The Brexit Arms

[BrexitArmsLandlady]

🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧
🍺 🍻🍷🍹🥂🍾🍸🍺🍻🍷🍹🥂

Welcome to The Brexit Arms!
Looking forwards, not backward!

All welcome 🍺

🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧

The right to vote suffragettes, made it clear that it was the right to vote for everyone they fought for, and not the vote to vote the right way according to the upperclass...
And there was I, thinking the old 'elitist' trope was dead in the water, given the huge number of pro-Brexit multi-millionaires we know exist (JRM, BoJo, Banks, etc...) but when you need to scrape a barrel any old prejudice will do.
Mummy, your insinuation that only the rich and privileged voted to remain is offensive. Your vote is already making people poorer. Didn't you say upthread that £5K wasn't much money? Kind of suggests that you won't feel the impact.

Leavers hope for a better future. They cannot determine how or when it will come about. I cannot predict the future either. I prefer to work with the known - with the prospect of steps towards agreed improvements to society locally, nationally, Europe and worldwide.

I am concerned about the future and am looking to those who voted leave to get past 'you lost, get over it' to reach out a hand to me/those who voted remain to draw the two halves of the country together. But that seems too much to ask, let alone expect as the mantra seems to end at 'we won'. We are all forced to wait and see. If that better future does not happen, or continues to be a 'hope' after 10 years? 20 years? Will leavers continue to hope?

Two fingers, it has already been proved the people who voted to leave, were the less well off, yet you want this result reversed, as you don't think we knew what we were doing. so isn't that you saying the remain must be the richer half of the UK...
You seem to have your sides mixed up love.

Not all the suffragettes fought for the right for everyone to vote. Some did some didn't. Just saying.

mummy not too sure you analysis of the economic status of leave and remain voters is terribly precise/accurate. There has been considerable study of both the age ranges and economic status of both leave and remain voters. Best to avoid statements of absoluteness like 'already been proved' as I am not sure I could just take your word for that as a fact. Rather than tar all remainers as 'the richer half of the UK' maybe come back with a less 'generalising' response.

JWIM the only result you will be satisfied with is a total reversal of the vote. This isn't a compromise,

Your lusting after a 2nd Referendum in the 14 months left to impose your views on something a majority voted for.

Should we not conform to your demands, just what are you expecting to happen, neither of the political partied want a 2nd vote, but in unicorn world not only is it the demand of the whole UK, but a forgone Result, that will make you happy,
Shouting and stamping won't make this happen.

It's not going to happen.

I have never stated that I would like to see a second referendum - please correct your statement about me.

My view is that we will end up with a compromise as I have set out previously. I am not sure that aware leavers will be happy with said result but with a new 'name' for the 'new' relationship I can see that many leavers will just move forward, assuming what they voted for has happened.

What does bother me is the wasted time, money, lives lost or irreparably damaged, lost political influence as a result of the whole 'project'.

So your arguements are all to do with your pockets, and your lose of income, extra costs on education, lose of value in your homes, loss of cheap holidays, money money money.

I have children and elderly parents. I want a strong economy to provide prospects for young people and to provide the health and social care for the older generation (of which I will be one before long).

Couldn’t give a toss about holidays, and would be quite happy for a reset in house prices to allow youngsters to get on the ladder.

If you can’t see that a strong economy going forward - not in 20 or 30 years - is key to providing a decent standard of living for everyone then I’m a bit speechless.

@AgnesSkinner

Money doesn't pay for healthcare you see? Or food or clothing or heating or housing.

Unemployment is fine. Not a worry with a Tory government.

Check up on this but Research published to date has concentrated on the high probability of voting ‘Leave’ among households living on less than £20,000 a year.

Does this not tell you that the poorest sectors of society already feel they have nothing to lose by voting as they did, that they are already so poor they might as well vote leave, in the hope it will change things. Just as they all once voted for Tony Blair in battle cry of "Time for a change".

What research published to date?

Well perhaps all those £20k households should have been turning out at GEs and voting out the Tory austerity which has exacerbated inequality in this country?

Oh no, wait, let’s just blame the EU instead.

81% of the over 55's bothered to vote.
36% of 18 to 24.

So with something this import the young of whom you speak couldn't even be bothered to VOTE.

How can they complain when their vote would easily have swung this the other way..

We are being accused of stealing the futures of the younger generation, and yet, they couldn't even muster the energy to vote for it!! Doesn't sound like they know what they want, so must accept what they are given as a result.

Data from Lord Ashcroft polling.

Also Opinium polling data.

Having sat outside and helped compile polls for several General Elections, I know they can give a fair view from people who turned up to vote, and the ages and incomes due to locations of the polls taken.

I think you will find Ed didn't win, as people didn't trust him to save us.
Also Dave may have won, as people wanted to have a Referendum, to leave the EU.
We had an EU vote.
We had another Election and the Tory's won that one as well.
How many more votes do you want?

I think Glastonbury was a stronger calling than the ballot box.

So what do you think we could do to let the younger section of society know they need to get out and vote, because of how important it is for them.

I don't think you can make them pay if they don't vote. but could you reward them if they do go and vote, we did talk about it as a family and wondered when they would be able to registrar and vote on the phone, or would it be cheaper to just hand anyone under 25 a £20 note if they turned up at the polling station, as right now that might be cheaper to organize.

81% of the over 55's bothered to vote.
36% of 18 to 24

There you again mummy. Spouting shit as if it was facts
It has, however, been fairly well established that voting was linked to eductional attainment.

And don't 'love' me. It makes you sound silly.

Actually, research by the LSE and Opinium found it was more like 64% of 18-24s that voted in the Referendum.

The 36% figure was extrapolated by Sky from previous GE data and did not apply to the Referendum turnout.

www.ecrep.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Did-young-people-bother-to-vote-in-the-EU-referendum.docx

opinium.co.uk/did-young-people-bother-to-vote-in-the-eu-referendum/

Oh yeah, and here’s the link to the Leicester Uni research that found that an increase of 3% British adults accessing higher education in England and Wales could have reversed the referendum result.

It also found that elderly voters, although having an effect on the outcome, was generally over reported as a dominant factor.

www2.le.ac.uk/offices/press/press-releases/2017/august/greater-access-to-higher-education-could-have-reversed-eu-referendum-result-research-suggests

However, these polls aren’t consistent in what they determine “young people” to be. Some categorise this as 18-24 year olds, some as 18-34 year olds.

Concerns have also been raised by John Curtice, President of the British Polling Council, about whether or not the polls are weighted accurately to take account of the fact that people who respond to polls tend to be more likely to vote in the first place. People who don’t vote are less likely to answer a poll about politics and voting.

Sky poll - 18-24s 36% turnout
Opinium poll - 18-24s 64% turnout

Directly comparable age groups.

PS - if you cut and paste from a website, it’s good form to add the link.

fullfact.org/europe/young-voters-and-eu-referendum/

AgnesSkinner, it says it's not a turnout poll.
Its a survey undertaken AFTER the Referendum where a sample of the age group were Question.
Also if lets say 64% of the 18 - 24 voted what happend?
Did more vote to Leave that first though, or was it the old groups who vote in far greater numbers to leave that they have been given credit for, as the numbers should have been much closer on the final vote.
As like most people I assumed the lack of the young vote had produced the results.