What Do You Think Will Happen On Brexit Day?

[KennDodd]

Do you think street parties, riots, candlelit vigils, what?

It seems perhaps a touch racist to insinuate that the people from the rest of the EU weren't bright, motivated and educated. Also in my personal experience plain wrong.

Here is the definition of Racism:

1. a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human racial groups determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to dominate others or that a particular racial group is inferior to the others.

1. a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.

1. hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

No where have a suggested we exclude Europeans from applying to work in the UK, just as everyone must.
I feel the free movement of Europeans, at the expense of anyone else to have leanings of “racism”

Frank nobody here is casually using the word racist about leavers. I prefer words like ultranationalism, populism, authoritarianism, nativism and opposition to immigration.

There are people from all the countries and continents you list living in this country. They are either refugees or have good jobs, or they are from commonwealth countries. Our government could also control EU migrants under existing legislation, but they can't be bothered.

frank I've tried moving to another country whose language isn't my own and settling there for a time, even with a company's support it is bloody hard. Anyone who is able to move to the the UK and do this is demonstrating they are bright and motivated. The labour shortages in this country aren't just for educated jobs which is why concerns are being raised about fruit picking for example. I have no issue with labour being brought in from around the globe but don't see why leaving the EU needs to be part of a policy of insuring that the UK plc is a globally attractive employer.

I've just read the full thread and the only person raising perceived racism is FrankUnderwoodsWife.

The thread in general is an interesting discussion, now in danger of being derailed.

IdahoJones thanks for that.
The numbers of so called EU nationals coming here has almost stopped completely, the numbers leaving are huge, most citing racism as their reason for going.

I wonder how many women especially mothers and carers would leave if they had financial and social autonomy on or before so called 'brexit day'. I've seen a lot of posts with women voicing well sourced brexit issues and being stuck because their partners' don't/ can't hear what they are saying. With so little representation in parliament and the media our voices are drowned out.

The burden of surviving this 'brexit' will fall on women's shoulders.

I reckon the sun will rise in the West and set in the East.

If the U.K. implodes, a case of a GE soon after and JC will get in, he will then deliver on all the promises he has made.

Don’t see a problem with that 😳😬

Ok IdahoJones, let’s bring it back to the subject in hand:

I believe the UK will be absolutely fine post Brexit, just as we were before we joined the union.

I am sure the 3,000 civil servants who are working full time on a smooth transition would be delighted to hear there is so little faith in them.

The scaremongering and pessimism on this thread makes my heart literally ache for the millions who died during the wars to give is the freedom we enjoy today.

I am genuinely curious as to why when we are the 5th largest economy in the world,

www.weforum.org/agenda/2018/04/the-worlds-biggest-economies-in-2018/

will spectacularly self implode? Our service sector is revered, why will it suddenly come crashing down around our ears?

I personally believe exiting the union will give us increased opportunities to export what the UK is good at.

We could have spent the money this has cost so far on our destroyed infrastructure during the last 3 years rather than the over billions that has been lost since June 2016.

What a stupid waste of energy money and time this has been.

Oh god 'before we joined the union' it was all rosy and wonderful and will be forever after. It took 40 years to create and build all the trade and ties, mmmmm maybe it will take another 40 years to unravel them - do you really think we will become more prosperous in that time?

I am so angry that I am being force-ably removed from something I desperately want to remain a part of.

As for what happens on the day? I don't think complete chaos or doom but I do think a very, long, slow decline for many years after.

Woman, i actually agree with you. DC put us into this mess, and I am furious with our government (Conservatives), for being so self serving, they only think of their careers, as opposed to what they have been hired to do, which is represent their electorate.

But, I’d rather work with the crappy hand we’ve been dealt, as opposed to throwing in our cards.

Frank why would you carry on with something that is so obviously going to end badly just because you have come this far? Sunk cost fallacy? We don't have to go ahead with it although I do agree that there would be civil unrest. What a feckin mess.

Frank - I think it is very disingenuous to imply that worry over our fate after Brexit somehow means we don't appreciate the sacrifice our young men made in the world wars.

One of the reasons the EU came about was a desire to end the bloody historical conflicts in Europe. To ensure they didn't happen again. Churchill himself talked of a closer union with Europe. A feeling of we are stronger if we work together rather than against each other.

For 40 years we have become more prosperous and safer due to our union. That's why we have one of the richest economies in the world. Now we are going to walk away from all of the treaties that keep us safe, fed, trading etc etc etc. To embark on what? No one seems to know.

I don't think you realise how much of our day to day life is intrinsically linked to our membership of the EU. Our services that you talk of will be affected by our removal from this. That is why people are worried. We don't have a clue what will replace it.

I remember life before we joined the union because I am old. It was shit. It really was.

The scaremongering and pessimism on this thread makes my heart literally ache for the millions who died during the wars to give is the freedom we enjoy today.

What?

Your heart aches for those who died in the wars because people are very worried about Brexit?

Did I read that correctly?

I am sure the 3,000 civil servants who are working full time on a smooth transition would be delighted to hear there is so little faith in them.

Top civil servants have resigned because they think it is impossible to get a good deal. The Civil service are not happy about Brexit, please don't pretend that they are.

Did I read that correctly?

I gather that nobody ought to be worried (or even discuss worries) about something that any particular poster supports, because people died in a war 70+ years ago.

We could try this approach on every thread on MN.

"How dare you worry about washing your towels after every shower? Don't you know people died in the war?"

We could try this approach on every thread on MN

@FrankUnderwoodsWife

I believe the UK will be absolutely fine post Brexit, just as we were before we joined the union

Before the UK joined the Union, it was the sick man of Europe. 3-days work for 3-days pay. Power cuts. Strikes. Poverty. Industry leaders, Unions and the Government at each others throats and all adapt at making one bad decision after another. Meanwhile Germany, France and Italy experienced 'Wirkschaftswunder'- huge industrial and private growth - as they rebuilt themselves out of the ruins of WW2.

Johnson, Rees-Mogg and Raab want the UK to go back to this - so I don't share your view of post-Brexit Britain.

I am sure the 3,000 civil servants who are working full time on a smooth transition would be delighted to hear there is so little faith in them

They are constrained by the international laws that govern all interaction between nations. E.g. the one that says if you are no longer part of the EU's Open Skies Agreement, your aircraft can no longer fly. Multiply by 750 Agreements and you see the scale of the problem. They are also constrained by the entirely logical position that the EU has repeatedly stated - a country no longer in the club cannot enjoy the same benefits as a member, and cannot be given a better deal than members themselves enjoy. May, Johnson, Raab et al are still insisting that the UK is special.

The scaremongering and pessimism on this thread makes my heart literally ache for the millions who died during the wars to give is the freedom we enjoy today

Apologies if you find my posts explaining the negative impacts of Brexit, based on my own experience, to be scaremongering and pessimistic. Millions died in wars to ensure that right-wing popularism and hate did not dominate Europe. Read the Daily Mail, listen to Farage and compare with the factless tub-thumping of the 1930s right-wing parties to understand why so many people think that these people are dangerous and are not to be trusted. The UK currently enjoys a huge raft of freedoms thanks to the sacrifices of the two wars - but the UK has been conned through the Brexit vote into giving these away.

I am genuinely curious as to why when we are the 5th largest economy in the world

The UK has retained this position due to the billions of pounds pumped into the economy by foreign investors and the skills and working practices brought in by foreign companies. Airbus, Honda, Nissan, Mitsubishi etc are in the UK because the UK is part of the EU. Ford and the Japansese have spelled out the consequences of leaving - no company can remain in a location where it cannot make a profit.

will spectacularly self implode? Our service sector is revered, why will it suddenly come crashing down around our ears

No food, no transport links, no free access to the largest economic bloc on the planet and no agreements in place with anyone else. No international access for service industries. No agreement regarding how disputes are settled. No willingness to compromise. No self-awareness. A good recipe for self-implosion.

I personally believe exiting the union will give us increased opportunities to export what the UK is good at

Manufacturing killed off - as actually promoted as a good thing by Minford and Raab. Agriculture destroyed. Services locked out of the rest of the world. What exactly do you propose the UK exports? Services employ fewer than a million people - what exactly do you propose the other 59 million do?

The scaremongering and pessimism on this thread makes my heart literally ache for the millions who died during the wars to give is the freedom we enjoy today
I am genuinely curious as to why when we are the 5th largest economy in the world

You didnt fight in either WW, so what relevance is it to this thread?
As to remembering the dead of both wars, it is because Europe didnt want a 3rd European war they formed co-operation over trade after WW2, which led to the EEC/EU also, judging how the Europeans look after their war memorials and honour the dead of ALL nations, i could argue they have better understanding of the terror of war than we do.

We have become (on some measures) the 5th or 6th richest economy whilst being IN the EU, we as you rightly say, have freedom, whilst IN the EU.

Do find it rather scary that despite thinking we ve been dealt a poor hand, you still wish to continue down this, at the very least, very uncertain path, not least risking peace in NI.

My father fought in the war. My mother's uncle died in Coventry during that dreadful night. My father was already dead by the time of the referendum but my mother wasn't. She voted Remain.
Because she knew what a dishonourable shit show it was.

Almost no one who voted in the Referendum fought in the war There was a tiny number of veterans who were/are still alive in 2016 and they did not uniformly vote Leave. They knew the devastation that war brings.

My dad was 2 when WW2 started. He is now 81. He voted Remain.

Hopefully this link has its intended purpose; to inject some lighthearted humour please don't shoot me

mellongoose

I don't think we will crash so much as start a long slow decline, like a pp.
My grandparents who are now dead, but all contributed to the war in way or another did not tell me that they had done this to ensure we could become as politically isolated as possible from our neighbours to enable a group of extreme politicians to gain as much power as possible. Neither did any of them ever once say to me, " I didn't fight in the war to have you worried about ..." Freedom includes the right to worry about what I want to and to be as pessimistic/realistic about the stupidity currently being undertaken as I fancy.
There must have been many more people who did fight in WW2 voting when the UK voted to enter Europe than voted in the last referendum.