Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Brexit

Westministenders: One for the Women

977 replies

RedToothBrush · 08/03/2018 10:23

Just remember that women are more likely to be worried about Brexit.

Their women's and workers rights are more at risk from departure from the EU, the ECJ and potentially the EHCR.
They are more likely to be worried as EU citizens in the UK due to taking time to have and raise families.
They are more likely to have been badly affected by austerity and an economic downturn will hit them first.
If they are leavers they are more likely to have changed their minds.
They are less likely to be MPs so have less representation.
They are more likely to be feeling politically unrepresented by any party and unsure of who they will vote for at the next election.
They are more likely to get abuse for expressing a political opinion. Many report having been subjected to sexual harassment from political colleagues.
They are more likely to be the target of abuse on social media.
They are earn less than their political colleagues, they earn less than their media colleagues, they earn less than their business colleagues. They are less likely to be in powerful lobby groups.

Then there's #metoo

And to cap it off women's groups are finding it hard to get their voice heard, and are frequently being labelled as hysterical or bigoted for merely wanting to discuss things and be reassured that their fears are acknowledged. They are frequently dismissed as liars or over sensitive.

This is 2018.

It doesn't feel progressive. It doesn't look equal.

Brexit has more of an impact on women.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
23
thecatfromjapan · 13/03/2018 15:23

Pain Shock

DGRossetti · 13/03/2018 15:24

I do wonder what Russia's feelings are towards a potential side-effect of Brexit being - potentially - a Labour government that is isolationist and committed to clamping down on money-laundering and unregulated finance?

if we are going down the rabbit hole of analysing Brexit for cui bono from external meddling, I'm warming to my own theory that the only thing more destabilising for the UK - and the EU - than Brexit would be no Brexit. Especially if it came about in an opaque way.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 13/03/2018 15:30

It's not that dissimilar to what some people think might have happened in America DGR. Trump not winning would have allowed him to talk about election rigging etc, while forcing HRC to still combat him whilst trying to enact her agenda.

Although he's not making a bad job of subverting democracy himself, which has to be a plus for those who might have a vested interest in weakening the west.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 13/03/2018 15:31

UK will be paying Brexit 'divorce bill' until 2064, says Treasury watchdog

Office for Budget Responsibility says it still lacks 'meaningful basis to predict the precise outcome of the current negotiations with the EU'

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/uk-brexit-divorce-bill-taxpayers-deadline-treasury-obr-office-budget-responsibility-a8253751.html

DGRossetti · 13/03/2018 15:35

UK will be paying Brexit 'divorce bill' until 2064, says Treasury watchdog

We could call it lend-lease ?

DGRossetti · 13/03/2018 15:36

It's not that dissimilar to what some people think might have happened in America DGR. Trump not winning would have allowed him to talk about election rigging etc, while forcing HRC to still combat him whilst trying to enact her agenda.

It's much easier to be comfortable with whatever outcome an election is, than it is to try and swing it one way, or the other ...

thecatfromjapan · 13/03/2018 15:39

This is one of those 'too much news' days, isn't it?

Surely, surely this latest Russian death can't be ... I mean ... surely ...

I see where you're going with that no Brexit situation, DG but I have to admit, I don't care. I reckon we could style it out if the right wing media disappeared. i still don't see the political forces stacking up to make it a possibility though.

I'm quite interested in where Labour are going to go, though, given that it seems a distinct possibility they will be in power after the next GE. I can't quite work out what their position will actually be.

DrivenToDespair · 13/03/2018 16:14

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

lonelyplanetmum · 13/03/2018 16:14

As an aside from the second Russian death- very weird.

Did anyone notice deadwood Redwood was reported on the BBC in response to Hammond saying that the chancellor can afford to borrow to invest in schools, defence and the NHS, and "start to think about how we spend that Brexit bonus that comes as soon as we stop sending so much money to the EU as contributions".

OMG- does no- one brief him that our EU contribution was only 1% of GDP and is a tiny splash in the ocean of the NHS and education needs.

RedToothBrush · 13/03/2018 16:18

How many houses are owned by Russian Oligarchs?

Points to the first political leader who proposes a fire sale of investment properties of 'hostile nations' by freezing their London based bank accounts. (Only half joking here)

And then doing a deal with the EU sharpish on tax havens.

I can't see the closure of the Laundromat really getting much political support from certain quarters in practice.

The problem is that UK politicians have close ties with lots of these Russians and to all intends were compromised years ago. Whether they be innocent Russians caught up in this or Putin supporting international criminals.

What a mess.

OP posts:
DrivenToDespair · 13/03/2018 16:26

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

DGRossetti · 13/03/2018 16:26

Russia was planning infiltrating the West long before the Berlin Wall fell.

They had the Nazi playbook to follow, and knew how it would all end.

There are probably 3rd generation patsies now, who have no idea who they are really working for.

Is it a post, or a film pitch Hmm.

You decide.

("Our Man in Salisbury", has a ring about it ?)

Motheroffourdragons · 13/03/2018 16:45

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

TheElementsSong · 13/03/2018 16:45

our EU contribution was only 1% of GDP and is a tiny splash in the ocean of the NHS and education needs

I expect he knows. The lie is for the consumption of the People, who have shown themselves to be completely ignorant of, and impervious to, the reality.

RedToothBrush · 13/03/2018 16:47

David Allen Green @davidallengreen
Am no fan of May (see timeline passim), but she has got the chemical attack right, and Corbyn certainly has not.

Andrew Cooke @Dounreay262
Not sure I agree. By all means issue an ultimatum, but it doesn't look good when several MPs behind her are in receipt of oligarch money, misgotten gains of a corrupt system. And Russian money is implicated in an issue currently tearing us apart as a country.

Alan Firth @alanfirth
When May announces she has ordered a root and branch, Mueller-style investigation into Russian interference in U.K. affairs generally, she might be closer to getting it right. Certainly not before

David Allen Green @davidallengreen
Fair response.

The worst thing?

There isn't the political will for this.

That would be for the opposition to nail. Instead its about Corbyn trying to point score, when the problem is just as bad on the opposition benches as it is in the government.

May doesn't have the clout to push it through herself.

The curse of a weak leader.

And Putin, KNOWS all this.

OP posts:
OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 13/03/2018 16:52

Does the second death add to the urgency or will it be another thing that's swept under the carpet, further emboldening him?

Amber Rudd has written back to Yvette Cooper to say that the 14 suspicious deaths of Russians as reported by Buzzfeed will be reviewed. Empty rhetoric or a glimmer of hope?

thecatfromjapan · 13/03/2018 17:03

Red I believe - but this is from second-hand reports - that Corbyn's response was to explicitly argue against sanctions. So, it wasn't just that in PMQ he turned attention to funds going to the Conservatives.

Yes, indeed, as regards political will.

The most recent Russian death seems far more what we're used to - something fairly low-profile, that can be ignored. Which, of course, just begs the question, 'Why was Salisbury such a public attack?'

I honestly don't know what to make of this latest one. coming in the midst of the fall-out of Salisbury, it seems inconceivable that it will be brushed undeer the carpet - but who knows?

I thought that Gareth Williamson's death couldn't be ignored - given that he was a programmer, only on secondment to MI5. And he had a very unhappy, British, family. But it was.

RedToothBrush · 13/03/2018 17:05

is it possible that it is not the Russians who have done this?

The list of possible suspects based on it being the nerve agent said:

  1. Russia
  2. Someone who bought it off the Russians (terrorism or corruption involving Russians)
  3. Someone who nicked it off the Russians (a spy who doesn't like Russians AND the British or wants to shit stir the balance of power in Europe somehow)
  4. Someone who was given it by the Russians (So still the Russians with someone else to blame)

The list of possible suspects based on it being another nerve agent
5) The Brits
6) Anyone else with nerve agents (only if our scientists aren't very good and have misidentified the substance)

Lets discount 6). It relies on knowing that the British scientists would misidentify the substance as part of the plan.

  1. would be conceivable, but for the lack of political will. It would only occur if the secret services thought this was the only way to protect the country from something much worse (I'll leave it to your imagination to decide what). That would be a pretty big gamble, that I suspect would require the PM's approval. But in doing so, it also makes her look weak publically.

1), 2) and 4) are essentially the same

  1. Limited options here. Who has that capability? Remember it has to have come via Russia as part of this equation. US, Israel and China? Then who has a motive to do that and what is their motive?
OP posts:
Motheroffourdragons · 13/03/2018 17:09

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

DrivenToDespair · 13/03/2018 17:11

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

RedToothBrush · 13/03/2018 17:20

Mother, you are probably SUPPOSED to be confused.

If its an outside attack one of the things is to have everyone coming up with every conspiracy story under the sun, to undermine national security and public pressure and political will to investigate properly.

Even if its a home led framing of Russia, the effect is similar. Its to control you by making you fear all outside forces, but not enough to force a proper investigation.

Its interesting to see the response from both sides of the HoC. Its a big test politically.

OP posts:
Talkstotrees · 13/03/2018 17:22

Wow! This thread moves so fast. I recon I could delete twitter and news apps & I’d be equally well informed just visiting here. I’m so glad I found you Flowers

< settles in for long reading session >

thecatfromjapan · 13/03/2018 17:26

I have to say, I think poisoning Salisbury would be a step too far for the UK state. Grin And I think it would have begun to leak, even this quickly. There would be too many networks of unsecurable information, for a start.

I've made a personal decision not to go hunting for conspiracy theories - they seem to be too closely correlated with the emerging methods of civilian-based warfare. Grin

I'm going to concentrate on what happens, what is done with the event, how it's used. Seems to me to be fairly safe ground for analysis and probably more useful than anything else.

thecatfromjapan · 13/03/2018 17:31

How did I miss this thread:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3193163-to-ask-how-you-re-preparing-for-Brexit

It's pretty Shock.

People are, indeed, preparing for Brexit in the way you'd prepare for a natural disaster. Which all begs the question, rather, as to why the fuck we're doing it.

mrsreynolds · 13/03/2018 17:33

Well...

Fuck me