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Elderly parents

Cockroach cafe 🪳 Spring 2022 🪳

988 replies

MereDintofPandiculation · 09/03/2022 08:54

Welcome! Those of you who have been before will notice the Bad Daughters’ Room is now called the Kumquat Room, and there are a couple of fine kumquats in the Conservatory.

Check also the Stationery cupboard with, among other things, the 🪳emoticon ready to cut and paste.

Anyway, come in when you want to share good news, or to rant, or to ask a small question that doesn't warrant its own thread. Or just to hang out with others who understand what you're going through.

For newbies: why cockroach? Previous long term resident of "Elderly Parents" Yolo's DM attended a 'small animal event' in a nursing home, and was presented with a "small animal with a hard back" the name of which species she couldn't remember. Her ever helpful DB suggested cockroach, and it has become a toast on here. So 🪳 mes amis/amies, and may you all live to fight another day.

OP posts:
Lightuptheroom · 29/05/2022 10:43

Thank you. She is probably very frightened, her sisters have all had dementia, one died last year, the other is very badly affected. She has friends who she will state that their children have put them in a home, when in reality the friend is unable to look after themselves. She is currently presenting to professionals and friends as completely fine, to family she is very very angry but seems to have no knowledge of the aggression and angry outbursts once they have occurred. We've logged each incident, there have now been 2 safeguarding alerts in the last month, so clearly something is happening. We can't call it dementia because we just don't know if that's what it is. She does have other health and mobility issues, the GP was supposed to refer her back to the rhematoid consultant, but it didn't happen. None of us have her permission to discuss anything about her with anyone, so they ring her about everything, including dad's ongoing health problems, which then causes more angry outbursts because she says she doesn't want anything to do with it. Then back we go around in a big circle. Thanks for your help and advice, so much appreciated

picklemewalnuts · 29/05/2022 12:34

That sounds so hard, @Lightuptheroom .

Have you tried talking to professionals even without her permission?

When dad was ill, everyone (hospice, social worker, consultant) spoke to us (children) despite our not having been formally given permission. I think they were able to judge for themselves the extent to which others needed to be involved. Admittedly, that was with a terminal diagnosis for him. I think they could see that mum was as much use as a chocolate teapot.

I've also spoken to the GP about mum without her consent, to explain what I was concerned about. Obviously the GP couldn't answer.
There's such a risk then though, that the GP will accidentally drop me in it by saying something when they next see her.

countrygirl99 · 29/05/2022 13:33

My mum refused to see the doctor for ages as she was convinced there was nothing wrong with her memory ( she forgot all the problems and arguments so they never happened). In the end she consented to shut DB up. Of course now she forgets she saw the doctor/consultant/had a brain scan/diagnosis so it doesn't help day to day but it's there on the system.

notaflyingmonkey · 30/05/2022 08:13

Just checking in.

Saw DM yesterday and she was tearful, angry and confused the whole time. The staff say she is cheerful and chatty with them, so I seem to get a different version. It is a 2 hour drive for me, so a visit takes the best part of my day, and is a grim way to spend my Sunday.

Sale of house is due to be going through next week. I'm trying to give away as much stuff as i can, have hired a van for next weekend to clear the remaining items. In the meantime, I have a pile of my things including my grandfathers WW1 army papers on my dining room table that I need to work out what on earth I should do with them (1935 jubilee matches, etc) was thinking when I have time I should photograph them and offer them to the IWM.

picklemewalnuts · 30/05/2022 08:47

notaflyingmonkey · 30/05/2022 08:13

Just checking in.

Saw DM yesterday and she was tearful, angry and confused the whole time. The staff say she is cheerful and chatty with them, so I seem to get a different version. It is a 2 hour drive for me, so a visit takes the best part of my day, and is a grim way to spend my Sunday.

Sale of house is due to be going through next week. I'm trying to give away as much stuff as i can, have hired a van for next weekend to clear the remaining items. In the meantime, I have a pile of my things including my grandfathers WW1 army papers on my dining room table that I need to work out what on earth I should do with them (1935 jubilee matches, etc) was thinking when I have time I should photograph them and offer them to the IWM.

Can you ask the staff if she benefits from your visits? We stopped visiting GMil, as she was distressed by us. If you are in a position to visit every day and keep up the familiarity that's great. When you can't, I'm not sure what the best thing is to do. Sad

notaflyingmonkey · 30/05/2022 09:39

She isn't like this when DB visits, and she has no memory of me visiting, so I do wonder whether the guilt/obligation that fuel my visits is actually worth it for her.

I'm exhausted by my guilt-induced insomnia, so had chocolate for breakfast at 5.30am.

thesandwich · 30/05/2022 10:47

@notaflyingmonkey so sorry to hear about your visits. You’ve got plenty on, not least thinking about your own health. Please speak to home about not visiting for a while, and your db- is he closer geographically?
and consider gp/ counsellor for support for you.
🌺🌺

IthinkIsawahairbrushbackthere · 30/05/2022 11:01

My mum was very similar when she moved into the home in October. It is only now that she has started to settle, She is quite calm when we visit her now although she still asks if we have come to bring her home. For me it only an afternoon (and that is because it makes it easier for my cousin if I go home with her for an hour before she takes me home) but I find it so stressful, mostly the unknown of how she is going to be rather than the stress of the actual visit.

When it comes to counselling I'm not sure if it is the same all over the UK but I have had a free course of counselling through Cruse and Bereaved by Dementia Project. It was so helpful. I can really recommend it.

Knotaknitter · 30/05/2022 11:26

I found visiting mum to be very stressful because of the conversational landmines. Don't talk about the house, gardening, anything "home". I found it easier once we'd reached the stage where she was wanting to be back to the lounge within ten minutes.

I have never been close to MIL so if she's living in the 1960s when I visit it doesn't bother me at all. I'm not distressed by the reality of what I've lost, the change from the woman I used to know. We've been low contact for decades and if I knew she had any other visitors then I wouldn't go.

countrygirl99 · 30/05/2022 11:51

Aaargh! I left my favourite lightweight, fleece hoody at mum's on Saturday. You know the type that is ideal when you are sitting in the garden and it's not quite warm enough but unzipped is perfect. As soon as I realised I phoned mum to check and she offered to post it and I told her don't, I'll be up next weekend. DB has just messaged that nephew just spotted mum coming out of the post office. Now there is a random number generator that intervenes between mum's address book and writing the address down. We coped when we had a regular postie in the village who realised when stuff was mis-addressed but she retired a couple of years ago. I'm never going to see my favourite fleece again am I. I'll phone her later and if she has posted it my best chance is a post on the village Facebook page.

countrygirl99 · 30/05/2022 12:11

She posted it😥

Marylou62 · 30/05/2022 13:22

When my Mum was diagnosed with dementia and/or alzheimers in the summer last year, I knew you were all here but I so couldn't come and talk to you as ....? I think I was so frightened of what was about to happen to my Lovely, kind, intelligent wonderful Mother..(I had been a nurse on a Geriatric ward during my training) We'd never ever had a cross word (teenage rebellion as side!) until all this started and in April when coincidently my Parents and I all tested positive for covid (I'm 250 miles away) , I came up when my DF was hospitalized.(He's very poorly with Prostate cancer and heart and kidney failure)..

That 10 days nearly broke me and gave me a new understanding of what my DF dealt with for nearly 2 years.. My DM insisting on going to bed at 6pm then up again at 11pm for the rest of the night..Trying to get out of the house,(I locked the doors and although she was angry, she'd been going to the neighbours for months in the early hours and I couldn't expose them to covid.) She was packing bags, taking photos out of frames?, hanging clothes up, taking them down and packing them again etcetc..It was exhausting..she wouldn't eat and the weight has droppped of her very quickly.

Then DF came home and it was chaos. She was very agitated and wouldn't leave him alone wanting him to take her away from the horrible woman who'd been hitting her (me). He went to cuddle me as he could see how upset I was and she flew at us screaming that was I happy now taking her husband away from her..She thought I was my DFs girlfriend. I was devastated.

I left the next day (as had to work) after sorting out sleeping tablets for her (didn't work at all except to give her night terrors on top of everything else). Since then she got so bad and tried to take her own life..She pleaded with anyone she saw (family only..She didn't say it to the Dr or MH nurse). My DF found her taking tablets and she was admitted for emergency respite. He rang me heartbroken and at the end of his tether..I called SS at 10am and by the time they'd rang back at 5pm I'd rang around 27 homes..Luckily I found one that would take her that night..She was just starting to settle after two weeks when she fell and fractured her femur..

I'm here at Dads again for a few days (giving him some TLC and feeding him up, cleaning the house and changing beds etc..He's a difficult man but I know he's so ill and devastated about Mum).The hospital say she's recovering how they'd hope her to. Visits have either been horrendous (screaming in pain) or like yesterday when she was joking with the staff and actually introduced me as her daughter.

Dr's rang today to get him to make an appointment to discuss his recent blood test..but he's said he doesn't want to know.

I'm sorry for the long post (I'm sure you all could write a book about your experiences and apologise for all the mistakes) but I feel able to let it all out here..thanks for reading..

thesandwich · 30/05/2022 16:08

@countrygirl99 sorry about the fleece! Hope there are some inspired posties about.
@Marylou62 welcome- you really have some s@#£ to deal with. Rant away- we can’t solve anything, but can listen and offer virtual gin.

countrygirl99 · 30/05/2022 16:32

@thesandwich sadly we haven't had a regular postie for a couple of years so they can't be expected to notice. Just got to keep my fingers crossed. Good job she was spotted coming out of the PO or I wouldn't have phoned until this evening by which time she would probably have forgotten she had been.

Knotaknitter · 30/05/2022 16:39

@Marylou62 You really do have so much on your plate. It's a grim situation but not one of your making, hopefully your father has realised that he can't go on like this and that she should not be discharged back home. It's been said so many times here that it takes a crisis for anything to change. Your father has coped with this for two years but that was his choice, he did have other options but he chose to keep on doing what he was doing. This is probably the time where someone else needs to look after mum so dad can look after himself.

All we want is for our loved ones to be happy and safe and the current situation isn't working for either of them. Something has to change.

Marylou62 · 30/05/2022 18:09

Knot..you are so right.. it took a crisis for him to agree. I visited her today and had a little cry on the way over what I have lost but not lost..She is actually ready to be discharged (up walking well with a zimmer! day 4..)but can't go back to the other home so the ward manager said he's working with SS for a new home..She won't be coming home..She was asleep but smiled at me and we just held hands.
Dad has been very poorly today and has another UTI . and grumpy with it! I'm meeting my oldest friend locally for a chat and probably a cry..x

TheIoWfairy · 30/05/2022 21:04

@Marylou62 I hope things get a bit better for you soon. These times are very tough.
@countrygirl99 let's hope she wrote something intelligible on the parcel and your fleece gets home. Otherwise you'll be treating yourself - but a replacement for a handy item of clothing is never quite as good as the original Sad
My DM is behaving relatively well this week but I'm currently being tormented by my teenager. Not only am I a bad daughter but I'm also the worst mother - ever!!

Words · 31/05/2022 06:20

Hello Everyone

Occasional visitor here, and back for coffee and cake ( lemon drizzle or coffee and walnut please.)

Mother, 91, frail, Alzheimer's, DNR in place, in care home. Has been ailing for a while, having episodes with varying degrees of severity of being hard to rouse and not responding to staff. Possibly mini strokes. When this happens, it ends up in her being transferred to hospital to be checked out, with endless ( up to 36 hrs once) waits in a and e.

Her local hospital is diabolically bad at communicating anything, so this results in days of highly stressful radio silence. It's almost impossible to get through either via the switchboard or directly to the ward.

Latest episode was on Sunday. It didn't sound too bad, her obs were ok, but... abundance of caution ( otherwise known as back covering I suspect) kicked in and off she went.

Call from care home some hours later. Sorrowful tones. She was being discharged on palliative care only as nothing radically wrong that they could tell. Docs thought she was approaching the end.

Although sad, this news was rather a relief. I feel very strongly it cannot be in her best interests to be continually ping ponged around in this way when nothing concrete will be gained. She needs to be in the comfort and familiarity of the care home, surely, and what will be, will be.

Imagine my surprise therefore to receive further call some hours later from an on call doctor in another far distant hospital ' as you know your mother has been transferred here for scans and assessments...' Shock. She had no knowledge of previous discharge decision. I explained my feelings and she promised that the consultant would call me in the morning to discuss, and that nothing would be done until then.

Next morning dawns. I have a call from a research clinician at the hospital seeking my permission for my mother to take part that day in a study about the benefit of regular teeth cleaning in elderly stroke patients to prevent aspiration pneumonia. Angry

I refuse permission, explain the position and ask if she has any clue what is going on. She says she has been told mother is due for urgent discharge that day. Excellent news. I ask them to tell me when she is on her way back to the home, and I call the home to expect her back. They tell me I will be able to visit without an appointment, and will put all the arrangements in place re equipment etc.

Hours pass.

I call the home. The message about her potential discharge has not been passed on, so they are not expecting her. They ring the ward and by some miracle get through.

They are told that Mother isn't due for discharge 'just yet', and far from being on end of life care, is alert and having physio to prepare her for discharge.

Today I will speak to the care home manager and try to get an urgent call with the GP practice to try to stop these constant admissions if possible.

The communication failures at the hospital trust will not be resolved anytime soon, so I need to tackle the local decision makers instead.

It's all completely disgraceful.

Marylou62 · 31/05/2022 08:25

notaflyingmonkey · 06/04/2022 19:30

Just checking in to pass the gin around (with a generous hand).

And to say that I noticed someone upthread saying about sitting in car parks crying. I thought that was just something I did - I seem to be so task driven, that if I don't get out of the car immediately on turning the engine off - that's it, I will sit and weep.

I'm tearing up at this... I was in the car a lot yesterday.. So lots of tears... But plenty of tissues and onwards and upwards.. Apart from when I was overwhelmed and on entering the ward. (with no visit booked because no *body answered the **phone when I called in between all the other calls taken and received trying to sort out my DDad eye appointment, diabetic clinic, urology, foot lady, meal delivery etcetc.. All the while my dad is being difficult and resentful about me 'taking over' about calls from my brother about mum.. I was just about to hand over the phone! ). So I was stopped at the reception and asked if I had an appointment... I just dissolved.. Couldn't help it, couldn't stop it... They let me in... Luckily mum was asleep so I just held her hand and let the tears flow...

MereDintofPandiculation · 31/05/2022 08:39

@Words, I really have no idea what to say! Is she in a care home r a nursing home? What does her care plan say? My dad’s says he wants to be treated , hospital if necessary. The fact that it says that must mean there’s an option not to be carted off to hospital on the slightest whim.

OP posts:
Knotaknitter · 31/05/2022 09:32

Mum was in a nursing home and on her last hospital visit one of the doctors said that they would tell the home that she was not to be whizzed off to hospital for the slightest bump because the journey was not good for her, she was to be treated "at home" with visits from the GP if required. That was what we had been doing for the last two years while she was in her own home so I was fine with that. He said that it was quite normal, they would want a scan for a serious fall of course but it was care at home where possible. (Then she died so I didn't get to see how it worked)

I have also crashed hospital visiting after two and a half hours of calling where no-one picked up the phone. I was sitting outside the locked ward door calling the ward number, in tears, when someone passing through let me in. I wanted to see if she'd died during the night, not unreasonable given her condition. The communication with family during her last stay was terrible, I had four days where I couldn't find out which ward she was on, what she'd gone in for and I couldn't visit. The only access was by phone and no-one picked it up. I was so wrung out that I never made a complaint, I couldn't face the "how did we do" forms after she'd died.

Words · 31/05/2022 09:34

Thanks Dint, It is unbelievable isn't it. It's a care home. I will ask about the care plan.

Marylou62 · 31/05/2022 10:04

Knot.. I feel your pain... It's inhumane to keep us in the dark so much.. Happened when dad was in for Covid.. With mum asking how he was, why couldn't she see him, where was he over and over again on a loop. Emotionally exhausting... Sending Gin!

Marylou62 · 31/05/2022 10:07

Knot.. I feel your pain... It's inhumane to keep us in the dark so much.. Happened when dad was in for Covid.. With mum asking how he was, why couldn't she see him, where was he over and over again on a loop. Emotionally exhausting... Sending Gin!

countrygirl99 · 31/05/2022 11:25

Totally get it about hospital communication, it was a nightmare when dad was in and when you do get to speak to someone what you get told conflicts with what you were told last time in a significant way.
On a more positive note DH spent the day trudging round care homes yesterday and his dad has asked him to put the wheels in motion for MIL without them visiting. But that must mean he must he really struggling not to put up a fight.