The new shiny 2019 thread for anyone caring for elderly parents

[thesandwich]

Continuing the long running series of threads. Pace yourself, it's a marathon not a sprint!
This is a safe place to offload- don't be embarrassed about how you feel. No judgement here
There are lovely people here with practical experience of some of the issues which crop up who'll share their hard won knowledge!
And a few laughs and the odd cockroach or gin....

hello lovelies

this might be a really silly question so sorry if it sounds daft...

mum and I were talking about finance Lasting Power of Attorney and I was thinking about the practicalities. E.g. I found out when dad was ill, that if he was going to be permanently admitted to the local care home, they wanted to see proof of funds. Is that the kind of thing we'd need PofA for and if I had it, would it be relatively short to get the bank to do ...whatever it is they need to do?

for daily stuff, we are thinking to get me added to her current account as a third party. This is really so that if something happens, e.g. mum is in hospital and one of her mammoth heating bills arrive, I can pay it from her account rather than from mine.

That seems a lot less hassle.

however, with LPA, would I actually need it or would I show them her bank statements, so to speak?

hope this makes sense.

also, she wasn't originally planning on doing a health LPA but someone suggested she did because otherwise a hospital could override DNR wishes - but I've heard of that happening anyway? My experience with dad was that a) the hospital will go for saving lives at all costs, presume to avoid being sued b) they have a very strange definition of someone being in a fit state to comment on their own medical treatment

so is it worth it?

Thanks.

Hi Grace I have LPA for my mum's finances, it's much easier than getting you added to her bank account as it means you can also talk to other services like the council, etc if needs be as it's not just about the bank account. Basically I set up all her DDs etc to be paid online, and have a card which I use to buy her shopping etc with (it has POA on it). She also has a card, which she uses if one of us takes her out.

You have to apply for POA online. www.gov.uk/power-of-attorney. It's a bit of a faff but more repetitive than anything. Once you have it you can take it to the bank and apply for access to her account.

Sorry to hear wind about your weekend.🍷
grace we have poa for finance and health for dm. Well worth doing and filing until you need it.
yolo sending you buckets of Teflon for you challenges this week.

monkey and sandwich thank you

sorry, I phrased that very badly! Mum only wants the PofA to kick in when completely necessary - there's no way she would want her bank account details going online (I posted in probate about how I had to do the paperwork for dad's stuff as if I was working in some kind of Victorian age office, handwritten lists etc).

So I'm wondering how quickly it could kick in if something happened e.g. she has some sort of awful event and has to go in a home - I would need her money to pay that kind of bill if you see what I mean.

we are still going to do third party access because it would mean I could pay her bills over the phone etc and get her shopping and pay for it from her bank account and we can start that soon, whereas LPA will take time to sort.

sorry, I probably should have separated the two queries.

Bert adult social services arranged delivery of incontinence pads for my Mum. Don’t know if this is available everywhere but might be worth asking.

Grace You can still do a PoA using paper forms, which can be downloaded from here:
www.gov.uk/government/publications/make-a-lasting-power-of-attorney
There isn't anything about bank details on it. Just details of who will be the attorney and when they can act, and any substitute attorneys should the main attorney(s) become incapable.

Dad has done his so that I can act even while he has capacity, which means I can set up a new account to pay bills and get shopping. I feed it from a savings account of his that I manage, but you could get your Mum to pay a standing order into the account you operate under PoA, while she maintains the management of all her other money affairs.

Health and Welfare PoA can only come into effect once she loses capacity, but again has to be set up when she has capacity.

If you want a PoA to kick in quickly, easiest way is to get it set up and registered with Office of Public Guardian straight away. Set it up so you can use it without her losing capacity, but promise her that you won't use it. Then if she goes into a home, it's a matter of simply showing the PoA to the financial institution you're dealing with.

If you write into it that it can be used only when she's lost capacity, you may be in a situation where she's in a home, but still has capacity, so you won't be able to do anything, but it's really difficult for her to manage the finances.

I would say both are worth doing, because if you decide they need to be done once capacity is lost, then you're too late. Whereas just because you've set them up doesn't mean to say you have to use them.

Gin, Teflon and anything else to everyone for the week ahead.
DF is now only one of 6 residents left at care home, waiting for delivery of new bed before we can move to the ( hopefully) lovely new home. New home asked me to provide him with his own wheelchair so he can be moved around more during the day. Have made all arrangements for this and the move and then have to approach horrid DB who has no involvement at all to get money back as he has POA for finances. Grrrrrrrr

yolo you really are exemplifying the "sandwich generation". Except in your case it's 3-way, a sort of multidimensional sandwich.

Good luck to DS2

Dint thank you

that's a good point re capacity on the money one, I will mention that to her.

whatever when is the move, I hope it goes well.

Also if the POA only kicks in when she loses capacity, you may find you are continually asked for proof of loss of capacity, every time you need to use it.

Hello everyone one from a lurker who follows and really appreciates these threads and the advice and support from you lovelies.

I'm moved to post by reading Grace's posts, especially all the additional work you get landed with given your DM's insistence on not using online banking. It is really not fair, I do most of my mothers banking from an app on my phone which makes us so much easier to get anything done.

One point made me think of you is 'how would your mother know you had set up online? For example my mother knows that I do most of her banking 'on the computer' but insists on sending cheques to the ever increasing numbers of great grandchildren.

I tried explaining that it was effort for her to write the cheque, then we have to put each in an envelope , add a stamp find a post box and leave a few days. They can go astray so wonder whether lack of thanks means it didn't arrive etc. And at the other end it needs to be paid in or posted etc

Now I let her write the cheques (it's more and more of an effort for her) then I do the transfer on line and destroy the cheques.

Everyone happy and she is give only person putting in lots of effort

Re POA I would throughly recommend. Find a friend or neighbour prepared to sign that your mother is still sound of mind , fill in the forms with neighbour as certificate provider, you as attorney and your mother as donor.

I have it for my mother and DH, he has it for me. Great help when he is away travelling.

Send it off and when it is returned life will be s lot easier for you.

https://www.gov.uk/power-of-attorney

So far only the bank and the agency who provide companions have actually wanted to see a copy.

You are doing plenty for your mother. POA and online banking are things she can give you in return.

Hope it goes well for you.

Bert ah, yes, thanks for that.

Finally hello and thanks for posting. I wouldn't put mum's bank stuff online without telling her.

it's interesting that you say I'm doing a lot for her because I still don't feel like I'm doing enough. I didn't anticipate how hard it would be to spend time with someone after so many years living alone and also I never actually thought I'd end up having to look after someone in any way.

oh well.

Afternoon all. Good news: DD2 and two others hauled up with her have been told there is NO case to answer - huge relief but what a load of old bollocks! Anyway we went for drinks on the pier, then to the aquarium, back to the hotel, out for a delicious dinner then breakfast this morning and a bit of an anxious wait. Her friends are delightful (as is she, obvs). And as yet no one has cancelled DH treatment for tomorrow! Nice to be home with ddog.

Sounds like a red letter day yolo.

still don't feel like I'm doing enough.

You are in fact doing lots, and having to follow more cumbersome processes laid down by the person wanting the help

Not fair in anyone's book. I feel for you.

still dont feel like I'm doing enough was that windgate that said that? (sorry if not)

One thing I learnt is that 'not enough' is purely relative, that one person's doing something everyday is probably seen as less valid than another person swooping in and being wonderful and then fucking off again. And, as we always say: you can't pour from an empty jug. So self-protection is a good thing, not a bad thing.

yolo brilliant news. What a relief.
grace you are doing so much...... and please give yourself time to grieve too. Your mum is stronger than you think.

Yolofish you are spot on, 'enough' is purely relative and as my DSis has just reminded me whatever we do it's never enough for Mum.

Wise words re enough.

Grace what does "enough" look like to you. Do you have a concrete vision or is it just some vague feeling? If it's vague then how will you achieve it or know where to aim?

re enough - yes, I have a concrete vision.

it's "move in with her and do as much as possible" bar the stuff that can be paid for (when the time comes - at the moment she doesn't need physical care).

I really thought I'd do that, but her unhappiness is so relentless. It's not that she grumbles, not at all. It's visible in every fibre of her being.

she thinks it's wrong for me to consider moving in - she said it would be ruining a young life and that's not fair. Bless her, she is right.

well, a middle aged life....

earlier in the thread I was talking about a woman I know who has really been pleased with the results of moving in with her olds and helping care for her father. I suppose one key difference is that that both parents are there.

Oh Grace, "doing enough" is just a bucket with a hole in it : you never fill it.

Are you doing what you can realistically sustain? Because any more than that, is way too much.

Care coordinator today with mum and dad, plus the lovely physio who was so sweet last week.

They are going to increase her psych meds (the memory one and the SSRI) as she is taking them without side effects. Happy days. Less happily, she looked at me quizzically and told I I wasn't me so who was I.

Oh cross post!

I finally have concrete proof that I'm insane and have been for a long time. I was looking through a drawer and found Chanel body lotion. Did i buy this? If so, when? I don't like Chanel but now will have to use it.

I will be a Chanel smelling Weeble, a perfect sphere.

grace unhappy people are like a black hole or vortex which can consume all. Was she a happy person previously?
I think you are wise.
bert sorry about your dm. It so hard.