Does anyone else sense a change of mood re Brexit?

[twofingerstoGideon]

I was rather astounded following the referendum that politicians of all shades weren't making noises about Brexit needing parliamentary scrutiny etc., but at last - after almost four months - it's as if people are waking up, noticing the shambles and saying "Hang on a minute... I'm not sure we should be doing this..." It was shocking to see the lack of reaction to the xenophobia and the way politicians of all shades seemed to be saying we had to blindly obey the very slim majority. The lack of disgust expressed by the press/politicians about the barefaced lies used by the Leave campaign (not to mention that poster) was also mind-blowing.

Has anyone else noticed a change in the air? I'm starting to feel slightly hopeful for the first time since 24th June that the country isn't just going to jump off a cliff in order to follow 'the will of the people'.

Anyone else, or am I deluded?

"I'm not sure if there's a pole far enough up my butt to join in"

Haha, that's the spirit WinchesterWoman. Off with the twin set and pearls and in with the fighting talk . I knew you had it in you.

Tell me the difference. It must take a special kind of 'holding two opposing beliefs at the same time' sort of mindset. Give me the full force of the doublethink.

Was that addressed to me WinchesterWoman?

No I'm just so behind. It's like when you think of a smart answer half way out the door. Been at work and you are busy bees.

WW I'm starting to enjoy your tantrums!

Yes it's all a bit random when I can't sit here all day shouting SOMEONE ON THE INTERNET IS WRONG

It's like when you think of a smart answer half way out the door.

There's a useful French phrase for that: L'esprit de l'escalier

WW the world is too complicated for you, and that makes you angry. Go back to the Daily Mail, that tells it as it is!

Aw bless you jaws.

Pedestrian - thankyou. We need one in English. (Well I do!)

Peregrina not pedestrian

Try this one WW "La ignorancia es la madre del atrevimiento". Just for you...

Do people seriously think the referendum was advisory? The government stated that they would follow the will of the people. I am sure it will be tested in court and show to be binding.

Also, the idea that people reAlly wanted a soft Brexit (I.e the status quo ante but worse) is ridiculous. We either Brexit or don't but the middle path is the worst of all worlds.

larry the most googled term on the say after the referendum was "What is the EU?". Holding a referendum was wrong and we are now in a massive mess.

Jaws why are you behaving like this? Did I kill your cat?

Jaws no it wasn't

Sorry WW. I will not let myself get annoyed any more. 😊

Re this " post truth " meme:

The entry of the UK to the Common Market voted on in my childhood was itself founded on a deception. My parents voted for economic trading union with western europe not a borderless political union.

annoyed is a thing - but i don't know why you get so personal

still, thanks for the apology, that's really sweet

Do people seriously think the referendum was advisory?

People do "seriously" think this, because it is legally and factually correct.

Referendums in the UK are not binding on parliament. In some cases, the legislation that implements the referendum (and which must be voted on and approved by parliament) may include a provision which makes the result binding - this was the case in the 2011 alternative vote referendum, for example.

The EU referendum legislation OTOH didn't include such a provision.

The referendum result may be politically binding - if the government can find a way of doing it that doesn't piss off too many voters - but it's certainly not legally binding.

most people don't think it was advisory mist and i highly doubt you would have thought so if the vote had gone the other way

I have no doubt if it had gone the other way we would be hearing plenty about its advisory nature - remember Farage's "unfinished business" comment.

If it had gone the other way, we would have been hearing nothing but how it wasn't binding from Farage. Nor would he have been silenced by the cries of "it's democracy, suck it up."

The question of whether the referendum was advisory or binding is a simple question of legal and constitutional fact, WW. What ignorant people or don't think is entirely irrelevant.

I don't disagree that it may be politically binding, but there is literally nothing, from a constitutional and legal point of view, to stop the government from saying "whoops! Wrong answer!" and refusing to implement it. Or, for that matter, to stop parliament voting it down if it gets the chance.

Obviously there would be political consequences but that's another matter.

WW I'm sure you're a nice person and I'm sorry. It's just that this issue is very personal to me. If Brexit goes ahead with all its consequences it could actually destroy my family. I am also sure, from daily scrutinizing (compulsively, I admit) several political blogs, British and European press, that this is going to be catastrophic for us and our children. I work in sixth form education, many students' plans are up in the air, I know several people who are expecting to lose their jobs and many, many others who are leaving UK or making plans to. Emotionally this has been very hard too, for us EU citizens who've made UK our home, many of us have British partners and British children. A close friend told me the other day how her love story with the UK ended when she heard Amber Rudd's speech. She's a EU citizen who has worked in the NHS for 20 years, in a very specialised field. I hope you understand that we are talking about real lives here, so thing can feel very personal. Apart from that I wish you all the best, x

Post truth doest equate to the EU changing over time.

Go look at the definition.