How will you vote in the EU referendum-Leave or Stay?

[BritBrit]

How will you be voting? Can admin add a poll?

BritBrit is spot on.

And "all of the benefits of the EU but none of the costs" is what the majority of EU countries already get - because they get back more than they pay in. No wonder they don't want the UK to leave, their gravy train will get watered down.

all of the benefits of the EU

The other countries don't all get back what they pay in.

Nowt like having the facts before you start a debate.

Limer said "the majority" not "all".

The UK's EU net contribution is about £7.5 Billion when all of the rebate, the discounts for international aid and EU spending in both the public and private sector are accounted for.

There are 12 countries who are net contributors amd 16 who are in net deficit, I hardly think it counts as a British paid for gravy train. If you divide it, it works out that the UK pays £460 million to these countries per year, or the equivilant of 0.1% of Polish GDP, hardly a gravy train.

Hyperbole and lack of facts yet again brexiters.

So we agree that the majority of countries are in net deficit.

However it's spun, that yearly EU contribution is £7.5 Billion that the UK could put to much better use.

Ah, but will we generate the benefits that the EU brings outside it? That's the problem, its much easier to put the financial figure on the costs, not as easy on the benefits, which despite A4's reaction do exist, why else would there be so much backing for remain amongst the UK industries which have been stated above.

If we come out of the EU and out fully, there is a liklihood that these benefits will not be realised, and we will generate far less tax, meaning the extra £7.5 billion won't be there.

I want my daughters to be able to wear what they like and not be told to dress up in some subservient gown in case it offends or causes some types to think they are fair game to be raped.

That's the most puzzling comment, on any subject, I've read here for some time.

Ah, but neither of us has a crystal ball. The UK industries you mention just want a regular source of cheap labour, rest assured they don't have the best interests of the UK at heart, they've got shareholders to satisfy.

My view is that the futurefor the UK is brighter outside rather than inside the EU.

Controlling EU migration alone is going to save billions.

I've no desire to enter into an argument over this - I can't convince you and you can't convince me.

That's why I say Bronze ( and Anna) to some extent try to dress up their arguments to sound reasonable, but they are actually thinly veiled racism and xenephibia. And yes I will use those words because when you make points like the one above, which implies that men from foreign countries are a threat to your daughters it is racist and xenephobic. It is also used to create "fear" in the reader, and an appeal to emotion to totally flawed argument.

Whatever happened in Germany and Sweeden is a small percentage of people who sought to take advantage of an extraordinary situiation, there are bad people all over the world, many in the UK too. Are you afraid to let your daughters listen to the radio because of the number of musicians and DJs that have been responsible for sex attacks?

The attempts to pass off any challenge to these views as shouting them down and to pull comparisons with what happened in Rotherham is actually disgraceful and absolute conflation of the situations.

Oh but I have lots of economic data, from lots of different institutions that back my views.

There is far less evidence for your view, which is why the Brexit side aren't shouting it from the roof tops, its just not convincing.

One of the problems in the build up to brexit, is that whenever you say you are worried about mass migration affecting the provision of heatlh and education and wages going down and cost of housing going up, simple supply and demand issues. the pro Europe campaign have countered that anyone who hold negative views on immigration is a stupid racist. Doesn't really address the problems that the disenfranchised natives are encountering.
And now there is still a lack of respectful debate as lurked101 has demonstrated with her tinfoil hat wearing swivel eyed loon comments about anyone who thinks that we may be better off outside Europe.
I'd like to know the nationality of people wanting in or out votes, I think that would be a useful fact

When I go to vote LEAVE I will be wearing one of this fetching selection of tinfoil hats to appease people such as Lurked.

This will mean that they are able to carry on in their smug assertion that we are all swivel eyed, racist, sheeplike, ill educated, conspiracy theory obsessed loons.

No I'm not showing my tinfoil hat.

Earlier in the thread I've linked to research that shows immigration doesn't cause extra pressure on the health services, that the shortage of education places was flagged years ago but nothing has been done etc. The cost of housing isn't down to EU immigration because EU immigration makes up about 4 % of the population.

I'm calling out someone who makes sweeping statements like the one above, which are blatantly racist, its fine to do so, you are now trying to counter it and say, "all of the remain crowd" when I haven't at all during this debate, but I will do so when these views are made.
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You can raise your concerns, but when presented with independently researched evidence that says that the situation might be different to the one that you are "concerned" about and you don't change your views, or take any of this on board, and make statements like the one above its fine to call you out.

Then you make a point about "what nationality are people" .. words fail me to be honest, genuinely did you do that ironically?

It's the ageing UK population who cause most of the strain on the NHS. Education needs more money invested in it. Housing costs are spiralling because of factors including right to buy and the government's refusal to build enough new and affordable ones.

I don't think everyone with negative views on immigration is a stupid racist. I do think they're often ill-informed and a bit quick to find an easy scapegoat.

I'd like to know the nationality of those voting in or out as I believe everyone votes with their own interests at heart.
I'm sure not many turkeys would vote for christmas.

noto, which nationalities do you think would vote for which option?

If it helps, to kick us off, I'm white British and I want to stay.

I'm British, as is everyone in my family.

The turkey's seem to be voting for Christmas on the out campaign mind you.

Oh and Mango, if the tin foil hat fits...

OnlyLovers so you'd spend more money, you'd put more into the NHS, education and housing? I'd love to do that too, but where would this money come from? Our pay packets? Or shall we just borrow even more and add to the deficit? How about we leave the EU, we'd have a spare £7.5 Billion every year?

We wouldn't have spare money if we left the EU. We'd lose money in trade. And STILL have to take in immigrants.

Hey Lurked and Onlylovers I'ts brilliant the way you two nearly always post identical views at nearly the same time. I'ts almost as if by coincidence you are reinforcing each others views.

exactly, ceretris paribus isn't going to happen.

ceteris paribus, pardon my latin.

I'm white English and I want us to leave and no I'm not one of the much maligned ageing population I'm 35 and hopefully will get old myself. The ageing population can vote and have done a lot for this Country. My grandad lived his first 20 years without the NHS. He remembers when it began and fought in WW11. Where would we be if it wasn't for his generation so don't whinge about them. We all grow old!
Also I dont want TTIP

I don't buy the "we'd lose money" argument. Capitalism always wins over politics.

I'm pro-immigration, but I want control over who moves here. A proper points system, so we could select from the best and brightest from around the world, not just endlessly provide for anyone and everyone from the ever-expanding EU.