Westminstenders: The Negotiations Continue - The DUP ones

[RedToothBrush]

Tomorrow is the Queen’s Speech. In honour of that the start of this thread is written in its honour:

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Immigration is bad. Except for that good immigration.
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Brexit means Brexit
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Pilot scheme.
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Money for –the DUP-- NI
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Brexit means Brexit
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The Internet is Bad. Newspapers are good.
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Brexit means Brexit.
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Britain wave your flag.
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(The Queen’s turns over the page to read the back of the A4 sheet, only to find it blank)

... if we retain membership of the single market and customs union we will still have to pay around 80% of what we do now to the EU, accept freedom of movement and won't be able to make independent trade deals... We also won't have a voice in the European Parliament but will still have to abide by many of the rules - without having a say on them.

But we will have left. So we won't be beholden to Junckers, or whoever, and not have to bother about electing MEPs, so really for the Leavers, what is not to like? Ah, Freedom of Movement - yet many were adamant that immigration/xenophobia/racism wasn't at the heart of the vote.

Ian Dunt's book Brexit: What The Hell Happens Now? has a good section on the Norwegian situation.

IDS would be intellectually outgunned by an asparagus plant
DD appears to be an asparagus plant
Or maybe an EU "plant" - surely no MP can be genuinely that useless and ignorant as a negotiator ?

Morning all. Thank you so much for greetings.. Trying to catch up but so much going on lol! Be glad to come home hopefully next week so I can participate better. Peace and love to all xx p.s save me some cake! Xx

A good piece by Lord Buckethead

The newsreader on R3 just now reported Loathsome's requests for the news media to be more patriotic about Brexit with a tone of disdain that was amusing to hear.

I don't want the media to be patriotic (like Turkey's) I want them to be truthful, unbiased and informative. That Emily Maitlis interview is the best advertisement for paying the licence fee I have ever seen.

A short tale of one leaver's battle with comprehension:

peregrina Lord Buckethead talks more sense than the asparagus heads. Is being a fool, patriotic? Sleaford Mods are lovely.

Tory donors private equity firm big investor in Rydon construction company. Coller capital owns fifth of Rydon via partnership based offshore in Jersey. Coller boss and founder Jeremy Collet donated £15000 to Tory party. This was in the mirror.

Loathsome's requests for the news media to be more patriotic about Brexit with a tone of disdain

Y'know, everything would make a lot more sense if it turned out that Brexiters actually think that Belief and the Power of Thinking have real-world effects.

Hence the Will of the People, Not Talking Britain Down, Why Won't You Just Take a Leap of Faith and Just Believe, They Need Us More Than We Need Them, The Rest Of The World Are Queuing Up to Worship Us...

One must speculate therefore that Brexiters must have had great tangible success, over the years, when wishing for (say) a bevy of naked supermodels in bed, or winning the lottery jackpot, or best of all, keeping slugs off their hostas.

Rydor just refurbished Queen Elizabeth hospital in London, care homes too in 2017. Check them all!

Turkey has just stopped schools teaching evolution...
How long til the dup are asking for the same?

Remainers / "soft" Leavers and "hard" Brexiters (shorthand) have fundamentally differently attitudes, not just about Brexit.

Brexi Ultras seem to have a mix of these motivations:

• Low information:
  Still believe the Uk can have a "cake and eat it" deal, or that the EU is preventing the UK from a trade bonanza with the rest of the world.
  Likely to feel very angry and cheated, whatever form of Brexit happens (or doesn't)

• Hard right Tories and alt/ right sympathisers:
  Want low tax & low regs, because they think they would become richer
  Despise the vulnerable, who are "scroungers".
  Usually already have higher income and / or accumulated wealth and fervently want to keep all of it.
  They consider the EU to be too leftwing / liberal. Often want to be in a US bloc instead.

3. "Angry left behinds": Sometimes, but not always, believe in a "cake" deal that will change their lives Mainly feel that abandoning Brexit would be abandoning the only victory they have ever had against the mc whom they hate as "liberal elites". The only time they could hit back effectively. Their anger at all the shit in their lives is directed at the mc, because they can see them in daily life as being much better off, rather than being angry at the genuinely wealthy ruling class, whom they never see in person.

• English / British Nationlists:
  Nostalgic to return to a past when Britain was a 99% homogeneous white superpower and didn't have to consider other cultures or countries.
  Against multiculturalism and want to "return" immigrants, especially Muslims and anyone who doesn't integrate fully.

• Authoritarians:
  They want discipline and simple solutions without compromise or dissent.
  Support return of the death penalty.
  Oppose much of the progress in equal rights, or civil liberties for people not like them.
  Regard opposition as sabotage and treason, so regard any demonstrations or court actions against "their" govt, as trying to overthrow the govt.
  Believe people should keep quiet in between GEs.
  They think when large numbers of people vote differently that this means there is significant voter fraud.

Turkey has just stopped schools teaching evolution...
How long til the dup are asking for the same?

Turkey, and Trump's USA, and the Saudis, and Duterte, and the DUP, these are our new bezzie mates who are going to make Brexit Britain Grate and Amaaaaazing.

Lord Buckethead: “I think Boris Johnson is a posh, overblown, full-of-himself imbecile, who thinks just because he knows a little bit of classics he has some superiority over the rest of species, but I say flocci non facio, Boris Johnson.”

Can't argue with that

Have just had a (no doubt standard) response to my email to the Labour party informing them that my vote for them should not be construed as a vote in support for Brexit. Here's their full reply:

Thank you for contacting us.

Labour accepts the referendum result but we do not accept that has to lead to a reckless Tory Brexit that will put jobs, the economy and rights at risk.

A Labour Government will adopt a new approach to Brexit based on transparency and cooperation. We will seek a close and collaborative partnership with the EU – rejecting Tory isolationism and seeking to remain a member of common European agencies such as Europol, Eurojust and the Erasmus scheme.

Labour will scrap the Tories’ Brexit plan and replace it with fresh negotiating priorities that have a strong emphasis on retaining the benefits of the Single Market and Customs Union. We will ensure jobs and the economy always come first.

Labour will drop the Tories’ Great Repeal Bill and replace it with an EU Rights and Protections Bill that would ensure there is no change to workers’ rights, consumer rights or environmental protections.

Labour will end the divisive Tory approach to Brexit and build a national consensus. We will introduce a ‘presumption of devolution’ where powers transferred from the EU will go straight to the relevant region or nation.

Leaving the EU will mean that freedom of movement will end. What replaces it will be part of the negotiations and will need to support the economy and communities across the country.

Only a Labour Government can prevent a reckless Tory Brexit, build a close and collaborative future relationship with the EU and deliver a Brexit deal that protects jobs, the economy, rights and living standards.

Whether you are a Labour Party Member or not, we want to hear your ideas on how the next Labour government should tackle the challenges our country faces, and build a more equal and prosperous Britain. If you would like to take part in this policy making process, please visit policyforum.labour.org.uk.

Best wishes, James K, Membership Services and Correspondence,
The Labour Party

Labour accepts the referendum result but we do not accept that has to lead to a reckless Tory Brexit that will put jobs, the economy and rights at risk.

You need to write back to them, stressing that with their support being predominantly among younger voters, who tended to be Remain, that the mandate for any Brexit has been lost.

The lib dems seem to have abandoned a remain position and are now campaigning for staying in the single market.

@LibDems
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19h

We want a guarantee from the Government that it will keep Britain in the Single Market. Back the campaign: t.co/6IoEpvRiiM?amp=1

The Scottish schools affected by poor building shortcuts techniques were built under PFI and were allowed to be self-certified This resulted in building with insufficient building ties and walls that could (and did - fortunately when no one was at school) fall down

Back to Grenfell: there are still local residents badly affected and not being helped https://grenfellactiongroup.wordpress.com/2017/06/22/grenfell-tower-fire-the-forgotten-forgotten-victims/

No heating or (more importantly) hot water as the boilers were in Grenfell Tower, living literally in an asbestos fallout zone and potentially at risk of the collapse of the tower (although I presume that structural engineers have assessed that risk as not imminent although you do wonder )

pain that was in their manifesto in the ge. They've never campaigned to remain. Single market and second ref.

Which is what makes the 80% back brexit thing so disingenuous, there were no remain parties so technically 100% backed it.

"Leaving the EU will mean that freedom of movement will end. What replaces it will be part of the negotiations and will need to support the economy and communities across the country"

This is incompatible with "retaining the benefits of the Single Market and the Customs Union". The Labour position is as muddled as ever!

Indeed missmoon. It isn't exactly filling me with confidence. I am still trying to remain optimistic that over the summer the tides of public opinion will be seen to shift and the parties will be forced to shift with it or die. Labour need to listen to their voters and respond. We will just have to wait and see though.

Which is what makes the 80% back brexit thing so disingenuous, there were no remain parties so technically 100% backed it.

I suppose they are all still scared of going against 'the will of the people'.
Time they all cut out that rubbish and started using their judgement to Govern for the good of the country. Get the Leavers in Parliament to work on a paper stating exactly what the benefits now and in the next ten years are for leaving. Not pie in the sky 'we will be able to do trade deals with ...' or 'it will be all right in 40 odd years time' - when I will almost certainly be dead and the grandchild who is a baby will be an adult in early middle age.

In short do the work which Cameron should have insisted on before the Referendum.

Muddled-up, rather nonsensical reply from Labour, twofingers. I expect I'll receive a similar response to my letter to my Labour MP

hashi you're right but they seem to have dropped the second referendum although it might just be that I'm despairing at a solid remain position this morning. I hope labour's position is that they're planning on dropping Brexit if it's not "a good deal" but corbyn's lacklustre remain campaigning and mcdonnells adamant remarks about leaving the sm suggest it might be otherwise.