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Westministenders: Boris and his friends hand in their homework to be marked.

990 replies

RedToothBrush · 03/02/2017 14:10

The last week has been depressing for a lot of people.

Even if you are happy about the vote in the Commons, there is a worrying lack of backbone in MPs of all shades.

Then there’s what is going on in the USA which I’m going to quietly ignore in this post except to say that cosying up to Trump still could backfire on all who do for numerous reasons.

It seems like its all over in someways, but there is still plenty going on.

The A50 Bill has only passed stage one. The Government’s deliberate publishing of the White Paper after the vote has left a lot of people with egg all over their face.

Plus its just crap. Actually its not crap. It’s a dog dinner of farcical proportions with no content, faulty data and incorrect details that an A-Level Student did the night before their assignment was due, masquerading as an official government document.

Now its amendment time, which is the serious bit. For an amendment to make it, it will need cross party support. After the government failed to produce a White Paper worth the paper it was written on, and insulted the intelligence of the House of Commons, that could get interesting.

For starters the White Paper says that EU citizens are one of our best bargaining chips. Trouble is a lot of Tory and Labour MPs don’t agree.

In short there is a fair old chance of a government defeat next week at some point. The government don’t want any. Especially not this early. I really think it will be very difficult for the government to provide the assurance MPs will want, even if they crack the whip. They have lost the trust of too many. In voting for the first vote, many MPs will feel they have shown their intent to support leaving and now will get busy on trying to hammer down the details.

Highlights include of the White Paper include the idea that we will still be subject to the ECJ except we won’t. This is ridiculous. We will be subject to ECJ rulings but not be subject to ECJ rulings directly. Eh? What? (Not that we didn’t see this coming). There’s Euroatom and the government doing an impression of Homer Simpson. With a by-election in Copeland on the cards. That story has some time to keep running. As Steve Peers points out, the Leprechauns are going to sort out Northern Ireland for us which is a great political strategy to employ.

Its full of lots of other utter bollocks but those particular points are the ones that are potentially the most problematic for the government. If you don’t think the White Paper screams we are going to get eaten alive by the EU and Trump, you need to get off the hallucinogenics pronto.

If that isn’t awe inspiring enough we also have:

The wonderful mental image of Paul Nuttall kipping on a mattress in a house in Stoke disparately pretending to be a Stokie, nervously hoping that letterbox rattling in the wind isn’t C4 letterbox again and that the coppers don’t pay him a visit in the near future. I confess that whilst my imagination has been kept busy with this, I am disappointed in the lack of video clips of him munching on an Oatcake in a Stoke City shirt, sitting on an Armitage Shanks throne, turning his plate over whilst listening to Robbie Williams and with a Titanic by his side. All at the same time. I think he’s missed a few tricks.

AND

Diane Abbott doing quite possibly even more damage to Labour than them merely rolling over and dying over a50 by pulling a sickie. Her ‘Brexit Flu’ damages the party’s image and Corbyn himself even more. If that’s even possible. Some Labour MPs have demanded an apology.

Labour is starting to look like it’s a ship with rats fleeing this week. MPs have defied a three line whip and quite the Shadow Cabinet (Again). Rumours are that over 7000 members have left. A councillor has defected to the Lib Dems. There was a council by election in Rotherham where Lab lost a seat to the LDs in an area where there has never been as many people vote LD. Nor were there as many remain voters as LD voters. The Parliamentary vote for Unite’s new leader has unsurprisingly selected the anti-Corbyn candidate Gerald Coyne over Len McCluskey. The bookies have dropped the odds on Corbyn leaving Labour before a GE from 6/1 to 2/1 overnight. Oh and Red Ed is being rumoured to be returning to the front bench…

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CeciledeVolanges · 04/02/2017 16:02

And the fact that he was told it was off the table isn't in itself a reason to throw ourselves off a metaphorical cliff. What if he had asked for something even more objectionable? What if Orban asked for his policies to be implemented in a special deal which suited him, and was told it was off the table? Should Hungary leave?

EmilyAlice · 04/02/2017 16:03

I agree with your interpretation WrongTrouser. Obviously lots of Brits have always lived in European countries before the EU.

Badders123 · 04/02/2017 16:05

Prawn...agree totally!

SemiPermanent · 04/02/2017 16:06

We could do with a bit of intelligence from a culture which was writing on paper while British people hadn't even managed to invent cups

China:

http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/sep/28/on-chinas-many-atrocities//*

So you want us to 'be more China' Woman??

I'd rather not tbh, regardless of when they started writing on paper.

SemiPermanent · 04/02/2017 16:10

Semi, for my part I was extremely ashamed when Cameron asked for that, especially in the circumstances.

So was I Cecile.

In fact, even JR-M said at the time that it was shameful that we were depicting migrants as 'just here to grub for benefits'.

Cameron focussing on benefits was shameful.

He should have asked for the 'emergency brake' option for people - that was what was needed - to be used as and when it was deemed necessary.

CeciledeVolanges · 04/02/2017 16:11

Side note: I'm still wading through the debate. Maria Eagle's speech: " 

Maria Eagle (Garston and Halewood) (Lab)

It is a pleasure to follow the right hon. Member for Wantage (Mr Vaizey). I agree with much of what he said about trade and parliamentary accountability.

After a great deal of thought, I have decided to vote against Second Reading tomorrow night, for a number of reasons that I would like to set out precisely. First, the Government’s behaviour since the referendum result has influenced my decision. The new Government have acted as though the vote gave them carte blanche to engineer the most extreme kind of arrangements for the UK leaving the EU, though in truth the referendum asked only whether voters wished to remain or leave and had nothing to say about the nature of the subsequent arrangements the UK should adopt.

The Government have embarked upon this approach without any kind of consultation across party or any meaningful involvement in Parliament, which, as the Supreme Court has just reaffirmed, is the sovereign power in the land. Consultation across parties should be the norm when dealing with proposals of serious constitutional change. It has not happened. We would not have this Bill before us now had not the courts, when asked, upheld our constitution and made it clear that prerogative powers cannot be used to remove the rights of individual citizens that have been conferred by statute. Yet the judges in the High Court were vilified for doing their job and attacked by a Cabinet Minister, who said that their judgment was

“an attempt to frustrate the will of the British people”

and was “unacceptable”. The Government are looking distinctly authoritarian in their demeanour and how they operate."
(Michael Gove then intervened)

CeciledeVolanges · 04/02/2017 16:13

Semi, let's not start comparing atrocities now. Just stop and have a little think about the colonial era.

woman12345 · 04/02/2017 16:15

desperate humans who should have a special status under international law and be provided for, surely?
Cecile absolutely, you're right! Status needs to be clear to access their legal rights, just worry that we've been encouraged to not see them as people, but you're right.

woman12345 · 04/02/2017 16:19

Cecile would be nice if Eagles could offer literacy catch up sessions to May's teamGrin following on from Swedish's post on the insulting level of eloquence in the White Paper, never mind the paucity of content. But think poor English, is another one of the techniques being used atm.

CeciledeVolanges · 04/02/2017 16:30

Thanks woman - it seems like a lot of originally neutral descriptors like "migrant", "refugee", "expert" and "racist" have become extremely charged, and I do feel quite wary of accidentally using a word with implications I don't intend

woman12345 · 04/02/2017 16:30

^Let’s designate a day on which no one (that is, anyone who can do so without being fired) goes to work, a day when no one shops or spends money, a day on which we truly make our economic and political power felt, a day when we make it clear: how many of us there are, how strong and committed we are, how much we can accomplish.”

Much of the organising of such an event is taking online, and without the support of the official unions.

Interesting.

lalalonglegs · 04/02/2017 16:30

I've just seen this on Huff Post: in pre-Brexit world, Osborne was lobbying to have May sacked.

woman12345 · 04/02/2017 16:33

Cecile It's our language(and it's so young! 500 years old compared to Mandarin's 3000 years!), if Shakespeare could fuck about with it we should say what we mean and mean what we say!
Except in legalese, of course!

woman12345 · 04/02/2017 16:35

lalalonglegs but he seems such a nice guy?! She'll be gone in 6 months to a year. Tories don't change their spots.

SemiPermanent · 04/02/2017 16:51

Semi, let's not start comparing atrocities now. Just stop and have a little think about the colonial era.

I'm not 'comparing atrocities'.

Just pointing out why I don't wish the UK to 'be more china'.

The colonial era is a shameful part of UK history - the atrocities carried out by Chinese authorities (as described in that article) have happened in the last 27 years.

CeciledeVolanges · 04/02/2017 16:57

They were just an example. In the last 27 years the U.K. has not had a spotless record

CeciledeVolanges · 04/02/2017 17:09

Wow, something I didn't know: Andrew MacNeil pointed out during the debate that the Uk will be one of only (currently) six countries in the UN not in a regional trade agreement. They are Mauritania, Palau, São Tomé and Principe, Somalia, South Sudan and East Timor. The Uk has been in a trade agreement of some sort since 1960. Even North Korea is in one.

Badders123 · 04/02/2017 17:24

Cecile
That is a very sobering stat and one that should worry us all - leaver and remained alike
That nigel farage interview was one I missed - his utter contempt for the working classes drips from every slimy word

BigChocFrenzy · 04/02/2017 17:27

Yes, cecile I did know that almost every country has joined trade blocs - the UK would be in a very unusual situation come 2019 or wherever, not belonging to a bloc.

Brexiteers - worryingly those in the Cabinet too - seem to want - and expect - to return to the world as it was several decades ago, when bilateral deals between completely separate countries was the norm.

The Uk's trouble is, the other 190 odd countries don't want to leave their trade blocs.

BigChocFrenzy · 04/02/2017 17:30

It's a bit like if nearly everyone belongs to one of the unions at your workplace, but you choose to leave yours and not join another
It's very isolating and you don't have much bargaining power

Badders123 · 04/02/2017 17:30

....which is precisely why trump and Putin want to destroy trading blocs...they've become too powerful

Badders123 · 04/02/2017 17:31

I was just going to compare it to being in a union!
#strongertogether

BigChocFrenzy · 04/02/2017 17:36

Trump & Putin just want to get even richer
Putin and his oligarch friends have made billions out of the kleptocracy that is Russia

imo, the reason Trump wanted to become POTUS was just to increase his personal wealth - which he will probably do, massively

He doesn't have any genuine beliefs other than that - he used to be a Democrat, but he couldn't have managed to take them over. The Republican party is a hollowed out shell, which was ripe for the plucking.

CeciledeVolanges · 04/02/2017 17:46

To be fair to Nigel Farage, I think he has a fairly equal opportunity policy of contempt to everyone who isn't Nigel Farage

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