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Brexit

Westministenders: Its WAR. Huh!? What is that good for? Negotiations apparently

996 replies

RedToothBrush · 05/05/2017 22:39

Theresa May has declared war on the EU. She is going to be a ‘bloody difficult woman’ after she got caught out by a highly predictable leak.

Apparently, the EU are trying to rig an election she seems almost dead cert to win. They deliberately timed the leak to interfere with an election May decided the timing of. May was not supposed to be at the dinner, but after she announced the election she decided that she had to get in on the act for some reason. Wildly speculating here, but could this be because she wanted the political mileage herself?

No it wasn't a preplanned strategy. Don't be stupid. That would suggest they had the foggiest clue and a plan. Nope, the war declaration was an opportunist damage limitation exercise, used to maximise political capital.

She has now even further alienated the EU. It seems difficult to conceive how any deal will be done. Instead it looks like the election is trying to set us up to crash out. Whether the ‘No deal is better than a bad deal’ happens to make the 3 page Tory Manifesto remains to be seen.

This would leave EU nationals and British national aboard in legal and social limbo.

There is also a feud building over the Brexit leaving bill, which is steadily climbing. We can not progress to the second stage of Brexit without resolving this. Again, this seems unlikely.

Thirdly, a settlement with Ireland is a top priority for the EU, and plans are being drawn up to make allowances for any potential United Ireland. This is a subject that is still to be talked about on any level really. May has been much more interested in the fate of Scotland and battling with Nicola Sturgeon.

That’s the thing. May is like the playground bully who goes around going “Do you wanna scrap ?, Do ya? DO YA?” and generally throws their weight around and most of the time gets their own way as a result. The trouble with the strategy is when the bigger kid comes along and thumps the bully, for being a cocky little shit and doesn’t like their kid brother getting picked on.

The trouble is that May is setting it up, to try and make it look like the poor little Britain has been picked on to her parents, so they go around accusing the big kid of all sorts rather than admitting their little darling is a nasty little shit.

It’s not going to end well is it? You can’t help but feel that at some point they’ll all end up in the Headmasters office and the WTO/UN/International Courts will rule against us for being a bunch of dickheads. No doubt May, will stick to character, hold a grudge and demand to leave them or say they have no authority over the UK.

That or we really will end up declaring war on Spain over Gibraltar. By accident of course. Probably to keep the ConKip party together and avoid a split.

Rule Britannia. Britannia rules. Erm, not a lot these days.

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Peregrina · 07/05/2017 19:56

Britain makes it known that a 'war negotiator' (actually a conflict negotiator) has been consulted

I strongly suspect that he will tell May and chums a few uncomfortable truths. Next thing we know he will be sacked.

The aim is to unite the country behind the Tories so that they can win the GE and proceed to effect a neo fascist revolution in Britain.

England and Wales. N Ireland will be gone and so will Scotland. Some sort of fudge or quiet agreement for joint sovereignty will be on the cards for Gibraltar.

mathanxiety · 07/05/2017 19:58

On alienation, demonisation, war -
"You/EU started it" Exhibit A:
It was your pal Junkers who decided to leak a one sided version of a private dinner to the German press. It was his choice to do this. It is in his interests to portray the UK as "losing" in this negotiation and the EU as "winning" as this is his only hope of holding the EU together
[posted by OptionRationale, of course]

mathanxiety · 07/05/2017 20:00

No - the tidbit about the war negotiator is a piece of election theatre. It doesn't matter what he says to the government. What matters is the publicity.

woman12345 · 07/05/2017 20:00

Sensible politicians, like Brown and Blair, teamed up with democrats to work up winning strategies, and vice versa. The Obama team got quite a lot of Labour help.

Sensible politicians like Starmer, Lammy etc should team up with European liberals like Merkel and Macron ( who is a stunning marketing man) to work up winning strategies.

BigChocFrenzy · 07/05/2017 20:02

Official Leave.eu tweeted "RIP, France"

Next time a Brexiter visiting here complains about our criticism of them:
this tweet isn't just from any old supporter;
this is the official leave.eu claiming France is doomed because it didn't elect a fascist president

If Leave.eu don't tweet similarly when May gets elected this June, what does that say about their opinion of her politics ? Confused

Bananagio · 07/05/2017 20:04

Vive La France! Wine
Enjoy the celebrations misti and thanks for all your posts regarding the elections there over recent threads

HashiAsLarry · 07/05/2017 20:04

This will hurt them a lot, I'm sure we will have a few shills in shortly.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 07/05/2017 20:05

.

Bearbehind · 07/05/2017 20:05

optionalrational I'd love to hear what you think the 'other side' of the one sided story is?

To me,the very fact that TM went on the offensive is proof it was actually an accurate account of events.

Why do you think it wasn't?

woman12345 · 07/05/2017 20:09

Official Leave.eu tweeted "RIP, France"

The anti eu fascists lost, even complete dotards should get that.

mathanxiety · 07/05/2017 20:11

www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/may/07/the-great-british-brexit-robbery-hijacked-democracy?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

What’s been lost in the US coverage of this “data analytics” firm [in the haste to point fingers at Russia] is the understanding of where the firm came from: deep within the military-industrial complex. A weird British corner of it populated, as the military establishment in Britain is, by old-school Tories. Geoffrey Pattie, a former parliamentary under-secretary of state for defence procurement and director of Marconi Defence Systems, used to be on the board, and Lord Marland, David Cameron’s pro-Brexit former trade envoy, a shareholder.
.
SCL/Cambridge Analytica was not some startup created by a couple of guys with a Mac PowerBook. It’s effectively part of the British defence establishment. And, now, too, the American defence establishment.

This is not just a story about social psychology and data analytics. It has to be understood in terms of a military contractor using military strategies on a civilian population. Us. David Miller, a professor of sociology at Bath University and an authority in psyops and propaganda, says it is “an extraordinary scandal that this should be anywhere near a democracy. It should be clear to voters where information is coming from, and if it’s not transparent or open where it’s coming from, it raises the question of whether we are actually living in a democracy or not

Finding “persuadable” voters is key for any campaign and with its treasure trove of data, Cambridge Analytica could target people high in neuroticism, for example, with images of immigrants “swamping” the country. The key is finding emotional triggers for each individual voter.

This is Britain in 2017. A Britain that increasingly looks like a “managed” democracy. Paid for a US billionaire. Using military-style technology. Delivered by Facebook. And enabled by us. If we let this referendum result stand, we are giving it our implicit consent. This isn’t about Remain or Leave. It goes far beyond party politics. It’s about the first step into a brave, new, increasingly undemocratic world.

(1) And this isn't about Russia either.
(2) The DUP are the storm troopers of the new fascist movement.

(And for those interested in the career of Irish political dabbler and Eurosceptic Declan Ganley - mentioned on a previous thread - his company is a US defence contractor).

squoosh · 07/05/2017 20:12

Official Leave.eu tweeted "RIP, France"

Hissy fitting.

They were dying to say 'see.........SEE.....the French have seen the glory of Brexit and decided to join us'.

Lol.

woman12345 · 07/05/2017 20:14

That article certainly explains a lot math and why the orange lodge are on the march.

The anti EU fascists have lost in two EU countries now, and Germany looks encouraging BigChoc. Fascists are awful at international alliances; old Farage's assistance hasn't helped MLP or Wilders much.

RedToothBrush · 07/05/2017 20:17

So I posted this earlier:
www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/may/07/the-great-british-brexit-robbery-hijacked-democracy?CMP=twt_gu
The great British Brexit robbery: how our democracy was hijacked

Dominic Cummings responded:

odysseanproject‏*@odysseanproject*
Piece by @carolecadwalla = v bad journalism + her ludicrous conspiracies undermine serious debate on important issues viz data & politics

she responded:

Carole Cadwalladr‏**@carolecadwalla**

I present evidence that 5 Leave campaigns illegally co-ordinated. Vote Leave's strategist accuses me of "bad journalism". Go figure.

THREAD. Two brave whistleblowers provided evidence of illegal co-ordination of Leave campaigns. Pls make it worth risk. RT & do SOMETHING.

Dominic Cummings, Vote Leave strategist, spent more than 50% of funds with @aggregateIQ - a key part of Robert Mercer/Steve Bannon empire..

Weird how he didn't seem to know when - whoops! - here he is tweeting about Robert Mercer's amazing hedge fund, Renaissance Technologies

Westministenders: Its WAR. Huh!? What is that good for? Negotiations apparently
Westministenders: Its WAR. Huh!? What is that good for? Negotiations apparently
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twofingerstoEverything · 07/05/2017 20:17

Blimey. That Leave.eu tweet just says it all.

RedToothBrush · 07/05/2017 20:18

From Guardian article

Westministenders: Its WAR. Huh!? What is that good for? Negotiations apparently
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Lico · 07/05/2017 20:18

Interesting point from Bertoncini
Bbc live

The French are Europe sceptic but not Europe phobic

optionalrationale · 07/05/2017 20:20

"Today 20:05 Bearbehind optionalrational I'd love to hear what you think the 'other side' of the one sided story is? To me, the very fact that TM went on the offensive is proof it was actually an accurate account of events. Why do you think it wasn't?"

We don't know. It was a private dinner.

MsHooliesCardigan · 07/05/2017 20:21

Brilliant result. Looks like we're on our own.

squoosh · 07/05/2017 20:22

I've flicked on Sky News and Murnaghan does seem peeved Le Pen won. He's desperate to put a negative slant on the Macron victory.

BiglyBadgers · 07/05/2017 20:26

Reality Check: Are there 6,700 fewer mental health staff?

The claim: At least 6,700 mental health nurses and doctors have been cut from the NHS in England since 2010.
Reality Check verdict: That's about right.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39836506

RedToothBrush · 07/05/2017 20:28

UK Prime Minister‏*@Number10gov*

The PM warmly congratulates @EmmanuelMacron on his success and looks forward to working with him on a wide range of shared priorities.

Macron is on record as saying he didn't think the way the EU handled the Greek crisis was right...

He might have beaten Le Pen but that's not the end of it. He now has to deal with the division in French society.

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RedToothBrush · 07/05/2017 20:31

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/07/amber-rudd-hints-tories-might-drop-current-migration-target/
Amber Rudd hints Tories might drop current migration target from manifesto

Amber Rudd, the Home Secretary, has hinted that the Conservatives’ aim of reducing net migration to tens of thousands will not appear as a commitment in the party’s election manifesto.

Ms Rudd confirmed that the Conservatives were re-examining their target as she appeared to soften the party’s stance by describing immigration as an “absolute positive” for the UK.

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squoosh · 07/05/2017 20:31

The expression on his face when he was giving his speech indicated that he knows he has a lot of work ahead.

Bearbehind · 07/05/2017 20:31

We don't know. It was a private dinner.

PMSL -at what point are you going to wake up and smell the coffee optional?

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