Any Brexiters who have changed your minds....?

[onlyconnect]

If you voted Brexit but would now like to remain, could you call loudly for a second referendum please?
I'm a remainer and see the obvious problems with remainers asking for a second referendum but if former Brexiters were to ask, it would have legitimacy surely.

1tisILeClerc - what future? You just said upthread that you don't even live here.

Sorry but that is incredibly ignorant. Do you really think that Brits living abroad won't be affected? That the lives we've built current and future aren't at serious risk? For the first time in my life I'm having to take anti-anxiety meds because of fucking brexit.

It's a matter of national security

The people risking our security are you fools wanting a no-deal Brexit so our security services and Police lose instant access to various EU databases and we revert back to paper and fax request... great!

Some UK 'forces access these DB's 100s of times per week, crime like terrorism knows no borders.

Leaving the EU risks NI returning to violence once again but it seems getting out of the EU has no price you people don't mind other people paying!

The cost of the Brexit mess is being borne by every citizen across Europe, often in the form of increased taxes. I have friends in many countries, why would I wish their lives to be negatively impacted by this stupidity? It will be a long time before the UK Gov reveals how much has been wasted by this exercise.

I live in the north. No I don't live in the south. I work with the poor and disenfranchised. I support and help immigrants. My career is focused on helping and educating those who have little choice and little chance. I am very successful and have helped to get lots of poor people and immigrants into university. Is that what you wanted to know anonymousobserver?

I don't patronise poor or uneducated students I expect the best in terms of argument and focus. I get it by not treating them like fools unless they act like idiots. Act like a fool, make arguments like an idiot and I will point it out.

Some one who I don't know makes a comment about a hypothetical army turning on U.K. citizens in an entirely made up situation with no context or detail and I treat the whole idea with contempt. Hmmmmm

Provide evidence, detail or a realistic context until then "National security my arse".

Moussemoose - well done you.

Regarding the comment about the EU Army turning on UK citizens, ask 1tisILeClerc. She was the one who made it.

By the way, Moussemoose, I don't think you answered my question. I'll ask you again.

If the EU is just a trading bloc, why does it need an army?

I voted to remain but would now vote to leave.

The EU was never just about being a trading bloc, however much the UK wanted it to be. In that case, they could have stayed with EFTA which the UK was a founder member of.

So why does the EU need an army, Peregrina?

Give it to me in plain terms. I'm thick, you know.

Moussemoose - ah I see now. You work in the public sector, sucking on the teat of the taxpayer, supporting immigrants and hence have a vested interest in continuing with the EU and it's FoM policy.

Just like all the Remainers I know - voted in their own personal financial interests. The Leavers I know voted for the good of their country, even if it meant hardship for themselves.

My take is that the EU isn't a trading block, you should know this, it never has been, certainly not since we joined.

No one country (outside of a super power) can design and build a stealth fighter nor can one country defend itself against the Russians etc either militarily or in cyber warfare so we collaborate, in defence that is done by NATO but Europe faces uncertain times with Trumps America plus there is the on going migrant crisis, the Med policing is done with an EU force isn't it?

As i understand it, this isn't going to be a EU military force but rather member states providing troops etc to put under a joint EU command, much like NATO and what is currently happening in other spheres.

The UK being a part of such a force and command structures is an excellent bulwark against any concerns expressed on here, we wont have that input now... well done!

The EU haven't got an army, I don't see them getting one, any time soon either.

What about you @anonymousobserver you make snarky comments to others, well what about you? Where do you live? What do you do to make life better for others? You can't asked the question then provide nothing yourself.

Personally, I don't think the EU does need an army. If we remain in the EU I would work against it.

However, I can think of examples when EU forces should and could work together. NATO can not be expected to respond to purely European issues. The EU could formalise the way it's armed forces work together, similar to UN forces, NATO, or the allied armies in WW2.

People who support the EU have different opinions to me, and that's ok. People who support the EU generally can still be critical of it and want it to improve. I don't think the EU is perfect, far from it. I think the EU needs reform.

On the whole though we will do better in than out.

OutsideInTheGarden

Not the sharpest knife in the draw are you? making a range of wild accusations (yet again), perhaps Mouse assists immigrants from outside of the EU, given sanctuary here by our own Government?

Few EU citizens need help, they steal our jobs remember lol!

jasjas1973 - "Europe faces uncertain times with Trumps America"

That has to be the stupidest thing I have ever read on here.

OutsideInTheGarden put it more politely than me, but she was right. You are all as thick as shit.

Moussemoose - what difference does it make what I do to make life better for others?

I thought the topic of discussion was Brexit, not how wonderful you are.

Europe faces uncertain times with Trumps America"
It's ridiculous, it's not just Europe, it's the whole world, the mans a bigoted arse wipe

Yep sucking off the teat of the tax payer. Unfortunately, the tax payer has forgotten to give me a pay rise in the last 6 years. I'm liven' it large on the wage I get.

Yes I support immigrants and I am proud to do so. I see no shame in that - do you? Most of the immigrants I work with are asylum seekers and not from EU countries.

You couldn't be more wrong implying I'm in this for my own financial interest. I'll be fine which ever way the vote goes. My partner has a nice secure job. My kids are looking at secure careers. My mortgage is paid off. I'm alright.

I care about the people who are being royally fucked over by austerity and for whom Brexit will be the last straw. You?

Have you namechanged InsideInTheGarden, and you have been posting for years on all manner of topics? Alternatively has your shift just logged on, which is what it sounds like?

@anonymousobserver just wondering why you ask questions of others. They reply. You snark at them and then answer the type of questions you asked.

Ohhhhhhh I forget - leaver - you get to ask questions, make stupid comments, blame others and leave. Are you a panda as well?

Oh and by the way - "work against" the EU Army.

How would you do that then, mastermind?

How would you do that then, mastermind?

What are we back in school? Are you actually 14 or is that how you post.

The same way any citizen in a democracy works against something. Commenting, voting, writing to my MP or MEP, joining a pressure group the usual stuff. But you know that don't you?

What good would any of the above do you?

The EU will be making the laws and your MP will have no say.

You will not be a citizen in a democracy.

{Regarding the comment about the EU Army turning on UK citizens, ask 1tisILeClerc. She was the one who made it.}
I did not say that EU army troops would be turned against UK citizens. Indeed I would expect 'rotation' of member countries troops and manouvres such that they all work together as a team, thus UK troops would be elsewhere in Europe and thus placed to 'fight back'.
There could be an instance of this if there was to be a total war again but at that point there would be several superpowers joining in and the end really would be nigh. Nothing in life can be totally ruled out.

Well I could make an argument about the use of the term 'citizen' in a monarchy.

But, we have MPs and MEPs, the Council of Ministers is made up of elected representatives and I have some faith that general elections in this country are free and fair.

I have the same 'say' as any other member of the EU, that is how a democratic system works.