland and the and risk to the GFA was dismissed as ‘project fear’. People heard what the wanted to hear they believed that leaving the EU was easy and would make their life better. Anyone who looked into this a bit further knew this wasn’t the case. Easy to fall for when the EU has been vilified as the cause of most the problems in this country for a very long time.

Ucangourownwoo · 16/01/2019 15:38

Because the remain campaign was too complacent

Yep, it’s remains fault...we’re the idiots ones who voted for it. Oh wait...

Gaballout · 16/01/2019 15:41

I don't think HMRC and NHS estimates are really facts ;)

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