Whitehall “braced for private schools collapse” 3

[ICouldBeVioletSky]

Starting a third thread to discuss impact of VAT on private school fees, as the topic looks likely to run (and run). Though probably best to finish off the second thread before posting here, thx.

What do you mean "the invisible lines people hold with social accountability and how to spend the tax purse" @soaringkitty ?

No they haven't. Highgate is solid, our former school has never been in financial difficulties ditto our current school.

Our former school has already reduced scholarships and bursaries, our current school is making redundancies.

All this 100% created by Labour, not by "having been in financial difficulties for some time".

If we let it go, then the damage will quietly slip under the radar.

I want Labour held accountable.

Also, whilst I agree that Labour won't reverse it, I think the next government might if it's clear that it's damaging. A tax is much easier to reverse than Brexit. The French reversed their wealth tax when an Economic thinktank did the analysis and showed how much it was costing the state - both in lost taxes and reduced GDP growth.

Just as a point of information, TheRoyal School has been on the skids for some time.

This.

It's absolutely shocking what they do, but the support they get on MN for attacking disabled people is even more shocking 😱

The generations coming through are not discerning, they're just poor and cannot afford much. Then they start dressing the reality up.

Can you put your fury into more positive, productive actions?

Like what, a revolution? 😁

Ha, there is a large element to it of this too!

Lots of my friends struggle with the notion of "not being as successful as their parents". And they've worked really hard and continue to do so, but life is so expensive.

Then the massive drop in people having children. A myraid of reasons, but financial is a big part of it.

Scream!

That's a specious argument.

Schools - particularly smaller prep schools - have always operated on tight margins. Having to absorb the triple whammy of VAT, business rates and employer's NI will inevitably push some of them into unviability.
Claiming otherwise is like arguing that putting two bricks in someone pockets and your foot on their head to hold them under the water was not what caused them to drown because they weren't that strong a swimmer to start with.
Or, to take another example that most of us should be familiar with, it's like claiming that excess mortality in nursing homes from 2020-2022 was not due to COVID because most of the people in them were old or not in the best health anyway.

100% agree, it's been tough for younger generations for quite some time now. At least since 2008, I think, if not longer. And the problems are not being resolved, unfortunately.

This! Thank you. It's really not good. The inheritocracy is MAJORRRR!

Have any of your friends moved abroad?

Mine are leaving in their droves!

Pretty sure it's not possible to open new grammar schools.

It is if they're private.

The idea I'm trying to get across is probably too long for a Mumsnet comment. Essentially the threads have me mulling over how it is in my home country (state/tax funded education is dire, so most go private), vs the imagined utopia of high quality state/tax funded education like Scandinavia. And then comparing all these systems to the UK, with the class and income questions thrown into the mix alongside a government that is actively trying to undermine any non state education provision.

What I truly can't get my head around though, is coming across articles like this, where there clearly isn't enough tax take to cover what the government wants to achieve (definitely not enough coming from VAT), yet they choose this particular time to try to close/drive schools out of business. Why, when they can least afford to? Even ideology surely has limits when it butts up against practicality.

schoolsweek.co.uk/school-budgets-much-worse-than-we-thought-say-leaders/

This version of Labour puts ideology above everything else. Even when the net result is a cost to the state.

Something else I'm REALLY interested in: At what point does a working class kid from a grim background cross that invisible line from being a hero to despised elite? Kid gets a 100% bursary for Eton or Wycombe Abbey, swings into a career that earns them millions by their 40s. Are they now to be hated for being rich bastards or lauded for winning at life on merit?

Or for the non private school version: bright child grows up in poverty with domestic abuse, gets a place at a Grammar, first ever in family to go to university, makes it rich, catapults well into the upper middle class and is able to afford a vastly different life for his children. (That was my father in law's story). Do Labour supporters love or hate a person like that?

Labour are relying on middle class parents in state schools to plug gaps with tutoring or teaching from home/using expensive apps etc to then mask over the underlying issues in some state schools.

@SoaringKitty
Interesting points.
I think some people would consider going to a famous public school from a disadvantaged background as being a traitor for going over to the ‘other side.’ Maybe it’s okay provided they vote Labour.
I think the same applies for your second point,

“Have any of your friends moved abroad?
Mine are leaving in their droves!”

@easternenergizer - this is my main concern with the younger generation! Did you really not meet any rich international connections at your private school? Whilst it won’t work here, a lot of very rich international pupils come here from those countries for private schooling. The migration and brain drain is real. Other countries still value our talent and our privately educated as well, it seems.

The absolute irony is that VAT has kick started many parents applying for EHCPs, who previously didn't.

The below anecdote exemplifies this:
"Cheshire East Council have drafted an EHCP naming my Daughter’s private school and agreeing to pay her fees. They are also putting in yet more funding to deal with 1-1 tuition, therapy, dealing with her sporadic mutism and transport costs.
The irony, we would never have known to apply for an EHCP unless the VAT had been implemented and I spoke to her then CAMHS Practitioner about my worries re affording to keep her at her school.
All at a cost to the Government"

Slow hand clap Labour

Yes, I did. they returned to Switzerland, USA etc etc.

Im trying to move to the USA as have connections there. For my career Dubai is useless and it's not for me. And I like the idea of sunny California even though NY is great it's also ridiculously expensive.

@easternenergizer - thanks. That is what I thought - it is about international connections these days and having options and having an education recognised internationally. Nobody in the US looks down on eg Eton or another top public school. They respect it, it carries more weight there than here. With that, comes a brain drains. And Labour are just cementing that further with their ideological attack on private schools.

Just among my immediate family:
1 sibling moved to Australia - permanent
1 sibling moved to Dubai - non-permanent for now
1 sibling moved to USA - permanent

DD isn't keen to stay in the UK long-term.

DH and I are open to moving overseas.