Westministenders: Rebel Rebel Your Brexit is a Mess.

[RedToothBrush]

Hot Tramp, I love you so!

The European Parliament have agreed to progress talks to the next stage. Despite Brexiteers saying its not legally binding, it is apparent that the EU certainly disagree.

Not only that, but the wording of the deal goes further. It binds us to not being able to agree and new trade deals for 2 years.

The All Important Amendment 7 to the Great Repel Bill has been successful. May’s power grab has a set back.

By just FOUR votes the government was defeated. How May will be regretting that pointless election tonight.

Parliament will have a meaningful vote on the exit terms.

But don’t be too excited. Brussels might not like this as May can not guarantee the UK will agree to a deal. It means the the EU are negotiating with parliament NOT May now.

There is also the suggestion that the mood of parliament is changing and is beginning to lean more towards a EFTA / EEA type deal.

But equally this could also send us to the brink with a deal from the EU that could be rejected by parliament.

The stakes just got higher.

woman

Look who has some meaty balls for you

😁

re rebels undermining TM and negotiations

@GuitarMoog
I've seen a few whiney Leavers put this line about. In terms of how EU negotiations work, it is simply not the case. 1/
EU27 are well used to coalition governments that need to get confirmation from coalition partners before making agreements. This is normal. 2/
Both sides in negotiations have always planned that both UK and European Parliaments would need to ratify any agreement. EP has made it clear it does not take this lightly or as a foregone conclusion, and UK Parl has now done the same 3/
In fact, it would have seemed very odd to EU27 leaders had the UK Parliament not had to formally vote on the deal. 4/
This also dispels the biggest worry for COM/EU27, which was that Brexit Ultras who want UKGov to walk away from talks ultimately had a hold on May, and were driving UKGov policy. 5/
This counter-balances this dramatically, and makes UKGov less likely to take extreme lines or precipitate action. 6/
It also has the added bonus that when UKGov says (as everyone always does at some point) "We see your point, but we'll never get it through at home", it will have some serious credibility outside of internal Tory squabbles. 7/
Another bonus is that, whatever the Bill says on exit days, UKGov is in a much better position to request an extension if needed, pending the outcome of its own democratic processes. 8/

Sorry mrsr I'm taken you'll have to dispose of Mr Meatball as you see fit. Me and Lennie go way back

Somehow I sincerely doubt that Chipolata Man looks anything like Mr Meatball.

It's actually quite reassuring to have the mansplaining visitor. It shows that the more ignorant Brexiteers are rattled

More informed Leavers like Howabout I'll go to the bother of engaging with - and actually reading what she posts. unlike......

I thought we already established this was Mr Chipolata

Tomorrow's DM front page is an absolute belter

Me too but a girl can dream....😁

Lennie is a very attractive young gentleman

Does that mean that right up until the end parliament has the option to effecitvely veto Brexit?

No. Triggering Article 50 (without doing any impact assessments) means we leave the EU in March 2019.

The DM seen earlier this evening...

placemat.
Thanks RTB.

Someone fixed it

I would have been deeply disappointed in Soubry had she not voted for this after seeing her last week. However I was sort of expecting a buy off and an abstention so I'm very happy she didn't.

But on that note, and the mention of Heald, she mentioned him when talking about the impact of the mutineers headline. She made great effort to talk about how he was one of the grandees of the party and how he's really a no nonsense tory etc. But apparently his reaction to that headline was that he was finally hip .

Also DD was described by Greg Knight (of the election jingle video fame) very randomly as a miserable bastard.

She also seems to have a soft spot for Chuka who doesn't?

hashi

Don't feed it after midnight!!!

.

I really can't see why the Mail and the Brexiteers are whining. No one has said Brexit is of, but it now means that some very sharp brains can put forward arguments and refine the plans, rather than whatever nonsense Fox or Davis dream up that morning.

Thankyou Swedish, so does that mean that parliament can now veto any "deal" and in that case the UK will leave with no deal (poor NI)?

Has this thread been overtaken by teenagers or have I lost my soh?

Thanks, red

I'm becoming increasingly alarmed that the Heil & other far right papers keeps posting photos of MPs and judges who don't toe the Brexit line

Their text is again demonisation and rabble-rousing, the same "Enemy of the People" strategy

The Heil are deliberately presenting MPs and judges as targets for intimidation - or worse - "Here they are; go out and get them"
Back to their 1930s roots as the UK fascist paper.

Very reckless in this dangerous political climate, with one Remain MP already murdered by a far right terrorist.
Anne Soubry and others received many death threats after appearing in the previous Gallery of Traitors
So the Heil are completely aware of this and continue despite the danger - or maybe deliberately because of the danger ?

Newspapers have always criticised the leaders and a few top pols from whichever party they most oppose
However, they didn't use to basically accuse opponents of treason
They never personally targeted whole groups of MPs before - most of the Heil's targets were previously unknown to the public.

The Heil is making it very clear that any MP or judge who obstructs the Heil vision of Hard Brexit will be made a target
Pour decourager les autres

No. Triggering Article 50 (without doing any impact assessments) means we leave the EU in March 2019.
I thought the man who wrote Article 50 said that it could be revoked at any time? Declaring an intention to leave doesn't actually mean you have to then do it. Of course it would then be up to the EU27 whether they agreed to that -after the way we've pissed them around - and it might end up having to go to the ECJ (the irony!)

But there is a school of thought that article 50 is revocable right up to the moment we leave. So if the deal is bad, and parliament refused to vote for it, they could insist we stayed instead.

Interesting Ican

The funny thing today was BigChoc the MPs had had all that legal and illegal threat rubbish, and like the rest of us thought, fuck it, we're going to do the right thing.

The threats are visceral in one way, and makes one think well 'fuck it' in another way. The 'threators' are just sausage people after all.

The mood is changing. Brave MPs have helped it.

Yes, it is revocable. But, at the moment, we're not there.

The situation wet revocation is as much politics as law, because A50 is not fully defined - its author, Kerr, never expected it to actually be used

Most EU specialist lawyers & pols suggest that A50 is revocable right up to the last moment - provided all 27 members accept this
It is unclear what happens if one or more countries object:

the Uk could go to the ECJ, which would be humiliating, but the EU would probably wish to avoid a long court case with the resuktant instability. Also wish to avoid the Brexit downsides for both parties.

So, atm, probably they would agree, however grudgingly.
As time goes by, they might get so fed up with Uk govt antics and the toxic UK media, that they decide any price is worth getting rid.

They are PUNISHING us

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/dec/11/uk-business-investment-on-ice-until-more-brexit-progress-warns-bcc#comment-109523873

History
UK: Do what we want or we leave.
EU: What do you want?
UK: We don't want to be in the Euro.
EU: Done.
UK: But we want the right to do Euro clearing in London.
EU: Done.
UK: We want a rebate.
EU: Done.
UK: We don't want to be part of Schengen.
EU: Done.
UK: We want to expand the EU to the eastern European countries.
EU: Done.
UK: And we want Turkey to join.
EU: Eh...not sure about that one...I guess we can talk about this, depending on how Turkey develops....
UK: And we want extra rules for immigration because of all of those Eastern Europeans coming to us.
EU: But you wanted this. And you don't even use the options you already have to control immigration.
UK: Otherwise we leave!
EU: Okay, if you want to. There is nothing more we can give you!
UK: You cause too much immigration! And you want Turkey to join! We have voted to leave.
EU: Yes, we noticed. Well, you know the rules, no trade negotiations until you trigger article 50 and then we first need to talk about how we entangle the UK from the EU. Than we can talk about trade.
UK: We need some time to discuss the.
EU: We aren't in any hurry.
UK: We have now triggered article 50.
EU: Great so now we can talk about the divorce.
UK: But we want to talk about trade.
EU: First we need to clear up a number of important issues. So what is your suggestion?
UK: --
EU: How about this?
UK: No, totally inacceptable. What we want is out cake and eat it too.
EU: That is impossible.
UK: Go whistle.
EU: Ticktock.
UK: We have talked. We want a transitional period or we wont get done.
EU: Well, we might if you don't delay all the time...but okay, provided that we made some progress. So what is you suggestion.
UK: We want all the advantage of the single market and the customs union while following our own standards and no free movement.
EU: That is impossible.
UK: YOU ARE BLACKMAILING US!!!!!