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Brexit

Westministenders: Its WAR. Huh!? What is that good for? Negotiations apparently

996 replies

RedToothBrush · 05/05/2017 22:39

Theresa May has declared war on the EU. She is going to be a ‘bloody difficult woman’ after she got caught out by a highly predictable leak.

Apparently, the EU are trying to rig an election she seems almost dead cert to win. They deliberately timed the leak to interfere with an election May decided the timing of. May was not supposed to be at the dinner, but after she announced the election she decided that she had to get in on the act for some reason. Wildly speculating here, but could this be because she wanted the political mileage herself?

No it wasn't a preplanned strategy. Don't be stupid. That would suggest they had the foggiest clue and a plan. Nope, the war declaration was an opportunist damage limitation exercise, used to maximise political capital.

She has now even further alienated the EU. It seems difficult to conceive how any deal will be done. Instead it looks like the election is trying to set us up to crash out. Whether the ‘No deal is better than a bad deal’ happens to make the 3 page Tory Manifesto remains to be seen.

This would leave EU nationals and British national aboard in legal and social limbo.

There is also a feud building over the Brexit leaving bill, which is steadily climbing. We can not progress to the second stage of Brexit without resolving this. Again, this seems unlikely.

Thirdly, a settlement with Ireland is a top priority for the EU, and plans are being drawn up to make allowances for any potential United Ireland. This is a subject that is still to be talked about on any level really. May has been much more interested in the fate of Scotland and battling with Nicola Sturgeon.

That’s the thing. May is like the playground bully who goes around going “Do you wanna scrap ?, Do ya? DO YA?” and generally throws their weight around and most of the time gets their own way as a result. The trouble with the strategy is when the bigger kid comes along and thumps the bully, for being a cocky little shit and doesn’t like their kid brother getting picked on.

The trouble is that May is setting it up, to try and make it look like the poor little Britain has been picked on to her parents, so they go around accusing the big kid of all sorts rather than admitting their little darling is a nasty little shit.

It’s not going to end well is it? You can’t help but feel that at some point they’ll all end up in the Headmasters office and the WTO/UN/International Courts will rule against us for being a bunch of dickheads. No doubt May, will stick to character, hold a grudge and demand to leave them or say they have no authority over the UK.

That or we really will end up declaring war on Spain over Gibraltar. By accident of course. Probably to keep the ConKip party together and avoid a split.

Rule Britannia. Britannia rules. Erm, not a lot these days.

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CopperRose · 07/05/2017 20:32

Leave.eu was the Banks/Farage campaign btw, not the official Leave campaign.
So not surprising that they'd have tweeted the RIP France thing.

Regardless, just came on to join in and say I'm glad Macron won Wine 🇫🇷

Mistigri · 07/05/2017 20:33

I've been checking out the results where I live - Melenchon country, but with a significant FN vote. Every single town I've checked so far voted for Macron, even the depressed town with high unemployment where Iive.

More than anything I think this was a rejection of anti-Europe politics. Same trend in Germany where Merkel is looking very strong indeed. I hope this is good news for the UK too.

BigChocFrenzy · 07/05/2017 20:33

I presume if Juncker had lied about what was said in the dinner, May would have stated this very plainly.
After all, her rhetoric afterwards was very aggressive towards the EU, so she certainly would not pull her punches if he had lied.

mathanxiety · 07/05/2017 20:35

Coffee isn't a native British beverage. It's tea that Optionrationale should be smelling.

SwedishEdith · 07/05/2017 20:36

"He might have beaten Le Pen but that's not the end of it. He now has to deal with the division in French society."

And he acknowledged that. Theresa May also should attempt to deal with division in society. Such a shame she pretends it's not there and has never addressed 48% of us.

optionalrationale · 07/05/2017 20:37

Today 20:35 mathanxiety
"Coffee isn't a native British beverage. It's tea that Optionrationale should be smelling"

OK

Badders123 · 07/05/2017 20:38

Maybe brexit and trump were a blip?

Maybe a soft brexit and impeachment of trump are possible!?

squoosh · 07/05/2017 20:39

And he acknowledged that. Theresa May also should attempt to deal with division in society. Such a shame she pretends it's not there and has never addressed 48% of us.

Could not agree more.

optionalrationale · 07/05/2017 20:41

Today 20:31 Bearbehind "PMSL"
I believe you can get special pads to avoid embarrassment and smelliness. Good luck to ya

Bearbehind · 07/05/2017 20:41

optional, instead of being sarcastic and goady, could you address the point many of us are making.

If Juncker's account of this dinner wasn't accurate, why didn't TM counter it with her version of events?

Why can't she tell us how positive it actually was?

Why has she reverted to the 'EU are bullying us'?

SwedishEdith · 07/05/2017 20:42

Apparently, 4 million spoilt their ballot papers. Shock.

Peregrina · 07/05/2017 20:42

Amber Rudd hints Tories might drop current migration target from manifesto

This is sensible, because we need immigration, with an aging population, but I can't see it going down well with the extreme right.

optionalrationale · 07/05/2017 20:43

Will Macron end the cycle of French Presidents vetoing the repeated votes of MEPs to stop the farce of moving the EU Parliament from Brussels to Strasbourg every fourth week? I'm not sure

Mistigri · 07/05/2017 20:46

SwedishEdith Melenchonites in a massive sulk channeling the berniebros. I have loads of them on my FB.

Worth saying - given all the media going on about a record vote for the FN - that it was also a record vote for En Marche and that Macron received more votes than either Sarkozy in 2007 or Hollande in 2012.

RedToothBrush · 07/05/2017 20:46

Official Leave.eu tweeted "RIP, France"

Will of the people doesn't apply now, when it doesn't go the [far] 'right' way.

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OlennasWimple · 07/05/2017 20:47

So that's a no to Hofer, a no to Wilders, and a no to Le Pen.

More of the above please.

Oui oui!!

Badders123 · 07/05/2017 20:48

I'm increasingly thinking once the Tories are back in the far right swivel eyed loony stuff will be toned down...they will keep on saying the right things to keep the brexiters happy til then

OlennasWimple · 07/05/2017 20:48

Can you imagine the initial conversations with Ury the War Negotiator?

"What is that you are trying to achieve, Minister?"

"Brexit"

"And what does that involve? What are your red lines? Where is your room for manouevre?"

"Brexit means BRexit"

SwedishEdith · 07/05/2017 20:51

I thought that misti. Or Fillon sulkers. At least not far right sulkers.

woman12345 · 07/05/2017 20:55

To be clear: co-ordination between campaigns is AGAINST THE LAW, unless expenditure is declared jointly...

^Vote Leave, DUP, BeLeave, Veterans For Britain hired AggregateIQ
Leave.eu 'helped' by Cambridge Analytica
Both = Robert Mercer/Steve Bannon^

At time of referendum, Cambridge Analytica & AggregateIQ SHARED database. They worked together EVERY DAY. Again: co-ordination is ILLEGAL

French election authorities acted quick as did French media to prevent illegal activities.

We still have 30 tories found guilty by Electoral Commission of election fraud.
Syphoning of funds to Leave via DUP and the above in Cadwallader's article.

And the silence is deafening.

TheElementsSong · 07/05/2017 20:56

So that's a no to Hofer, a no to Wilders, and a no to Le Pen.

That can't be right.

We were assured that (a) we urgently had to escape the EU because it was all definitely going hard-right/fascist "over there" and that's so not what we noble British are for; but also (b) the rest of the EU was going to follow our brave lead and collapse any day now by means of voting for these wonderful anti-EU politicians.

I put it to all Remoaners that the apparent continuing vigour and popular support of the European Union is all Fake News from the corrupt hard-left mainstream media. In actual fact, continental Europe was destroyed in an internecine war sometime in July 2016 and has been a smoking ruin for the past 9 months, its desperate and starving denizens having to resort to scavenging for cockroaches.

SwedishEdith · 07/05/2017 20:56

I agree (hope) Badders Ido think there is an element of still trying to appease the loons for now. I know May appears obsessed with immigration but a) scrutiny of previous Home Office failures on this puts the spotlight on her and her failures or b) she realises immigration cannot be cut if the UK is to function.

BigChocFrenzy · 07/05/2017 21:01

re moving the EU parliament every month:
It is done precisely because it is the wish of the French electorate, to have them in Strasbourg
So, I would expect Macron to continue this

You should NOT assume that French nationalists have the same views as English nationalists

On many topics they are diametrically opposed
It is a common mistake among Brexiters though.

German / Austrian / Hungarian nationalists too
Many of them even dislike England and the English, for historical reasons

It is the pro-EU people who are usually far friendlier to individuals, even if there are no policy disagreements between govts

It is the EU supporters who are trying to help UK expats remain - the nationalists and Eurosceptic have done bugger all

GraceGrape · 07/05/2017 21:06

I see radio talkshow host and political non-entity Nigel Farage can't help sticking his oar in.

Westministenders: Its WAR. Huh!? What is that good for? Negotiations apparently
optionalrationale · 07/05/2017 21:07

Today 20:41 Bearbehind

"optional, instead of being sarcastic and goady, could you address the point many of us are making. If Juncker's account of this dinner wasn't accurate, why didn't TM counter it with her version of events?"

Perhaps she was sticking to the ideal of a private dinner.