Does anyone else sense a change of mood re Brexit?

[twofingerstoGideon]

I was rather astounded following the referendum that politicians of all shades weren't making noises about Brexit needing parliamentary scrutiny etc., but at last - after almost four months - it's as if people are waking up, noticing the shambles and saying "Hang on a minute... I'm not sure we should be doing this..." It was shocking to see the lack of reaction to the xenophobia and the way politicians of all shades seemed to be saying we had to blindly obey the very slim majority. The lack of disgust expressed by the press/politicians about the barefaced lies used by the Leave campaign (not to mention that poster) was also mind-blowing.

Has anyone else noticed a change in the air? I'm starting to feel slightly hopeful for the first time since 24th June that the country isn't just going to jump off a cliff in order to follow 'the will of the people'.

Anyone else, or am I deluded?

A combination of clusterfuck politics, stagnating incomes, and being subject to far too much intrusive personal surveillance is a potent weapon if you want the middle classes to kick off and cause real trouble on the streets, quite frankly. Perfect storm.

And the sheer cynicism of pretending they care about the poor, so sad. The poor and uneducated will be totally fucked now, as will will the rest if us.

Why do you call it cynicism? It's genuine concern.

Really? Johnsson? Fox? Davis? Concerned?

Yes

I think a seismic change in the social contract is about to happen, and the people that will orchestrate this will be the normally mild and meek-mannered.

They find the poor so terribly inconvenient. It undermines their political philosophy that laissez faire markets actually don't work when the Tories say they are going to.

Johnson, Fox and Davis have one concern each - that's looking after No. 1.
Let's just see Theresa May implement some of these policies which make a society work for everyone. Does she even know where the north of England is?

They have had years to show social conscience, they haven't. They've had years to train more doctors... When have these people grown some concern, I must have missed it...

Yes - really their decision to back brexit was professionally suicidal

The biggest betrayers of poor people were labour 1997 to 2010. They created a new generation of badly educated, indebted people. The legacy of Blair will mar a generation.

So let me ask you this:

What do the Brits think about Donald Trump?
DO you guys believe he is telling lies or the truth?
Do the Americans believe him?

Do YOU believe him?

Dont you think the rest of the world feel the same about the Brits and Brexit as they think about Trump and the Americans?

How are the campaigns any different?

From an outsiders perspective it is much the same! I honestly think Trump, Farage, Boris Johnson and the Brexit brigade where made from the same cloth, or as we say in Norway, chuted out from the same nose like snot. Or summat.

Shadow, I'm a leave voter and I absolutely abhor Trump. I've never liked him, on the apprentice, his treatment of the locals in Aberdeenshire where he built a golf course and his misogynistic views he spouted on a program done about him by Selina Scott years ago have always put me off. So no I don't think Trump and the Brexiters have anything in common at all.

Not all Leavers will be Trump supporters. But you can bet your life that all UK Trump supporters will have voted Leave.

In Europe yes, definitely. The Brexiters are seen as another version of Trump. And UKIP make sure this is the case. The fistfight in Brussels was the last straw, but Johnson has a terrible reputation too.

By the way, appalling to see the Brexit angry mob harassing Angela Rayner tonight and being incapable of actually thinking rationally.

On Question Time I mean

Nigel Farage would seem to disagree with you.

I wasn't there for the anti war March but was in London for the poll tax demonstrations (in 1989?) showd age

Just been watching question time and frustrated to see that the audience members who support brexit can't:/don't put across any kind of reasoned argument to support their view and just want us "bremoaners" to shut up and accept the vote of the "majority"

Well here's to democracy and I won't shut up.

Yes that was a particularly nasty and stupid Question Time.

I agree jaws disgraceful behaviour.

How can you be anti wa and support Hillary Clinton?

So no I don't think Trump and the Brexiters have anything in common at all.

You also wash your hands of all Brexit views that make you uncomfortable and pretend you haven't seen them or that it's just an unfortunate misunderstanding or it's only a few bad eggs and minor incidents, how silly people are to get upset.

From where I'm standing, there isn't a vast gulf of opinion between Trump and views like Cllr Holliday's, or the Express, or the Mail, or certain posters on here, and I suspect also most of last night's QT audience. Or indeed those of our very own government.

The elements,

Just as brexiters comprise a spectrum, so do remainers. For every racist brexiter you will find at least one remainer whose sole reason for voting was 'fuck you littleguy, my bonus depends on this and I need my underpaid European nanny and cleaner'.

Larry where are those views reflected? Who are you talking about? The xenophobic leavers are plain to see, where are those remainers you're talking about?

jaws

"Look! A squirrel!"

But actually how about this, anybody feeling really proud?

twitter.com/huddlestonnigel/status/789235940791349248
Desperately sad to hear that Polish lady say she doesn't feel welcome and then get booed for saying so on #BBCQT