How to help our children/loved ones in the future when we’re old and hopefully lovely and manageable

[I8toys]

What advice or actions would you put in place (now that you have the knowledge of dealing with all aspects of elderly care) to assist your loved ones if you lose all rationality or capacity in the future

I’ll start

• Wills
• POA for health and finance
• Funeral plans and wishes
• Decluttering/ downsizing
• Spreadsheet of accounts- savings etc. this helped us so much when Fil lost capacity but we still found all sorts of accounts/ bonds

That could be a plan for the future. I have not even turned 40 yet though. I know that life might have twists and turns in it before I am really old (and of course that I might not even make old age).

I don't have any siblings, sadly. I do have some same age friends.

Tech is only going one way and the older you are, before you try to embrace it, the harder it will be- if you try to embrace it whilst you've got your faculties, you'll be able to use it for longer and can use it for your benefit rather than because you have to!

That’s not the panacea it seems. Tech will continue to evolve at an accelerating rate and whatever appears in your 70s or 80s will take just as much getting used to, no matter how many previous technologies you’ve mastered. I was programming mainframe computers in the 1970s, I had a home computer from the 80s, was on the internet in the 90s. I still can’t put together smart devices with confidence or sort them out when they stop talking to each other, and although I do online banking I don’t do phone banking.

@countrygirl99 I agree- my FIL has just downsized at 85- will still have £150k or so in bank plus a £425k property - in theory he could give us some- he's not in need of care at moment- but in practice I would rather he had the money at hand for any at home care requirements that may be needed, gardener , cleaner/ironer etc and instant cash if he needed to go into residential/nursing care quickly without having to panic about selling the bungalow instantly and being able to pay his bills-

The alternative is to complete ignore modern advances and stick with the 'this is how we have always done it' thought process like my parents.
E.g. My father refused to pay anything by direct debit. As he became increasingly frail, he kept forgetting to pay his bills, got behind on things, left all sorts of bills for my mum to sort, having never had to do it ever.
This isn't hi-tech stuff, just staying a little bit with the times.
He wouldn't do online banking, it was cheques only for paying bills. We have just about for my mum set up to do it. And that is only because she has been recently housebound and unable to get to a bank. Still won't use direct debit because her dead husband wouldn't have approved.

Having had to sort out my dad's house and stuff when he passed 4 years ago, I'd say:

Declutter! You don't need 50 years worth of every bloody bank statement/reciept/letter that you've ever received, "just in case"! Especially not mingled in with all the relevant, up to date stuff. Or several semi broken kitchen appliances that you might get around to fixing, or an entire spare bedroom and garage/carport full of duplicate tools/nuts/bolts/screws/electrical components/light fittings etc etc.

Keep all important documents together, along with a list of active bank accounts and pensions. Do not hide the house deeds under the tray in the cutlery drawer, and please let your offspring know which solicitor has a copy of your will, not just a vague "one in town".

Write down passwords and keep it up to date.

Write a list of people that will need to be informed, as opposed to a 50 year old address book with out of date passwords.

Have a plan for what you would like for your funeral in regards to burial/cremation and any particular music.

As you can tell, it was hell sorting my dad's stuff 🤣

I'm in my 40's and making a big effort to get my ducks in a row so my son doesn't have too much to do when my time comes. I'm also trying to future proof my house, as I'm already physically disabled, so I've had things like a downstairs loo fitted, the kitchen remodelled with things at the right height/somewhere to sit to do food prep etc. I've swapped my bath for a walk in shower with a built in seat and I'm planning to get a stair lift fitted, or at least make sure I ring fence enough money to do this at a later date, so as I can stay independent as long as possible.

I've bought a fireproof document box where the house deeds/car stuff/passports etc are kept, plus a ring binder with account numbers and everything filed in.

I'm also going to take out a prepaid funeral plan, once I've shifted some money round to pay for it.

I'm just trying to streamline as much as possible. Hopefully, I'll be here for a long time yet, but I've lost a couple of friends my age recently and that has really made me realise I need to be prepared a bit better.

@JBJ great work. I too am trying to hold in my mind the horrors of the house clearance that took months last year to keep me going on decluttering and making sensible improvements in my own home. I am assuming my DC might be busy with their own lives and so I should never think of them as a resource.

While my mum was still living in her house, she did try to clear things out, but it was just impossible. She had very little stamina in her last few years, so she couldn't keep at it for long. And things were meaningful for her, so she wouldn't go through say a shelf of books thinking, "Yes, no, yes, no, no," it would be more like, "Oh I remember that one, perhaps I'll reread it, I got it in Norfolk in 1964..." There was also lots of, "I'd better keep that thing, just in case," despite not having used it for 25 years.

It was much easier for me to be ruthless than it was for her.

I’m quite sentimental so finding an old plate from the set we used to have when I was a child triggered huge memories. However, I don’t need odd plates cluttering up my kitchen cupboards either. So I follow the only tip of use I picked up from declutter influencers - take some good quality pictures of the item then you can let it go, but still have the trigger for the memory. I’m also taking random photos of mums house, like the tiles in the bathroom. I had IBS as a teenager and spent a LOT of time staring at that wall .

however I’m positively ruthless compared to DB, which will make clearing mums house, er, interesting.

Or several semi broken kitchen appliances that you might get around to fixing, or an entire spare bedroom and garage/carport full of duplicate tools/nuts/bolts/screws/electrical components/light fittings etc etc. It’s heartbreaking to say “I’m too old to do these repair jobs that I once would have taken in my stride. I will never now do that renovation job I’d set my heart on”. You’re destroying dreams and sense of self in one go.

I suppose I’m saying it’s understandable not to want to throw out your belongings, but if you don’t, accept that DC will be ruthless (probably call in clearance company) and make it easy for DC to identify things of monetary or sentimental value.

Don’t leave a boxroom piled high with 1950s electrical equipment and your grandfather’s university textbooks, and demand that it should all be found a home, with family or with a museum. (Does anyone want a 1930s dolls pram?)

Totally get that, but in my example my dad had been a collector tor of broken items that needed fixing his entire life! Mum used to keep on top of his hoarding tendencies, but it got out of hand after she died unfortunately.

I get annoyed when parents say I don't want to go in a care home - send me to dignitas.

OK so what have you put in place to action your wishes? Realistically what have you done so that this happens. In effect they have done nothing. Its still left for family members to decide on a course of action. Its a cop out in effect.

I hope I can say to my loved ones - I trust your judgement to do the best in all circumstances surrounding my future care. If its a care home so be it. Hopefully I will downsize when the children have left home and I have no need of extra bedrooms.

I'm not 60 yet but I'm already slowly filling out a book called Last Orders:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Last-Orders-Executors-Letter-Wishes/dp/191027545X/ref=sr_1_1?crid=22R38X0I7ZS9M&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.BBxzrgI-hrwkgmgfGY3fZSFA9FTb9v20wN_i1jGFcZZDto_lJk0Ifjf7W5l8Y12vg_FlZ5oKmh-kAwfX8865kojZ7cGCNSy39vQ5O0epE0dPFR8RLu4_j4wWrTOLtx3cS4hdfRSTLBmJwrA2ICcU_dNiexJdELlCQHryFc97dd5QpA9YZpssCRnHKzPfF6U7TwVGXpgP5pTG-k8z-7TzKwUnvGQ9dZpS_8KOsAUmdGs.WO8ML7uahDM5Q-P_Y2DwLmQccxxKCRQ1lGFWD8uDrYI&dib_tag=se&keywords=book+last+orders&nsdOptOutParam=true&qid=1737628139&sprefix=book+last+order%2Caps%2C87&sr=8-1

It asks about EVERYTHING that needs to be dealt with after you die - bank accounts, pensions, social media passwords (and what should be done with the account), location of will, funeral arrangements, even what the pets are fed and who they should go to. I recommended it to a friend who promptly got copies for her parents; a friend in his 70 took one look at mine and got his own.

DH and I declutter every few years. We still have loads of stuff, some of which I anticipate passing onto the DC once they are properly established in their own houses - and if they don't want it in about ten years time and we have no need for it, it goes. Within the next 20-ish years (less if we start folding up significantly before then) we'll make sure that we're in a fairly modern, relatively low-maintenance house with a downstairs loo and good access to the shops, the GP, a bus stop and (very important for being active and socially connected!) the pub.

We'll also make sure that it is very clear who gets what in the way of valuables or items of sentimental value. I don't want my DDs fighting over who gets my jewellery when the time comes...

@MereDintofPandiculation You sound like DH.
He started programming mainframe in industry when he graduated in the early 70s, was at the forfront of technology. He had every early home computer in the 80s and dial up internet from the early 90s.
He's 75 now and while he's still comfortoble with computers and online banking he struggles with a smartphone unless it's very basic stuff.

Exactly! Dignitas is not a solution at all. Firstly, how do they think they will travel there if they are old and frail. And what an incredible burden, and emotionally difficult situation to put your loved ones in. What plans have they made to get their body back to the UK once they have been euthanised? Presumably none what-so-ever.

It's a complete cop out, shows a lack of maturity and a high level of selfishness.

@Strawberriesandpears totally agree- it's done for the sympathy vote.- and let's leave it all up to others to sort and arrange and have the guilt. They know full well in most cases that family or friends cannot do that without their full input or money to do so .

Now if someone terminally ill said 'I'm arranging to do this and here's the arrangements' - I would of course understand - but that's not usually what they do

Thank you for saying this. Totally agree with you. Facing this with elderly people with a long history of threatening dramatic consequences to normal life events.

No I don’t want to accompany you to kill yourself overseas. No you don’t understand how it works. I don’t just ship you off to Switzerland ‘when you’ve become a burden’. So, no plans made. Active obstruction to looking at what will actually happen in reality, like going into a local care home. No willingness to move to a more manageable place to live independently.

@CurrentHun well I've posted on plenty of the elderly forum posts about my lovely 85 year old FIL who is downsizing and moving 180 miles to a bungalow 20 minutes away from us- All good - ? Not really suddenly seems to be obstructive and belligerent. - pretty sure he might start with saying stupid things like this too

Apparently buying and selling is complicated and messy and then having to set up all direct debits again and have internet installed as it has none and the various other things that you have to do when you move and the fact that lots of things can't be arranged to suit your 'precise time' etc,or have to be done online' ( we would help but he's turned secretive) - turns out that he now thinks he was pushed and would have been easier to stay put- despite the fact he will probably have to give up driving, have very few facilities on doorstep and we can't keep doing 5 hour drives to visit or arrange stuff etc - we didn't push, we suggested and he was happy for 6 months doing clear outs and tip runs and seemed that he had reached a point he wanted genuinely to move - his partner died 5 years ago .

He has suddenly become really bolshy too when having to speak to any service provider, to the point of rudeness and saying to them he was 'misled ' etc - basically lots of paranoia that everyone is out to 'fiddle' him

I have a really horrible feeling that this might be the start of dementia - am hoping it's just the stress of moving - because he's always been a stubborn old mule but lovely - and it's all a bit out of character at the moment - my H keeps phoning me just to say his dad is totally pissing him off and is giving him IBS.

Good times!!

That sounds very very hard. I wish you all the best with it. Being the in law is an interesting and tricky position to be in. Sometimes you can take a calmer perspective than your partner and sometimes you wonder why you have to have to do deal with this level of stress from someone who is not even your parents.
The irrational grumpiness or anger could be the start of dementia. Even if it is, it may not express itself like this for long. or it may not be. I would recommend taking a special effort to recommend a good local GP to your FIL and make an appointment for him soon and ask them to do a baseline memory test and a hearing test and just see how he’s doing physically. There may be an element of openness to doing new things after a big move that closes again. Good luck.

@CurrentHun thank you - I'm hoping when he re registers at new GO ( and it's a very good very modern practice 2 minutes away from him) that they may do this as a matter of course. It's small things like my H was getting texts from the new internet provider about installation and FIL was adamant that at no point had he given DHs mobile number , so DH went into the shop today and bold as brass there it was on the system .

He's been quite exceptional for his age so far and indeed I've posted as much on lots of threads - I'm hoping that is just the temporary stress of two many things changing 'all at once'

I think being an in-law is very different to your own family. When the decision needed to be made for my MIL to go into a care home she would listen to me but not DH even if he was making exactly the same points. He and I visited many care homes in her city but I was always given the credit. I think it's because she still saw him as her little boy while she had only known me as an adult. It's a really difficult time

@grannycake I think that is very true too.

Oh no @Crikeyalmighty , your FIL has been the poster boy for getting things right and has a little fan club here!. I hope he settles down soon - as you say perhaps it’s the stress of moving which we so know is bad enough when you are young and fit. Change can precipitate cognitive decline so fingers crossed the GP can set your mind at ease.

@funnelfan I know- I'm crossing my fingers that it's just the stress of it all . Unfortunately he's seeing how crappy a lot of 'customer service ' is first hand and alot of different service providers all at once!! Whereas for many years he hasn't had to change anything - he's always been one in recent years for maintaining routine and of course at the moment he's been in holiday lodges for 2 months and his routine is shot !!

Dignitas will sort out cremation and all the paperwork along with returning your ashes to the UK. You do however need medical stuff to say you're terminally ill or suffering unbearably which many elderly may struggle to convince a UK doctor to provide.

Being frail, can't be arsed anymore or don't want to be a burden won't suffice. Unless something changed you also wouldn't be eligible with a dementia diagnosis. Basically it's not a get out of jail/life free card.

For context, I did quite a bit of research after my mother announced she was going there a year back (she hasn't). I downloaded all the forms read through them.

I told her if she wished to go it was her choice and I'd not be helping her there as I don't fancy ending up in jail.

It's pretty awful to hear your DM say that stuff and cruel too (my DM announced it at Christmas FFS) but with my family nothing will ever surprise me ☹️