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Brexit

Westminstenders: Beano or Bust

978 replies

RedToothBrush · 29/09/2017 21:33

The last week has seemingly been eventful but not in the way that's on the surface.

It's what's going on behind the scenes and the little comments in less high profile speeches that's more telling.

On the one hand the Norths think the May speech is a laying down "an offer" that the EU can not accept, in order to set up a no deal situation.

On the other hand Telegraph Journalist Peter Foster thinks there things going on in Brussels with the EU set to compromise in someway and help May present a deal acceptable to the British. You have to wonder whether the "presentational" stuff is about a deal to essentially be in the EU but not in the EU. A Brexit Existing in A Name Only. Beano.

It's difficult to tell, and it will come down to brinkmanship over timing. For both a deal and for the Repel Bill as the two sides in parliament try to push things to their limit for their own ends.

In this vacuum of uncertainty CBI and their "arch enemies" the TUC have put out a joint statement saying no deal is nuts and will screw every one and the way EU cits have been treated has been dreadful.

As it stands it does look like May is serious about a deal and Davis is also acting in this way. Johnson and Hannan have launched their Institute for Free Trade (at the foreign office breaking ministerial code, but hell there's no consequences these days anyway cos May dare not let Johnson off the Brexit hook) in retaliation to try and retell the Brexit story as always being about free trade rather than racist. Unfortunately leavers seem to have bust that by admitting they are considerably more racist than Remainers by their own admission.

Then there's Trump and Bombardier. Just as Brexiteers are pushing for this closer relationship with the US in trade, despite May personally lobbying Trump he fucks her over slapping 220% tariff on Bombardier and putting the future of 4000 jobs at risk. This was inevitable as Trump fucks everyone for his own gain. The US won't ride to the aid of the British capitalists. They'll just eat them alive.

This week sees an important vote by the European Parliament on Brexit red lines. One of the votes states that the UK has to either stay in the customs union and internal market or NI has to have a special arrangement and stay in the customs union and the internal market in order to protect the EUs border integrity. Neither is compatible with what the Cons and the DUP have said they want.

It's also the Tory Party conference.May's big speech, in which she must throw red meat to the swivel eyed loons on right, is on Weds. There are of course, no debates at ConParty because, well, they can't behave like good little children without supervision. Instead the conference is to, erm... yeah we'll find out next week.

OP posts:
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HashiAsLarry · 30/09/2017 10:44

Well the tories aren't very good at reading the public mood as we well know. But at the same time there's still a lot of people who think austerity didn't exist or that austerity has impacted everyone equally Confused

Holliewantstobehot · 30/09/2017 10:46

The let's just leave now, not pay any money, they need us more than we need them brigade remind me of people who are getting divorced. Instead of listening to their lawyer they refuse to split the assets, offer pitiful settlements, get cross when the judge won't do as they say or demands paperwork off them.

Peregrina · 30/09/2017 10:53

Please let the Tories implode.

But then the electorate need to wake up and realise what a shower of shite some of them are e.g. the electorate in deadwood Redwood's Wokingham constituency. It's a prosperous Remain voting area, so why on earth do they keep voting in someone who supports Leave backed up with arguments which are utter drivel?

HesterThrale · 30/09/2017 11:11

The Labour Lords are very unhappy with the EU Withdrawal Bill. They've tweeted a short summary of their objections:

mobile.twitter.com/LabourLordsUK?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

RedToothBrush · 30/09/2017 11:13

Tom Newton Dunn @ tnewtondunn
Amid his red lines, Boris made quite an admission to me. UK won't be ready for Brexit by 2019

Westminstenders: Beano or Bust
OP posts:
prettybird · 30/09/2017 11:13

Hollie - add in attempting to hide assets (impact assessments) and offshoring or selling off of assets so that the spouse can't get hold of them (privatisations to foreign owned entities). Plus bad mouthing everyone and then wondering why they don't have any friends any more Hmm

Holliewantstobehot · 30/09/2017 11:21

But then this is what annoys me about TM. Well one of the many things. I don't think the election was as much about Brexit as she keeps maintaining. It was more about the NHS, education funding, austerity.

HesterThrale · 30/09/2017 11:28

Hollie I agree. And also about the preservation of the Tory party. She mistakenly thought she'd get an increased majority, preserve the Tories' place as the 'natural party of government', (their view) and be able to railroad lots of stuff through.

lonelyplanetmum · 30/09/2017 11:31

On the subject of hiding impact assessments....

The financial cost of this lemming exit, is bottomless. I have a longish car journey and DH is driving ( stressful) so I thought I'd knock some preliminary figures around anyway. Starting with the easier ones.

DExEU

•	<strong>£26,000,000m</strong> a year by 2019/20 for DIT/FCO, ‘to strengthen trade policy capability’
•	Up to <strong>£51,000,000</strong> per year for DExEU
•	Up to <strong>£94,000,000</strong> a year from 2017-18 ‘until the UK’s exit is complete’

This adds up to £412,000,000 for the three ‘Brexit departments’ over the course of one Parliament.

Legal costs to date

Initially refusing to allow MPs to vote on Article 50 cost us £1,143,000 in total. Not sure if that falls within the above DExEU costs.

Election and follow up

Overall, combining the cost of running elections and spend in the campaigns, the 2017 General Election is estimated to cost around £170,000,000

Keeping the schismed, ruptured Conservatives in power with the Democratic Unionist Party prop- £1,000,000,000.

Lost subsidies

Replacing the subsidies from the Common Agricultural Policy (CAP) into the UK- £3,000,000,000 per annum

Replacing Creative Europe Fund over six years -€1,460,000,000

Many more...

Cost to Business

New customs arrangements after exit -£4,000,000,000 a year (report from the Institute for Government )

This is just a start of an impact assessment; it certainly won't fit on the side of a 🚌 .

Peregrina · 30/09/2017 11:42

It was more about the NHS, education funding, austerity.

As was the Referendum itself. Probably only a minority of the Leave voters were really anti the EU. As it happens, they seem to be the ones who post on MN.

BiglyBadgers · 30/09/2017 11:50

I can't decide if Boris is just trying really hard to get himself fired, so he can wash his hands of the whole thing. Hmm

SwedishEdith · 30/09/2017 11:52

Ta for new thread.

enochroot · 30/09/2017 12:10

I'm meeting my DD in Manchester tomorrow but it turns out that each of us thinks we're going on a different march!
Could someone disentangle this for us? Which one starts where?

Holliewantstobehot · 30/09/2017 12:19

I doubt the regional development fund will be upheld. I live in Cornwall and don't expect us to see any money. The government said months ago they wouldn't replace the money we receive.

DrivenToDespair · 30/09/2017 13:02

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BigChocFrenzy · 30/09/2017 13:17

Yes, I suspect Boris is trying to get fired, 2 reasons:

  • He wants to make a leadership bid, but the Tory party never elects ministers who make their bid while still in the government and hence are expected to be loyal to the PM while there

  • Yes, to escape from the responsibility of the crash that would follow the Hard Brexit he wants
    If he leaves, he can claim the crash was because the govt cocked it up; they were insufficiently patriotic and pure of Brexit heart

BigChocFrenzy · 30/09/2017 13:26

Richard North nails the general indifference to Brexit in Germany, who are supposed to be desperate for a deal, because .... cars, you know ....

"Overall, though, one gets the impression, especially from the German press that Brexit is so far down the batting order as to be invisible."

A very occasional view about Brexit from Germany

http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/what-strategy-is-london-pursuing-with-brexit-talks-a-1169944.html

There's a building in downtown London, adjacent to the prime minister's office, which scoffers call the "Ministry of Magic." Grin

It's one of the most well-protected buildings in Britain, and very few people are given access.

The person in charge at this building is a white-haired man with a high opinion of himself
and a consistently smug smile.

< I suspect that the Germns aren't in awe of DD Wink >

His job is to restore the country to its former greatness

< Der Spiegel nailed it ! >

woman11017 · 30/09/2017 13:45

@carolecadwalla
In which one side of the Leave campaign accuses another side of the Leave campaign of lying & cheating. This could get good..

@Arron_banks
Slipping a student £650k to decide how to use it,stretches even your limited credibility - Bollocks @andywigmore @JolyonMaugham twitter.com/odysseanproject/status/914060138570551297 …

RhiannonOHara · 30/09/2017 14:41

I can't decide if Boris is just trying really hard to get himself fired, so he can wash his hands of the whole thing.

I keep thinking this too. He can't just BE that boorish and ignorant… can he?

LurkingHusband · 30/09/2017 14:48

Just got in from shopping so rather than Googling, I wondered if some kind soul could point me to details of how the UK government is supporting the "will of the people" in Catalonia, please.

Thanks in advance.

woman11017 · 30/09/2017 15:27

I can't decide if Boris is just trying really hard to get himself fired

@PeteNorth303

  1. Events have a way of taking on a life of their own and Johnson could end up PM simply because there wasn't anything to stop him.

Look at what happened in the US. BJ could be their 'dream ticket' against Corbyn. I wouldn't count him out at all, horrific prospect as it is.

LurkingHusband · 30/09/2017 16:11

If anyone ever has to team build, rather than pissing around with foam rubber towers of Hanoi, or mock bomb defusing, I can highly recommend a showing of "Apollo 13" with nibbles (and drink, if appropriate).

It suddenly dawned on me, that there is a sequence in the film, just after the explosion, where the ground crew have to decide the best course of action. They can either turn back, or risk pressing on to take advantage of the moons gravity and loop around; picking up speed without using fuel - the "free return trajectory".

In the end, the "decision" wasn't actually much of one, as it was a known fact that the service module had suffered damage, and therefore it's engine (needed to turn around and return the way they came) could not be trusted. So the only course was to go around the moon.

Sort of hit me as a metaphor for where we are with Brexit. With Theresa May being the fucked engine incapable of returning the craft home, and every passing day looking as if we can return back with very little effort.

Meanwhile (in the Brexit/Apollo 13 metaphor) Boris is a stream of yellow piss that has been dumped into space.

Holliewantstobehot · 30/09/2017 16:15

inews.co.uk/essentials/news/politics/boris-johnson-blonde-ambition/

In today's I.

Also a column in there by Rachel Johnson saying that she's sick of being told she's unpatriotic for speaking out against brexit.

Plus I thought this was an interesting point of view.
inews.co.uk/opinion/comment/brexiteers-saying-remainers-unpatriotic-part-dangerous-obsession-keeping-stiff-upper-lip/

woman11017 · 30/09/2017 16:19

Don't they fix the module with sellatape and old socks? LH Sort of Clanger Brexit?

LurkingHusband · 30/09/2017 16:19

... with Boris being told off for quoting Kipling in a temple in Myanmar

www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-politics-41453375/boris-johnson-reciting-kipling-in-myanmar-temple-not-appropriate

There are 3 possibilities here. All of which boil down to the simple fact that Boris is a wank puffin of the highest order.