What steps do we 50 somethings need to take to avoid the situation many of us find ourselves with our elderly relatives?

[Mxflamingnoravera]

Many of on here vow that we will never put our children through what we are going through with our oldies. I'm one of them, but, unsure what I need to do (apart from set up LPA and a will). What are your suggestions for steps we can take?

It might be good to set up a checklist for different stages of our adult lives, depending on how old our children are. My son is 27 and has agreed to do LPA.

*geriatrician

We have our house as tenants in common rather than joint tenants and wills have a clause saying the other gets to keep the house until death. which is supposed to mean they can only take into account half the value of the house for care costs purposes. - Ah, I see. When person A goes into care, house is still safe because person B is still living in it. If person B then dies, whole house normally becomes available to fund A's care. But in this case B's share would have passed to children.

Problem might arise if B then needs care - since B is still receiving the benefit of the full house, LA may regard it as deprivation of assets.

Discuss funeral plans. Both my adult dcs and dh know I am to have a direct cremation and where I'd like my ashes.

choc so who will pay the possible many thousands for your parents' care then, just so you get your inheritance. Me??!

Don't start that argument. It's grossly unfair that Child A receives an inheritance of several hundred thousand pounds because their parent died of a heart attack or cancer, whereas Child B receives nothing because their parent died of dementia. Or to put it another way - who pays for your hip replacement or cancer treatment so your child gets their inheritance? - me.

Put your house in your children's names so it won't be sold to pay for your care. - this is a loophole I suspect the Government will very quickly close.

Think about what you want to do when you can’t cope.
Unfortunately my MIL initially refused care and absolutely refused a care home. She expected her children to do everything.
We had to get SS involved to force carers onto her after her causing lots of trouble. She really should be in a care home, she’d have a much better life, and that also will be forced upon her soon.
The whole experience has been excruciating and a battle. It’s going to be the lasting memory when she’s gone unfortunately.
So think about how you will get food when you can’t go yourself, who will maintain your garden and home, if you’ll have carers or not, how do you feel about a care home, and let your family know.
Absolutely get rid of your crap, move somewhere suitable for old age, have a low maintenance garden.

@16purplecolour16

Put your house in your children's names so it won't be sold to pay for your care. - this is a loophole I suspect the Government will very quickly close.

I asked about this and was told it could make them getting a mortgage harder as they already own part of a house. Anyone know if it’s true ?

Vote to pay more taxes so that it's easier and normalised for elderly people to get help and support that they need to live independently and then have desirable care homes for when they don't

Good points above. This won’t be for everyone but I plan to speak with my doctor about end of life wishes. I haven’t done it yet but I am planning to have on my medical records that I would like to choose assisted suicide at an early stage of dementia. I don’t want to live through advanced dementia if I am unlucky enough to get it (but lucky enough to live that long :-)) but it is very difficult to make this decision once diagnosed with dementia since by then obviously you can be classed as not if sound mind.

My parents downsized from a 5 bed to a small 3 bed in their early 60s and did a huge clear out. They are both still healthy and working but they say the relief of knowing they got rid of 30 years of junk is huge.

Lots of good ideas here.

Look at your life and work out how you would be self-sufficient if you couldn't drive, couldn't manage stairs and couldn't walk more than 10 min for bus.

Doesn't need to be a retirement bungalow, just something with downstairs toilet/shower.

If you have the money, get yourself in the habit of fortnightly having a cleaner, gardener and taking taxis now so its not so you're used to people helping if you need carers.

If you do have pension savings don't be tight with them, e.g. FIL had always run new cars, but won't pay for a taxi from hospital after eye surgery 3 miles away, family member has to take time off full-time job to get him.

My granny moved into her completely refurbished "forever home" in her 40s and did very little to it for the next fifty years by which time it was crumbling around her.
My parents are determined that they will stay in their longtime marital home but have at least brought it up to date - new roof, new boiler / heating system, up to date electrics, new windows, downstairs shower room etc - and they have enough room that they could live downstairs and have a carer living upstairs. There's a heck of a lot of clutter / and knickknacks though; it will be a HUGE job to sort it all out when the time comes.
All their paperwork is in good order too.

@ChocOrange1

Put your house in your children's names so it won't be sold to pay for your care.

Have a house which is disabled friendly, or can easily be made so. E.g. downstairs bathroom, spare downstairs reception room which could be a bedroom.

Admit when you're starting to get older and don't go doing stupid things like climbing ladders at the age of 88

Unless you then pay them a market rent, on which they pay tax, this is illegal.

@MereDintofPandiculation

choc so who will pay the possible many thousands for your parents' care then, just so you get your inheritance. Me??! Don't start that argument. It's grossly unfair that Child A receives an inheritance of several hundred thousand pounds because their parent died of a heart attack or cancer, whereas Child B receives nothing because their parent died of dementia. Or to put it another way - who pays for your hip replacement or cancer treatment so your child gets their inheritance? - me.

But life isn’t fair.. There simply isn’t a bottomless pit of money and the state shouldn’t be funding everyone’s care while people inherit assets. My MIL has just died. She was in a care home for six years. It’s eaten up 90% of her estate. While Is have loved a few hundred thousand in inheritance at this point (having lost a long term job and good salary to Covid), I see that that money funded a safe, happy, caring care home for her, and that was priceless. My friend’s mum ended up in a state funded care home and it was nowhere nesr as nice as where my mil was. I know which I’d choose...

But life's not fair. And if you're moving into care you're simply swapping one home to another. You don't need the former. You shouldn't suddenly have all your electricity, heating, lighting, food, council tax, decor, cleaning etc etc paid for by others indefinitely.
Very many people in care haven't got dementia. They're had strokes, heart attacks, Parkinson's, osteoporosis. They all pay, if they can afford.

Don't understimate how much room you need in old age. If there are two of you there could be two walking frames for outside and two for inside. Disability aids take up room and little bungalows get crowded very quickly.

Have a wet room that can accomodste both yourself and a carer plus walking frame or wheelchair. If you stay in a house make sure it has straight stairs or a stairlift becomes even more expensive and they are very expensive!

Get utilities and bank accounts on line, they could be remotely managed by your family. Discuss power of atterny early on and make sure your family know which solicitor has the will.

Funeral bill will appear before the will is sorted, my mum put money into an account that we joinly accessed which meant i could sort the funeral and flat clearance etc without using my own money. Funerals are expensive. Decide what you want for a funeral and where your ashes are going or your family could be distressed wondering if they are doing the right thing.

My mum left a list and contact numbers of everyone she wanted to be told of her death plus hymns for the funeral and even which vicar she preferred! Made it so much less stressful

Don't leave any surprises in the will, my DF left everything to a wife we didn't know he had who was my age, but that could be a whole other thread....

My parents downsized in their early 70s into accommodation that is a private flat with shared social space, wardens etc. My father has his two LPAs set up for finance and care, a living will which explains his desire not to be resuscitated and all his paperwork in order. My sister is a signatory on his bank account and for his shares. It's all sorted.

I'm in my late 50s and have downsized to a large 3 bed flat ground floor and basement flat.

I will happily have my flat sold for my care costs if needed or do equity release for care at home - there would be space for a live in carer. I have a good pension lined up.

My PIL had mirror wills. They both had state pension and a private pension so weren’t badly off.
When FIL died MIL inherited everything obviously.
Now this money, and eventually the house, is being eaten into for MIL’s carers and eventual care home. If she didn’t have this money it would have been funded.
I think it would have been better if they’d left their half of the house to the kids, with provision for the other person to live in it as long as needed, and the money given to the kids.
When MIL finally goes there will be very little left.
And I’m not trying to profit here, before anyone has a go, its what I’ll do for our kids.

Bungalow legs? Given that in most countries stairs don't feature in people's homes, how on earth do they manage to avoid it?

Anyway, apart from de-cluttering (which I'm trying hard to do), we pretty much all have to face the fact that whatever we think now, when it comes to that time, we are very likely to think differently.

My mum spent her whole healthy life saying that we must never look after her in her old age (she'd had an awul time when my gran moved in with us and had dementia). Then when she had her stroke, she gave my DB and I hell because we couldn't take her in (she was paralysed down one side and needed hoists, specialist bed, a wet room, 24 hour care and a wheelchair friendly house, none of which we could accommodate) and she had to go to an extra care facility.

Oh and until a few years ago, she also spent her life saying that no way did she want keepng alive and would rather top herself than grow old and frail with a poor quality of life. But every time this 88 year old woman goes into hospital, at 6.5 stone and with bones like a bird, when they ask about a DNR, she demands that she is kept alive at all costs. Despite them describing exactly what will happen to her ribs if they try.

@saraclara yes that's the thing isn't it, what you tell your DCs you want in old age bears little relation to how that plays out when you're frail and elderly.
I still remember my DPs railing about my GPs and telling me they didn't want to be a burden when they were older, and here we are and they are in their 80s. They are fiercely independent but things are coming up - should DF still be driving, they could really do with a cleaner but refuse to have anyone in the house. Covid-19 has made it all worse as DM won't let them go anywhere so I'm their only source of light relief
My USA cousins have moved to a retirement village early 60s - maybe that's the way to go, but the way they've been talking about the clubs and activities they have joined they already seem to be mid 70s at least in their outlook so prematurely aged by the experience.

Get rid of anything your adult children might find distressing to stumble across after your death.

I found my dad’s very misogynistic, violent 1970s pornography which upset me hugely. And my brother found my mum’s letters from the early 80s, which included plenty of complaints about him as a kid. He was very upset by that.

Our parents knew they were dying and should have taken care of this.

To be honest I think it's hard to avoid many of the issues around making your child a 'sandwich' generation adult - looking after kids and older parents.

My mum went into sheltered housing at 80 when she was still very active. She went out on jet skis that year on holiday!

Fast forward to 84 years old and she was diagnosed with Alzheimer's following a fall.

She did a LPA for both health and finances - which was a godsend so that's a must. She also expressed where she wanted to live on the form and she sat down with us and went through all aspects of her funeral. Her view was she wanted to make sure we knew what she wanted before she forgot what she wanted! Again a godsend when she died last year as I had everything from readings to hymns to music and flowers on the PC so just printed it all out and handed it to the funeral director. Covid put paid to some of her wishes but she got the majority of it.

But the appointments (she was diabetic and had a heart attack at 82) took a lot of organising. I covered 27 separate ones one year...

Organising carers in her home became an issue later in her life until it became time for a care home. The care home actually took so much pressure off us. She was a council tenant so we didn't have the choice of when/if she went into a home until she really couldn't cope any more. Had we had our way she'd have gone into a home a year or so earlier and it may have prevented the 6 falls she had until she was deemed unable to cope happening.

Some of those things you can't future proof unfortunately but the expression of wishes and getting LPAs in place are a must.

We plan to downsize eventually and, at that point, we'll help DS out with some cash. That way, if we have to spend our house, he'll at least have had something from it. But we're bringing him up not to expect to have the house. Both our mums had Alzheimer's so we're not banking on not having to pay for care. Our house is ours to do what we want with so care home or round the world trip, DS may not get a huge inheritance. We're not going to live a measly retirement if there's money in the property just to hand it on. We'll help where we can but that's the best we can do. Otherwise the care will fall to him and, having been through that, I wouldn't wish it on him. I'd rather have seen mum in a home (which was lovely) earlier and feeling more secure if she'd have been in the position of being able to pay.

@AgnesWaterhouse1566

Watching with interest. I'm in my 50s with parents in their late 70s and I suspect I'll downsize before they do.

I'm the same but my parents have insisted they'll stay in their big 4 bedroom detached house until the first one of them dies, then the other will move

I have already started making a conscious effort to get rid of stuff (and not to buy too much more).

@Mxflamingnoravera

This is all great advice. I've done the will, I'll do the LPA. And I will start a plan to start getting rid of shite and downsize.

Keep it coming

We downsized in preparation for my retiring and it was the best thing we could do. At times I’m a little bit sad that we don’t have such a big house - having the family around for Sunday lunch is a squeeze now - but overall it was the best decision. We used some of our equity to completely renovate our house so we know nothing will need doing to it for as long as we live here (hopefully). Both our children are ok financially, we helped them with money to buy their houses and they won’t expect a big pay out when we pop our clogs! We have wills, not yet done LPAs but that’s on the cards. All our financial stuff is in 1 place and the passwords to all our accounts are in a safe place that my DDs know about - as does dh! They know we don’t want either of them to have to look after us if it came to it. We’ve had lots of experience of care homes via my parents and MIL, so know what to expect should we need to live there.

Take care of your health now. Have provision for your care in later life. Accept that your needs will change and make plans before it's too late.

My grandparents drove my mum close to breakdown. Both suffered from dementia. Lived in a rural area with no services or transport and stubbornly refused to move in with family or to a more manageable sized home, closer to relatives and amenities. After age 65, my nan did nothing apart from watch TV for the last 20 odd years of her life, didnt want to go anywhere/do anything (think she suffered from anxiety). This left her with various health conditions due to inactivity, ironically leaving her completely housebound in the end. She also started losing her hearing but refused to use a hearing aid, which left her unable to properly socialise. We're convinced her lack of activity and socialising resulted in her cognitive decline.

My parents have certainly learned from this that they need to have a plan. I'm mid 30s and already concerned about my future - I can only afford to rent a houseshare and I'm unlikely to have kids now. God knows how I'll afford care home fees or sheltered housing. Costs a fortune.