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Brexit

12 million Turks say they'll come to the UK

137 replies

BritBrit · 22/05/2016 05:13

A survey conducted across all Turkish regions says that 16% (12 million) of the population say they want to come to the UK when the nation joins the EU. With membership talks set to start again in June should the UK be worried & will this influence your vote in the EU referendum

www.express.co.uk/news/uk/672563/Turkey-EU-Britain-exclusive-poll-crime-figures-Turks

OP posts:
MrSnow · 24/05/2016 12:18

Chillyegg

You haven't understand the context of what the word was used in, read it again calm down.

Chillyegg · 24/05/2016 12:21

Well let's talk about why I'm a moron.
Do you dispute that white privilege doesn't exist.

MrSnow · 24/05/2016 12:23

Let's talk about why you're a moron?

OK, the context of the post you're whinging about was totally lost on you. The saw the word "paki" and went into meltdown without understanding why.

Will that do?

MrSnow · 24/05/2016 12:25

Do you dispute that white privilege doesn't exist.

Yes. Privilege stems from socio-economic factors and not racial make up.

Chillyegg · 24/05/2016 12:26

No I won't calm down because it's well known that word is offensive and most people know not to use that word. Also I'm pissed of that it becomes a ethnicity issue when really it should be a people issue. We should be discussing Wether we as a country can support x amount of people not can we support Muslims/turkish people/packistani people.

MrSnow · 24/05/2016 12:27

No I won't calm down because it's well known that word is offensive

Did you even read the post properly. Do you need me to help you out and explain it to you?

Chillyegg · 24/05/2016 12:28

I think this is going to turn into a slanging match Mrsnow as you think I'm "whinging" about an extremely loaded word. I think your being deliberately abuse to validate quite frankly offensive overt racism.

Chillyegg · 24/05/2016 12:30

Context sometimes doesn't matter would you use that term at work? And then when in a disciplinary meeting say to HR but it wasn't in that context.

MrSnow · 24/05/2016 12:30

Chilly,

You have basic comprehension problems.

MrSnow · 24/05/2016 12:31

Context sometimes doesn't matter would you use that term at work?

You really have no clue what the post was all about do you?

Chillyegg · 24/05/2016 12:36

Ok I've gone back and reread, the pp is listing ethnicities and religions as examples of people of whom anti-immigration supporters have a problem with.
Still doesn't make it ok.
So no I'm not thick and I certainly don't have a problem reading.
I'm not even going to get into an argument with you about white privilege.

usuallydormant · 24/05/2016 12:41

Talk about a total mis-representation and twisting of the survey results. The polling company should ashamed of itself for letting the Express twist the results into its headline about 12 million planning to move.

Actual question:
If Turkey becomes a full member of the EU, and Britain remains in the EU,
would you, or any member of your family, consider relocating to Britain?
Yes 15.8%
No 84.2%

So 16% of the population say they or someone in their family would THINK about moving to the UK. Not would move, would consider moving. Higher among young people, the educated, students, private sector workers as well as the unemployed (same rate as students). And much higher among nonbelievers and non headscarf wearers which the Express was probably a bit disappointed about. Interesting question to include.

So probably just like the many EU migrants who come to London, get great career experience and fluent business English, pay taxes, claim little to nothing via the NHS and often go home to educate their kids (i.e. like almost every Irish & French person I knew in London in my twenties who didn't marry a Brit).

If you asked the same question of British people about emigrating Australia or Spain you'd probably get a similar response. Young people want to travel the world shocker poll.

Vote in or out but don't let a news article that twists its own poll results change your mind.

For full results and question wording. cdn.images.express.co.uk/turkey-poll/RelocatingtoBritain_KONDA_Report.pdf?_ga=1.14397620.2055501988.1464088344

MrSnow · 24/05/2016 13:40

Ok I've gone back and reread, the pp is listing ethnicities and religions as examples of people of whom anti-immigration supporters have a problem with
Still doesn't make it ok

Neither does it make it OK for you to over the top about it.

I'm not even going to get into an argument with you about white privilege

Is that because you know you'll lose?

RedToothBrush · 24/05/2016 13:55

I am sick of this weeks football of choice.

To sum up the argument there is a threat that Turkey are going to join the EU at some point in the future (possibly near future) because Germany will force us to let them. We will not have the power to stop this from happening.

Whilst neglecting the fact that both Sarkosy and Merkel have opposed it in the past, Merkel particularly strongly. (Instead favouring a different agreement closer to Norway's - and therefore potentially the UK's - in principle).

The French under Hollande are now supporting the idea of Turkey's EU membership in principle (but legally would have to get it through their parliament and their majority isn't big enough currently). But they are 'a bit hung up' on the Cypriot issue and human rights still.

And this is whilst the political climate in the rest of Europe, is how shall we put this in light of Austria's election result and Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban comments that refugees “are threatening Europe’s Christian culture”.

Fragile? Is that the word I'm looking for?

Its been framed as if its just us here on our little over crowded island who are 'fighting against a tidal wave of migration'. Which is utter bollocks if you read just about any newspaper from any other EU state.

But wait! What's this?!!!

Guess who has been Turkey's biggest supporter of EU membership in recent years? That would be....

Big drumroll

Pause for effect

errrrr THE UK!!!

David Miliband the Foreign Secretary of the United Kingdom - Nov 2009
During a visit to Turkey underlined the UK government's support for Turkey's bid to join the European Union, saying: "I am very clear that Turkish accession to the EU is important and will be of huge benefit to both Turkey and the EU."

David Cameron, Prime Minister of the United Kingdom - July 2010
During a visit to Turkey promised to "fight" for Turkey's membership of the European Union, saying he was "angry" at the slow pace of negotiations. He added that "a European Union without Turkey at its heart is not stronger but weaker... not more secure but less... not richer but poorer."

Not that you'd think this was the case from this week's media on any side.

Why haven't Brexit, beaten Cameron (and Labour) round the head with this to the point of knocking him out?

Why is Cameron not stressing the fact that the Brexit idea of German Imperialism and Turkey joining the EU and therefore having more voting power than Germany are ever so slightly at odds with each other?

Cameron is instead merely insisting that the UK's voice and claims we don't have a veto are wrong. Which gives the impression that he is actually opposed to the idea of Turkey joining which is a bit of a departure from, being the one saying he would fight for them.

Its a bit of a weak argument, given all the other arguments he could make. Or does he want to try avoiding upsetting Turkey still?

Obviously a lot has happened in 6 years, but politicians tend to have long memories when it comes to their political opponents. But EVERYONE seems to have forgotten this little gem. Odd isn't it?

As I say, Remain are quite happy here to let the German and French take the heat for the idea rather than admit that actually its been a British political aim.

But Leave are also quite happy here to let the Germans and French take the heat here too. Rather that than confront the fact that the UK's support for Turkey was based primarily on British military, strategic and economic benefits which Britain wanted to pursue - for its own benefit in the face of EU opposition.

Otherwise they have to explain why they don't see Turkey as an economic /political partner to the UK whilst at the same time saying we should be looking for Economic partners outside the EU...

Ohhhh.

Just how far are we politically on this one from what Merkel would prefer? Merkel has similar issues to the UK, regarding Turkey, in just about every respect. The reality is more migration from Turkey would be even more politically damaging to Germany than it potentially is to the UK!

The refugee crisis changes very little. Turkey can hold them to the head of Germany like a gun, saying 'Refugees or Turks, you choose'. The trouble is your average Brit or German probably will just see them the same way even though they aren't. Unwanted, Muslim, a burden to society and social infrastructure and therefore a potential threat.

Of course, the Brexit argument is that even allowing Turkey via free travel in the rest of the EU or access to Schengen is a danger to our national security and we should stop it at all cost. Quite HOW we are supposed to influence this, if we are NOT part of the EU and we are not part of Schengen anyway, is a question I'd like some good solid answers too. Rather than just saying Turkey is full of poor sexist, murdering religious nutters intent on destroying the very fabric of our civilisation perhaps they could come up with some practical solutions rather than little more than thinly veiled racism or social scaremongering.

So, yes there is some racism going on here. Its NOT just racism against Turks though. And frankly, I don't think its just Leave who are guilty here of stirring the pot of blame or not coming clean about things.

David Cameron does not want to be seen as having a shared interest with Germany, DESPITE being pro-EU. Because of course, that means he's in bed with them and weak. Hmm

Which is mind bogglingly stupid and says something about our national ego, over and beyond Turkey.

It comes down to the fact that even pro-Europeans are seemingly 'embarrassed' at the prospect of hanging out with their foreign friends. We have this weird need to pretend they aren't really our friends like silly school kids who are desperate to be popular do.

The idea of exploring the fact that we are like other Europeans who also want national sovereignty and independence is not possible. But yes we can be like Norway and Switzerland (who have in no way been forced to compromise on anything). Oh and Iceland are nice white Christians who like banks so they are welcome in our club without any scrutiny about their levels of corruption or the state of their economic (which are far worse than you might think - as in some people have mortgages that are going UP, no matter how much they've paid into it).

Of course Turks are the nasty bad ones after taking in 3 million refugees with little support from anyone else. They should put up with overcrowding, stretched medical services, unemployment and crime so we don't have to...

Yep, the referendum, protecting our borders and Turkey's membership of the EU is far more important than thinking about ways to deal with migration as a global problem... because 'if we vote the right way, global migration won't be our problem'.

Right! Right??!

I wish everyone talking about Turkey as some kind of European disease would fuck off down a great big hole of arse. I am so fucking sick of it.

Turkey's issues are ones that the whole world needs wake up and pull its finger out to help Turkey with. They won't go away after 23rd June no matter the result.

But yes do believe what the newspapers are telling you as its easier to swallow than the reality...

MrSnow · 24/05/2016 14:05

Guess who has been Turkey's biggest supporter of EU membership in recent years? That would be....

errrrr THE UK!

Um....good effort but you're wrong and two quotes from 6 years ago doesn't prove your point.

Turkey is a country with diminishing human rights, diminishing freedom of expression and let's not even mention it's refusal to recognise the genocide it waged upon Armenia in 2016.

It shouldn't be in the EU. Probably ever.

MrSnow · 24/05/2016 14:05

*1915 not 2016

RedToothBrush · 24/05/2016 14:13

Nor will it.

Probably ever.

MrSnow · 24/05/2016 14:14

Nor will it.

Probably ever

The Elites that run and rule Europe need a constant supply of cheap labour. Turkey will be granted access.

RedToothBrush · 24/05/2016 14:20

Arh you are one of them.
If its not the Immigrants, its the Elites.

Nope. Not engaging in that bollocks.

Bye.

Thank you for strangling debate on MN.

MrSnow · 24/05/2016 14:22

Thank you for strangling debate on MN

Pathetic nonsense.

RedToothBrush · 24/05/2016 14:24

If you say so.

Bye!

Happily flounces off so I don't have to engage

MrSnow · 24/05/2016 14:27

No one has a gun to your head to force you to engage, this isn't Turkey FFS.

RedToothBrush · 24/05/2016 14:29

Oh isn't it?

waves more

MrSnow · 24/05/2016 14:31

Run along.

RedToothBrush · 24/05/2016 14:35

will do.

In the field of unicorns.