'leavers' At last we have a date for A50. March 2017 it is then.

[surferjet]

Good to have a set date.

Personally I think article 50 should not have been triggered until we had agreed a longer timeline for the exit process and the status quo during the negotiations. It is a bargaining chip we have given away for nothing.

Although I have to say in any case I find it very hard to believe that such a high % believed the £350 m claim by the date of the referendum as I thought it had been generally rubbished well before 23rd June.

Yes but you can notice trends of the groups, of course you can't say they all are this or that, but you can say that a sizable amount are, which data proves. Therefore you can make judgements about reasons driving votes.

Well you did lose, that's a fact
Yes, we all did.

In fact since Brexit we've all lost about 15% in terms of PPP with other countries.

I actually think that you are contributing enormously to the anger felt in these threads because you seem hell bent on trying to wind Remainers up by making pathetically shallow comments with absolutely no attempt at defending your position

Firstly, I hardly post on this board anymore.
Secondly, I started this thread for LEAVERS, not to annoy remainers, you choose to post on it. plus triggering A50 next March was all over the news.
Finally, I gave my reasons for voting leave several times back in June/July. I'm not going over it all again.

You don't get to control who posts, and as pointed out your reasons were generally based on the fact that you were very ill informed, you have to expect challenge to them.

"article 50 should not have been triggered until we had agreed a longer timeline for the exit process and the status quo during the negotiations. It is a bargaining chip we have given away for nothing."

It's not triggered yet.

How is it ever a bargaining chip? You people voted for Brexit so you will of course trigger Article 50. The probability of it happening is 100%. That's not exactly a great bargaining chip if you don't have anything to bargain with.

Any update on why setting a date is good? It seems a bit silly to complain about people derailing the thread and posting insults if you engage with the people derailing the thread and posting insults.

"Setting a date is considered good because we are currently in a limbo that nobody expected"

Actually, loads of people expected this "limbo". Those loads of people warned before the referendum that even if Brexit were immediately acted upon, which was unlikely, it would take years for trade agreements, legal framework, etc to be agreed upon and rewritten, and that UK would suffer very significant losses in especially investment over that period.

"Markets dislike uncertainty"

True. But markets dislike certainty of economic loss even more. Which is why the hard Brexit date announced by May two days ago led to GBP jumping off yet another cliff.

It doesn't pay to annoy the people you hope to negotiate with in a few months time and who you will have an ongoing relationship with in the future. If we are reliant on their goodwill in negotiations, it pays to heed their calls to sort this out as soon as possible.

It's a bit late for that now. A small coterie spend the better part of 40 years slagging the EU off, and whipping up anti EU fervour. The UK constantly asks for and gets favourable terms and we still whinge that it's not enough. I can't say I blame the rest of them for saying, 'on your bike'.

Personally, I admire surfer - she has absolute courage of her convictions and is steadfast in the face of all argument or discussion, she is unashamed of her beliefs and proudly speaks her views that Leaving the EU is the way to a glorious future in which Britain will be Great again, the rule of law is dispensed with, and all the immigrants will leave. And she bravely comes back again and again to reiterate her views.

(And no, I'm not being sarcastic! I really do admire her.

Ever since the referendum, and certainly in the past couple of days of frankly fascist developments being applauded at the Tory conference, I have been struck by the lack of criticism amongst some our most prolific Leave posters here - who are otherwise desperate to assure us how much they love all the peoples of the world and adore sovereignty and democracy. It's almost like they actually approve of everything that's happening, but find it all so grubby and unpleasant, how convenient that others will do and say these things so they don't have to soil their own delicate hands. It's virtue-signalling bollocks.

And then there are the other Leave voters, who just scuttled off to some private board, because if anybody disagreed with them, it was being mean and bullying and sneering which will be a capital crime in New Britain and why wasn't everybody showering them with praise etc etc.)

They'll be glad to see the back of Farage, at least! He'll keep the EU pension for life, I'm sure.

Exactly element I'm still waiting for the two people I know who voted Leave assuring me they're about democracy not racism, to express dismay at Tory rhetoric... Ain't gonna happen!

"Markets dislike uncertainty"

True. But markets dislike certainty of economic loss even more. Which is why the hard Brexit date announced by May two days ago led to GBP jumping off yet another cliff.

Yes. GBPUSD 1.27 and HSBC expects 1.15 around the triggering of A50. It's being priced in as a sloppy mess delivered by an incompetent government.

And is one reason shares are soaring ( I am watching mine hourly at the moment as it's fun).

I am a Remainer but we do need some certainty so if we do go ahead and issue the notice in March then things will start.

I think we will get a protracted Brexit whatever you think, tiggytape. Two years will be spent discussing the minutiae of how we split various assets - how much of, say, a beef quota belongs to the UK and how much to the rest. Only then we will be free to discuss trade deals, which typically seem to take up to ten years.

"The UK as a whole voted for leave"

It most certainly did not, it was a minuscule majority, this "as a whole" or "overwhelmingly" is factually incorrect.

But then Brexiters don't like facts.

But as it is, the only options we have are to start negotiating soon or to wait longer to start negotiating.

It might be more sensible to wait, until we know what it is we want to ask for. At the moment May and her three stooges appear not to have a clue. As they say, "To fail to prepare is to prepare to fail".

But isn't the triggering of Article 50 just the beginning of the uncertainty? because we go from certain EU membership to what? [Waits for a Leavers to say no-ones knows but...]

I would go so far as to say that the date that marks the beginning of unpicking the UK from the EU is a tiny speck of a detail of uncertainty in comparison to a) upon what terms the UK will trade with EU countries b) whether City trades will still be EU passported and if not how much business will be lost to Paris, Frankfurt and Dublin c) how much university and research funding can be expected from outside of the UK d) whether 'big business' will want to remain in the UK which is not an EU member e) how long sorting out this giant shit-fan interface will take.

THAT is true uncertainty.

I think they do know what they're asking for - all the benefits of the single market without freedom of movement. If they don't get that, and they won't, then it's Hard Brexit.

I'm interested in what will happen after two years if the minutiae haven't all been sorted out and any member state(s) veto an extension.

What we do know is that firms are already making contingency plans. How much relocation happens is anyone's guess at present, but I think the country is going to get a nasty shock if Hard Brexit goes ahead. We will finally wake up to the fact that the Empire is well and truly finished, and that we are only a tiny island of the coast of W Europe.