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Brexit
Original poster

Does anyone else sense a change of mood re Brexit?

649 replies

twofingerstoGideon · 19/10/2016 16:23

I was rather astounded following the referendum that politicians of all shades weren't making noises about Brexit needing parliamentary scrutiny etc., but at last - after almost four months - it's as if people are waking up, noticing the shambles and saying "Hang on a minute... I'm not sure we should be doing this..." It was shocking to see the lack of reaction to the xenophobia and the way politicians of all shades seemed to be saying we had to blindly obey the very slim majority. The lack of disgust expressed by the press/politicians about the barefaced lies used by the Leave campaign (not to mention that poster) was also mind-blowing.

Has anyone else noticed a change in the air? I'm starting to feel slightly hopeful for the first time since 24th June that the country isn't just going to jump off a cliff in order to follow 'the will of the people'.

Anyone else, or am I deluded?

OP posts:
funnyandwittyusername · 21/10/2016 20:05

Jaws was that at me?

Bearbehind · 21/10/2016 20:06

Why is it that Leavers play the goady card as soon as they are actually asked a straight forward question?

ww, you've taken being goady to a whole new level on this thread.

Why is it so difficult to tell us what we should hope for from leaving the EU and how you see the negatives being offset?

WinchesterWoman · 21/10/2016 20:10

I'm not playing the goody card: I genuinely feel goaded. Possibly the accumulation of a lot of sneering and bitchiness. But you weren't here for that, so maybe it's a genuine inquiry.

And then you yourself join in with you've taken being goody to a whole new level on this thread.

how? all i've done is answer questions and make arguments. Othere people have been sneery and bitchy. So I was going to say, I've got a long ride tomorrow when I could give a nice long explanation but now I just can't be bothered. It's not difficult to explain: it's just difficult to engage with sneery insulting people.

Peregrina · 21/10/2016 20:13

Peregrina: it wasn't our hang ups that prevented us joining in 1963: it was France.

I am talking about the time before that - the 1950s. I think we were still too wrapped up in our Empire. I suspect if we had divested ourselves of it earlier, we might have had a different outlook. Once we had then turned our back on what became the EEC, and realised that we could no longer rely on our ex-Empire for our prosperity, then we sought entry, which had to wait until de Gaulle was no longer around to veto it.

jaws5 · 21/10/2016 20:13

I could post many, many more...

Bearbehind · 21/10/2016 20:14

I haven't seen anyone 'sneer' at you.

That's another strike in the leavers bullshit bingo - sneery.

It's always bought out in preference to answering the bloody question.

Along with 'it's not difficult to explain, I just can't be bothered.'

If you're so convinced we have a shiny future why can't you even attempt to articulate how it will look?

WinchesterWoman · 21/10/2016 20:16

German media is heavily pro-government and self-censoring. I'm not surprised there's a xenophobia narrative. After all, it's strong enough here. Alternative narratives are not encouraged in the establishment media, here or abroad.

It's a melancholy thought that people read several newspapers cover to cover and think they know what's going on in the world.

jaws5 · 21/10/2016 20:18

"It's a melancholy thought that people read several newspapers cover to cover and think they know what's going on in the world" as opposed to what, divine intervention?

WinchesterWoman · 21/10/2016 20:18

Bear: no you wouldn't have seen that because it's probably part of your mindset too. We only notice when we don't agree with the general standpoint (in general).

I would have done, tomorrow, but this hostile tone towards me all the time is fucking tedious, it really is.

WinchesterWoman · 21/10/2016 20:19

I think it is not a binary 'all newspapers are true vs divine intervention' situation we have here.

jaws5 · 21/10/2016 20:19

"German media is heavily pro-government and self-censoring"... where do I start with that one? But whatever facts you are presented with you dig your heels even more, so I'll leave it there.

Bearbehind · 21/10/2016 20:21

ww if the tone is hostile it's because all you do is post goady rhetoric and refuse to actually answer questions on the reality of the situation.

Mistigri · 21/10/2016 20:22

German media is heavily pro-government and self-censoring

Genuine question - do you read German? Because a quick google of "german media censorship" comes up with the usual alt-right sites, and a cynical person might suspect that your opinon on this subject is not necessarily based on having ever read a German newspaper.

Badders123 · 21/10/2016 20:23

ANYONE who voted leave along with with Nigel farage et al will sure as hell get all the contempt and ire I can muster.
I absolutely judge people by who they align themselves politically with - whether that be Tory, ukip or BNP.
To say you voted leave and then bleat about not being racist is like killing and eating a cow and telling everyone you are vegetarian.
That is: utter bollocks

Bitofacow · 21/10/2016 20:24

WW I've probably have been a bit goady if I'm being honest.

It is difficult on a thread if you are making a point others disagree with. You would never behave in a similar way would you??

jaws5 · 21/10/2016 20:24

I gave you examples from German, Spanish, French, Russian and American press. There are more from Argentina, Brazil, China, South Africa and dozens of other countries, but it doesn't worry you so you give me an empty statement about the German press.

jaws5 · 21/10/2016 20:26

Genuine question - do you read German? Because a quick google of "german media censorship" comes up with the usual alt-right sites, and a cynical person might suspect that your opinon on this subject is not necessarily based on having ever read a German newspaper. Exactly Mistrigri. Multilingual Brits have mostly voted Remain.

Badders123 · 21/10/2016 20:26

We are a global laughing stock
It's embarrassing

WinchesterWoman · 21/10/2016 20:27

Just in case people can't be bothered to read the links:

Wolfgang Herles, the former head of a public broadcaster Zweites Deutsches Fernsehen (ZDF), said journalists are instructed to write news reports that are to 'Ms Merkel's liking'.

InformalRoman · 21/10/2016 20:28

The UK chose not to join the ECSC.

The UK was a founder member of EFTA in 1960.

De Gaulle blocked the UK joining the EEC (which was then composed of the Benelux countries, Italy, France and Germany) because he thought that the UK's economy was incompatible with the EEC.

WinchesterWoman · 21/10/2016 20:28

all you do is post goady rhetoric 100% cast-iron bolleaux

Peregrina · 21/10/2016 20:29

I wouldn't entirely agree with your statement badders but I think it's very much a question of be careful who you ally yourself with. In the last few weeks of the Referendum campaign Farage especially made blatant links with immigration, as I believe Gisela Stuart did also with Turkey's supposed accession to the EU,or was she even saying Syria might accede? At that stage, Leavers who genuinely were not racist should perhaps have paused and reconsidered their vote.

WinchesterWoman · 21/10/2016 20:30

Bear behind: and if you really have been reading long enough to 'observe' this then you know I've answered many questions, posted many arguments, and there has been loads of sneering and goadiness and hostility towards me, which has not diminished with your esteemed contributions.