Not the Brexit Arms

[bearbehind]

Since BrexitArmsLandlady says she isn't starting anymore threads here's a place to discuss Brexit developments for those that still want to.

It never ceases to amaze me what a shambles this is.

The cabinet still can't even agree what we want, let alone what we're going to get.

I was just being ignorant, Frumpety. I didn’t know long-term palliative care was possible at home. As you say, it very much depends on circumstances as you need someone to administer it - which is a problem. I think the pharmacies are listed online.

Pro-Brexiters concede that staying in the CU into the next decade is the ‘only viable option’

No shit!

So much for JRM and BJ taking the reins and delivering for you Leavers!

So much for ‘taking back control’

We are going to leave the EU but still be paying them and abiding by their rules, just with no say them, for the foreseeable future.

Well played Leavers!

Bodoni depends on what you mean by 'long term' ? End of life medications are usually used in the last weeks/days/hours of life to alleviate any symptoms associated with dying. These can be given as stat doses as an injection or often via a syringe driver for better management of symptoms. These would normally be administered by community nurses , specialist palliative nurses and GP's if the person is at home.

Also people can have a palliative diagnosis and live for months or years and be symptom free or are able to manage their symptoms. The list you mention regards the medications that can be used when someone is 'actively' dying, so in the final couple of weeks, but more likely the last few days and hours.

Thanks for explaining, Frumpety!

People in the UK are offered 3 places to die , hospital , home or hospice,

you forgot the streets, the alleys, the towpaths and the underpasses.

Your welcome Bodoni hope it didn't come across as patronising ? Was trying for factual

DG I wish you weren't right but sadly you are

I think even the most ardent leaver must now accept there will be no Brexit dividend, for either the NHS or the replacement forobjective one funding many poorer areas received.

you forgot the streets, the alleys, the towpaths and the underpasses.

Does sound a bit Billy Bragg or possibly the Levellers.

...and how on earth can the UK get the hump because the EU wants to exclude us from the EU Satellite Project; Galileo?

Does sound a bit Billy Bragg or possibly the Levellers

funnily enough I see the Levellers are playing the Mosely Folk Festival .

I saw them in '94 at the Brixton Academy

Never got into the Braggster, but who can forget Red Wedge ?

Saw the Levellers in Bradford similar era to you DG , fantastic musicians.

The Red Wedge , now that is a blast from the past ...... I give you the original, never too early for a bit of early propaganda

Jas because when we said we wanted out , we didn't actually mean out, out, of course , we meant out in a more fluid way , so in really, but with an out feel to it

^^ the above neatly sums up all current Brexit negotiations I think

Has anyone on either side, started to doubt their vote?

I am, just come back from Mallorca, chatting to the hotel staff who come from all over Spain about super hi unemployment, low wages, then the Italian crisis and the EUs complete lack of response to it (its been brewing away for years) and for us after brexit the EU's inability to even begin to change following our vote to leave.

To me, the rich elite across Europe are getting richer and we are getting way poorer, with far less opportunities than any post war generation.

So, yes i want an EU but maybe not this one......... or is it national governments fault?

Jas in what way do you believe the EU should respond to the national issues in Spain and Italy ?
Why should 27 countries change because one voted to leave ?

Is it national governments faults ? The vast majority of the time it is.

I also think that the British tend to make the mistake of viewing other countries in Europe through the lens of our own history. I know that I am fairly ignorant of the relatively recent pasts of both countries you mention, not having studied history much past the Vikings. We in the UK have little recent experience of civil war and dictatorships.

Should really have included the words 'happening in England' at the end of that last sentence.

Perhaps the concept of a single EU/Euro economic policy for rich nations like Germany is not suitable for poorer Southern European countries?
If Italy ends up leaving the Euro or even the EU, that will be extremely damaging for the EU, more so than Brexit..... it will embolden the right wing eurosceptic parties throughout Europe, maybe more countries will also then leave and that could well bring about the very things you mention in your last paragraph.

Immigration: the Greek and Med migrations have had a huge affect on these countries, with little or no help from the EU.

The GFC has given business a heaven sent opportunity to slash wages and increase profits for themselves and shareholders, not just in the UK but across the EU, what has been the EU's response to this? nothing at all!!! youth unemployment rates of 40 or 50% are completely unsustainable....

The EU said itself back in 2016 it needed to become more relevant to peoples lives, it has completely failed to do so, whilst i am sure GDPR is a worthwhile exercise its really just window dressing.

Why is it that even 2 years after Brexit, the opinion polls show little appetite for reversing brexit ?

I also think that the British tend to make the mistake of viewing other countries in Europe through the lens of our own history.

That'll be the minority of Brits who understand any history at all. As for knowing anything about the rest of the world and it's history.

How many people know that the ECHR (for example) was a British idea, promoted by Winston Churchill ? Far fewer than the number of people who think they know that it's a dastardly invention of furriners designed to spread furrin ideas.

I just returned from Vancouver, where local housing and financial investment policy have allowed wealthy foreigners (mostly from Hong Kong, Taiwan and most recently China) to buy up enormous amounts of the local real estate as investments and push many Vancouverites not just out of the city, but right out of the entire south western coastal region altogether.

Strangely enough, no-one there is blaming the EU for this global trend of hyper-wealthy elitists inflating urban asset prices in developed nations.

DG I count myself in the majority unfortunately.

Bedtime reading at the moment is Stuart Maconie's Hope and Glory, I am probably a bit more centrist Mum than he is, a paragraph I read last night really resonated with me and I would like to share it ;

Four successive prime ministers, the giants of their age - Wilson, Heath, Callaghan and yes, Margaret Thatcher were each and all the bright, motivated children of the working and middle classes who succeeded through ability and talent. They came along and made that dreadful old guard of etiolated aristos like Alec Douglas-Home look weird, silly and prehistoric. A decade into the twenty-first century, that weird, silly, prehistoric, dreadful old guard is back. Back and in power where it has always believed it belonged.

Discuss.......

Jas
Immigration: the Greek and Med migrations have had a huge affect on these countries, with little or no help from the EU

Remind me what the UK has done to help? How many of these people have we taken in, say , compared to that rich country Germany ?

Tonight is my 'Friday' night so I give you a bit of a classic and pertinent to the Maconie quote.

You are missing the point Frumpety, the EU is getting the blame and its not just immigration either.

I d argue that the EU will be more nimble, more able to respond to crisis without the UK in there, blocking and prevaricating.

Wilson, Heath, Callaghan and yes, Margaret Thatcher ................who succeeded through ability and talent

...ability and talent??? for what exactly? all have overseen the decline of the UK..... of course T.May is a prime example of mediocrity rising to the top, without a clue what to do when there, much like at least 3 of the 4 names you mention.,,, all have contributed in sowing the seeds of discontent/decline which finally led to brexit.