Westministers: Operation Over The Cliff

[RedToothBrush]

Bit late and didn't realise the last thread was so close to the end... so this is a very quick OP

What do you think the secret continency plan name the government have in place for the No Deal?

Suggestions Please

Some details. No mention of shooting people.
Cut and pasted:
The first phase is a mandatory one-month placement with a focus on civic culture, which the government says will "enable young people to create new relationships and develop their role in society".

Voluntary teaching and working with charities are among the options being looked at, alongside traditional military preparation with the police, fire service or army.

The second phase is a voluntary placement of at least three months and up to a year, in which young people will be encouraged to serve "in an area linked to defence and security" - but again, they could opt to carry out volunteer work linked to heritage, the environment or social care.

I think France has plenty of bad ideas, I think the EU has plenty of flaws. I'm not seeing many links between thinking leaving the EU is a a disaster for the UK and supporting all that France does.

Actually Macron idea is the follow up of what is already in place - there is very little about doing any work at all in the military.
It’s all about working for the community and charities.

I’m struggling to see how you could link that with Hitler Youth. It seems to be closer to an extended DoE.

Not that I think that encouraging a month of volunteer work is a bad idea.

All countries have an element of 'bad' about them.
Unfortunately the UK is escalating it into an 'art form' at the moment.

I was incorrect on first post of mine about France, it is 1+3 months minimum, or up to a year in total.

I'm not a Macron hater but I think he has made a mistake - it's not a terrible idea, but (extremely) costly and difficult to implement. Who pays to house and feed young people while they are doing voluntary service? Who supervises them? How do you keep young people on side? It's easy enough to coerce 16 year olds (they already have to do a ridiculous and pointless day with the army) but good luck doing that with older students, especially if they are having to pay for the privilege (rent and bills will still have to be paid).

I think it will take years to roll it out (if it ever happens: Macron isn't guaranteed a second term).

We have some savings in £. Does anyone have a moment to explain why it might be worth moving them into Euros?

Unless you're planning to spend euros there are probably better ways of protecting the value of your savings. I bought precious metal ETFs ahead of the referendum (good currency hedge because quoted in $) - but I work in a related area so was comfortable with the risk.

Tbh I think you need to know what you are doing before you start putting savings into forex or commodities. You'd be better off buying units in an investment fund, if you are worried about the pound tanking you can always put some money in a fund that invests in Europe or Asia.

Mistigirl

Why wouldn’t they just do their service locally? That’s what we did at school and it was a basically identical programme.

The Spanish infrastructure firm that manages and owns 25% of heathrow will relocate its international head office from the UK to Amsterdam as a result of Brexit.

www.theguardian.com/business/2018/jun/26/ferrovial-to-move-international-hq-out-of-uk-because-of-brexit-heathrow-netherlands

BigChocFrenzy Wed 27-Jun-18 06:33:54
"The UK will have its turd and eat it."

How about, "The UK will have its humble pie and eat it".

Actually, the contingency plan is called "LOOK! CORBYN!"

Why wouldn’t they just do their service locally? That’s what we did at school and it was a basically identical programme.

With whom? Housed where? Supervised by whom? With what kind of adult-to-student ratios? How will those adult supervisors be trained? Macron is talking about a month's residential for 16 year olds. In the French town where I live, there are something like 3000 senior high school students aged 15 to 18 (for a total population of maybe 10,000). 2000 in my son's school alone. Many of those kids live in small villages or hamlets in the large rural basin that the schools serve. A significant number are from extremely deprived backgrounds and/or have behavioural issues (the technical lycée is notorious for violence and drug-dealing). It's hard enough to find these kids a week of work experience in Y11, let alone a month of charity work with accommodation attached ...

Macron has his hands full on this one.

/end of off topic

Place marking

Had a chat with ds1 about brexit last night....till gone 11pm!

I have no doubt his generation (he is 15) will reverse this madness....but at what cost??

Germany had conscription until a few years after the USSR collapsed:

18-yr-olds had a choice of
either 1 year (or might have been 2) in the military
or about 6 years as volunteer backup (plus annual training sessions) for the emergency services - fire, rescue, flood, other disaster
and
iirc, miltary conscriptees were only to defend German territory and provide emergency backup during floods etc , not for any foreign wars

The major disadvantage of conscription is the high cost (for the taxpayer)
Those conscripted into military service don't have essential bills to pay - they live in barracks, same conditions for rich or poor.
The UK needs to save money, not spend many billions extra

It has many advantages (for those countries which can afford it):

• social cohesion - often the only time that mc and uc kids have to live and work with wc ones. That is thought to be a major factor in why WW2 brought social change & the welfare state in the UK and why over the last 40 years the better off 50%, especially the ruling class, have lost so much empathy for anyone else

• no living or family memory of the rest of the population as fellow humans

• working as a team - important in today's individualistic & quite selfish society

• it makes kids more self-reliant & mature, having to do everything themselves - especially valuable for spoiled snowflakes

• extra manpower for emergencies, whether natural disasters, or for defence.
  It was essential for continental Europe while the USSR, with its massive forces, was around.
  Not so much with the much smaller conventional forces of Russia (and their massive defence cuts due to Putin's kleptocracy wrecking the economy)

But imo should only be for 18+, who are adults, not 16+ who need more supervision

Put a 16 year old in a tent in the middle of nowhere and their resourcefulness starts to appear about 4 hours after their mobile phone battery goes flat.

Actually you'll find they mope about for another 2 hours after the batteries go flat, giving you lip moaning before they get too bored and then go off and create trouble not doing what they should be.
#thejoyofscoutcamp

www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/eu-workers-employed-in-ni-drops-by-one-quarter-since-brexit-vote-1.3545757?mode=amp&__twitter_impression=true
EU workers employed in NI drops by one quarter since Brexit vote
Labour force estimates reveal downward trend in EU nationals working in the North

@RTB. As an ex Scout leader I agree. If they really are alone the realisation that things have to get done dawns on them eventually, especially if there is no one to give lip to!

+ social cohesion - often the only time that mc and uc kids have to live and work with wc ones.

I am just reading an autobiography of a man who was forced to work on the Burma railway by the Japanese. He makes much the same point: some men who had enlisted as Privates, showed leadership qualities and were respected by all for this, some of the Officers were shown to be lacking and the authority which should have come with rank was lost.

+ working as a team - important in today's individualistic & quite selfish society

as long as you remember that "team working" is all about fucking off to a hotel for a couple of days, and hiring an events company to run some "exercises" like "bomb disposal". It most emphatically is not about working with a complete mix of strangers to ensure someone with a spinal injury is lifted safely from a pool. Or so I was told when asked how my lifeguarding qualification (which I took aged 50) suited me for team working.

Does anyone have any advice/tips on speaking at a parish council meeting?

I have to go and convince our (all male, all white, all over 50) parish council to give me room in a new community building run the foodbank from...

Argh....

What party MrsRRR? Some will be more agreeable than others on party lines alone.

Soften some of them up first before the meeting.

@Perigrina, is that 'The Railwayman'?
I don't think Mr Macron's ideas about working as a team and social cohesion has much to do with going off to hotels, but being 'coerced' to see the wider aspects of your local community is much to be applauded. Even 'visiting the old biddies' at a care home will teach them a considerable amount about real life. I have no idea what the elderly care sector in France looks like but for teenagers to witness what may become of them in later years will be enlightening and may spur them on to be more considerate.