Anyone else really worried now?

[MrsBlackthorn]

My work has started quietly drawing up contingency plans for if Brexit happens. Same at DH's work. Could mean lots of jobs moving to Germany and Ireland at both our firms. We're already seeing far fewer people investing or spending money.

I'm bloody terrified. Could lose my job. House could end up in negative equity. And for what?

I don't even think it's "project fear" from the government anymore... News today showed investors are taking money out of the UK faster than anytime since the crash. People with "skin in the game" voting with their money.

I understand that for lots of people the EU referendum isn't about money. however, because of a lot of it leaving, stopping coming in, or just simply being worth less... Well that leaves us screwed for a very long time. Fewer jobs. Less tax money coming in - so less money for the NHS and so on. So even if we 'take back control', of what exactly. what will we be 'in control' of?

I'm really worried about "Leave" happening and me and my family being utterly f*ed in a few months time as a result. Has the country lost its mind?

Anyone else worried about where this leaves us?

Kitty thank you for posting that, it really illuminated something for me.

People talk a lot about the fact that we are the fifth/ninth biggest economy in the world without reflecting on why that is. For my money there are several crucial factors that combine make us uniquely attractive to investment. We are an Anglophone economy that affords access to the largest single market in the world, and in more recent years the fact we are in the EU without being exposed to the Eurozone is an added benefit.

It's a pretty good USP. A company wants access to the EU without a language barrier or exposure to Eurozone risks? Set up shop in Britain.

Take away one of those factors and we no longer have a USP that compensates for some of the downsides of setting up shop here such as higher property costs, etc.

I'm a bit more concerned than I was yesterday, as Wolfgang Schäuble has just said that Germany will oppose single market access from outside the EU, which would seem to preclude an EEA (Norway relationship. If true this would be devastating for my employer.

Mine too :(

I think we are likely to hear more of these threats in the next week or so

It's damaging and I think more to the remain party. voters won't be threatened look how it back fired with Obama

I think many people believe
Germany runs the show and with remarks like this that helps support that argument

I fear you are right and it scares and frustrates me in equal measure that people can be so bloody-minded that they would rather stick two fingers up to Germany and accept almost certain short and medium term economic pain and risk long-term prosperity, rather than say 'OK, now we know what Germany would do, EEA option is out, I'll factor that into my considerations.'

I'm getting excited!!! I can't wait I really hope it's an out

I hadn't really thought about this being an issue. I don't like the way the German government have treated Greece and handled the refugee crises and don't believe they act in the best interests for Europe but then does any country

I was with my friend the other day and her parents and their neighbours popped over. Her parents/neighbours are aged 70/80's and talk moved onto the referendum and I was surprised at their mistrust of Germany and that they felt it was German psyche that they want to dominate Europe and are doing so through the EU

Then I get to thinking how my grandparents felt which I am sure they would express similar views and is somewhat understandable as they served in the war even though my great grandmother was German

So yes it will back fire more so becuause he is German if it was from the French it would be meet with typical French being awkward but doubt it will change someone's view completely but a few more threats certainly will sway people

jellied I am so disturbed by this.. seriously. It's really clear that Brexit will mean pain for the next few years at the very least! And it won't be for the rich, it will be for the poor. The rich always survive. It's really not a matter for joy either way. Especially since the referendum campaign has been so nasty and divisive...

"I'm getting excited!!! I can't wait I really hope it's an out" In that case, they need to change you on to a lower dosage. There is a massive risk (not a certainty) that we will end up with a short term destroyed economy that royally fucks the people at the bottom of society and you are excited?

Agree pain for the next few years....
Stay and that's pain for the next 40years
Leave and that's pain for a period of time

Out out out out

Destroyed economy

Most voting out understand that the economy might be hit and slow down for a while but believe it will grow again and maybe just maybe it will grow into a fairer society than it is now and has been for a long time because here as in other parts of Europe the gap had grown wider the more the EU has had control

Unexp- short term destroyed economy that royally fucks the people at the bottom of society and you are excited?

Feel that now, so do most of the people I know.

Change is good.

Still excited

Minimising estimate is a loss in the first 12 months of 500,000 jobs - from all sorts of businesses (not just big businesses but owner-operators too) is not the equivalent of "might be hit and slow down for a bit" Enthusiasm.

That is a low estimate - it could be higher than that. What incredible insensitivity to those workers and their families.

My brother works in construction and has lost his job three times since the last credit crunch. You want to pop round and tell him "it's only for a bit, but it's OK because I'll be better off long term"?

Young people are always the hardest hit in recessions. You want to tell the graduates who won't have jobs to go to, or the school leavers who won't get apprenticeships or first jobs and will languish in the dole instead that it's all ok because they're free from the shackles of Europe.

Unexp - preaching to the choir. Worked for a house builders both me and husband, I was office based. Last recession lost jobs and then lost house.

And guess what that was whilst in the EU.

And they are talking about another recession if in or out.

So yep I'll come round and tell him why I'm pleased and hopeful.

Jelliedeels That's one guy how about the thousands that come not with jobs to do?

From what I have seen the studies dont bear this out to be true with them paying more than they claim. I had the same conversation with the 'one guy' and he said the same argument was put forward in his european country and proved without a doubt that they contribute more than claim.

If local authorities and government i.e people like Gove block building of new facilties in line with growing business and tax receipts then thats something completely outside of the EU.

British public "wrong about nearly everything to do with the EU referendum" finds poll.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/eu-referendum-british-public-wrong-about-nearly-everything-survey-shows-a7074311.html

And many people in the construction business have lost their jobs or had to offer lower contracts because of being undercut many have said this is down to large numbers of immigrants workers who can and do work for a lesser rate

Many stuck in zero hours contracts receiving tax credits and or housing benefit to top wages up cover for hours they don't get work

Many kept on low wages with little room to improve their life again receiving tax credits to make ends meet

But those earning 100k plus has been growing and they are not the richest by far but why is there such a growing gap

Unless you want to deny the gap is not growing or is all in our minds and that wage increases are in line with living costs

"Unexp - preaching to the choir. Worked for a house builders both me and husband, I was office based. Last recession lost jobs and then lost house.

And guess what that was whilst in the EU. "

So, and I want to be clear that I understand your argument and that I am not putting words in your mouth.

8 years ago there was a global credit crunch, and that caused a global recession. You and your partner lost your jobs. The EU didn't cause it, but they didn't stop it.

Therefore, you are quite excited about the thought of causing other people to lose their jobs, in order to leave the EU.

This is because you have weighed up the accepted outcome of a leave vote (a probable recession) against the possibility that there might be a recession anyway (but far less certain).

That's a fair summation?

enthusiasm the question is more which parts are linked to the EU.. and which in fact not, and which might in fact get a lot worse if we leave the EU.

So why is it the migrants problem? Surely the problem is crap employers and UK people being not very selective in the type of companies they use. You could make use of all kinds of certification to promote the use of UK staff over migrants.

House building is dodgy as hell as it is with their stop starting of schemes to manage house prices.

Thats why we need unions, and in some part unions I thought were trying to reach out to migrant workers to try to stop this race to the bottom in terms of wages.

So will the NHS be saved by staying

Well it's crashing now

Will construction work slow down

Well it might and is likely for a while that might make some EU workers look elsewhere that might free up jobs when investments grow again

Will the housing market crash

Some see that in the long term being not such a bad thing as prices have in some parts of the country are out of reach for now even the middle class

Many who are struggling now and have been for some time manu are aware they probably are in for a few more hard years but see something might shift they can't see that with us staying in the EU as it has just got more and more difficult yet we are being told constantly the economy is growing

enthusiasm - tax credits are a british government invention, not an EU issue. Immigration keeping wages lower? Bollocks - employers keeping wages lower. Zero hours contracts - employers not the EU.

You seem to have fallen, truly fallen, for the myth that immigrants are the cause of problems for working class and underclass people. Really? Because I am underclass and life was pretty fucking shit in the 80s and 90s before we had mass migration from Europe. It was the fault of the ruling classes in Westminster then, and it still is now.

Enthusiasm - apologies if I have already posted this here (I know I stuck it on one thread) but why I don't think immigrants are the cause of those problems www.unexpectedsocialist.blogspot.co.uk/2016/06/if-immigration-is-your-answer-someone.html

Hopefully that link works.