Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Education

Join the discussion on our Education forum.

private school fees - has anyone negotiated a discount/worked out better ways to manage payments?

217 replies

redscissors3 · 30/12/2023 17:06

Hi all,

Namechanged and would very much appreciate any advice. Due to a change in circumstances ,paying school fees for our three kids is becoming a huge struggle for us. We have to pay for a family member's care and it's been a very bad few years for DH's industry.

We can just about manage to keep them there for the moment - they are at key stages in their education and it would be heartbreaking to pull them out right now. The younger two can go to great local state options for sixth form if they have to - but meanwhile, we are draining our savings and the future looks quite worrying...

Our kids have been at the school for many, many years and do brilliantly there. They love it and we love it. The bursar has been very helpful and has expressed they are keen to keep the kids at the school. Quite rightly, given we DO have some savings and own our house, we don't qualify for a bursary. They don't do sibling discounts. My understanding is that there is a fairly hefty cash reserve there to help existing pupils whose circumstances change drastically - ie in the case of parental death - but again, this doesn't apply to us. The bursar is very sympathetic and wants to look at ways to help, but I am slightly at a loss as to what might be possible or what I might suggest!

Has anyone been in this situation? Has anyone been offered help of any kind, or worked anything out with the school?

Before anyone jumps on me, yes I know we are in an extremely fortunate position already, and yes I know there are brilliant state options and this whole system isn't fair. But it's the road we have gone down and my children are having a wonderful school life where they are, so I am trying desperately to find ways to preserve that. Thanks so much for any thoughts or advice.

OP posts:
rochethenut · 01/01/2024 21:01

Mirabai · 01/01/2024 20:53

@Notapremiummember One of my ex schools is currently raising funds for a new 100% award - a “permanent endowed place”.

you don’t know what a permanently endowed scholarship actually means do you?

it is how an endowment is to be structured ie the school can only use the interest from the endowment for scholarships

rochethenut · 01/01/2024 21:02

Mirabai · 01/01/2024 21:00

@rochethenut All she said was you could call it that in a wider definition - but they are distinct nonetheless.

no one said, hinted or even alluded to the not being the case.

this has to be the oddest exchange i’ve ever had on mumsnet!

Notapremiummember · 01/01/2024 21:03

@Mirabai good for them. Unlikely not to be means tested though.

the OP has already said her DC are at academic London day schools. They are the least likely to offer any non-means/tested awards as they don’t award academic scholarships. They may dip into the hardship funds for a y11/y13 student but not where it is known that there are savings,

Essentially the OP (who I note has has not returned or responded to any suggestions about managing her income/outgoings) has asked if there is a way she can ask the school to pay for her DC to continue in the school instead of her using her savings which she would like to use for her DC’s university years. Short answer = no there isn’t.

rochethenut · 01/01/2024 21:03

i’m wondering now if you’re actually joking around? 🤞!

Mirabai · 01/01/2024 21:08

rochethenut · 01/01/2024 20:58

they would still have to apply for a bursary. it would be a…. bursary.

private schools are charities and subject to the charities commission.

The bursary process is the required due diligence process and is enquired about annually to ensure that still appropriate to be in force

Correct and echo of what I have already said. And that is not required for a scholarship which is awarded on performance.

Private schools are answerable to the charities commission and their own governing bodies.

rochethenut · 01/01/2024 21:10

Mirabai · 01/01/2024 20:53

@Notapremiummember One of my ex schools is currently raising funds for a new 100% award - a “permanent endowed place”.

this should help you understand what a permanent endowment is (clue - not what you think it is!)

https://www.case.org/resources/endowment-faqs-independent-schools

Endowment FAQs for Independent Schools

Endowments are permanent funds from charitable gifts that offer schools the enduring stability to empower generations of students and shape our world's future. 

https://www.case.org/resources/endowment-faqs-independent-schools

rochethenut · 01/01/2024 21:11

Mirabai · 01/01/2024 21:08

Correct and echo of what I have already said. And that is not required for a scholarship which is awarded on performance.

Private schools are answerable to the charities commission and their own governing bodies.

again who on earth has said, hinted or alluded to an academic scholarship being anything but awarded on performance? 😐

Mirabai · 01/01/2024 21:12

rochethenut · 01/01/2024 21:01

you don’t know what a permanently endowed scholarship actually means do you?

it is how an endowment is to be structured ie the school can only use the interest from the endowment for scholarships

Wtaf. I’m sorry I just can’t take you seriously.

rochethenut · 01/01/2024 21:12

the governing bodies work within the confines of the CC

most certainly not the other way around

rochethenut · 01/01/2024 21:14

Mirabai · 01/01/2024 21:12

Wtaf. I’m sorry I just can’t take you seriously.

oh i feel for you

you’re a fighter, i’ll give you that!

but your niece and your experience a few decades ago really is not relevant

and i think you lack the self awareness? intelligence? to grasp that

i give up. and i’d urge other posters to do the same. i tried!

Mirabai · 01/01/2024 21:15

rochethenut · 01/01/2024 21:10

this should help you understand what a permanent endowment is (clue - not what you think it is!)

https://www.case.org/resources/endowment-faqs-independent-schools

No idea why you’re being such a twat, I know exactly what it is as I contributed to it.

Mirabai · 01/01/2024 21:17

rochethenut · 01/01/2024 21:12

the governing bodies work within the confines of the CC

most certainly not the other way around

Some governing bodies are charitable institutions of themselves.

breathequietly · 01/01/2024 21:18

I may be missing something here... you have the money to pay, but you don't want to pay because then you'll have spent all your money?

I wonder if this line of thinking will work with my mortgage providerHmm

BasiliskStare · 01/01/2024 21:18

@redscissors3 If the bursar cannot give you any help if you have asked other than what he has offered then I think you need to see if longer / more granular payments for school fees will help at all. I think if you are starting from where you are then you will have to use your savings or perhaps restructure your mortgage. I can see how losing your savings is worrying but this is a path you went down and sometimes "events dear boy " stuff happens. I do not mean to be unsympathetic but a cold hard look at what you have committed to and what resources you have sounds like the main choice. I would leave worrying about savings for university until you have got over this first hurdle.

But I wish you well

Mirabai · 01/01/2024 21:25

Notapremiummember · 01/01/2024 21:03

@Mirabai good for them. Unlikely not to be means tested though.

the OP has already said her DC are at academic London day schools. They are the least likely to offer any non-means/tested awards as they don’t award academic scholarships. They may dip into the hardship funds for a y11/y13 student but not where it is known that there are savings,

Essentially the OP (who I note has has not returned or responded to any suggestions about managing her income/outgoings) has asked if there is a way she can ask the school to pay for her DC to continue in the school instead of her using her savings which she would like to use for her DC’s university years. Short answer = no there isn’t.

Absolutely it’s means tested, the point is to allow a resident of the borough to be able to go who could not otherwise.

We don’t know what level of savings OP has, it’s possible they may do something for the 6th former, but as I said above not for the younger two and I’m sure they will be fine in a state school.

redscissors3 · 01/01/2024 21:29

Sorry everyone, OP here. Was away from laptop and phone for much of the day! Thanks to everyone who offered helpful suggestions - there is much to think about.

My kids are twins in year 8 and a daughter in the sixth form, so quite crucial stages.

Sorry for igniting a whole debate about what bursaries are etc! Ultimately I was just trying to ascertain if anyone had been in a similar position and what support (if any) the school was able to offer.

We can’t be the first family in this position. Appreciate that private schools are businesses, but equally - businesses are usually keen to retain valuable ‘clients’ and are supportive towards long-term customers!

Thanks again for the advice.

OP posts:
Biscuitsneeded · 01/01/2024 21:38

I think the twins in Y8 need to move. The fact that there are 2 of them will make transition to another school easier for them, as long as you can find a school with space for 2 new starters. Y8 is a year that isn't too crucial and is a good time to make a move if you're going to. Have you ever tried state schools? I wonder if you are considering everything and anything to avoid sending them there because you think you would be letting them down by sending them there. It's not true. There may be fewer whizzy facilities but you get good teaching, nice kids and also very smart kids in both sectors. They might even prefer it!

Hairyfairy01 · 01/01/2024 21:42

Sounds like you need to more your year 8 twins and try your best to keep the sixth former in due for the potential disruption for them. Maybe a year 8 move after Easter? Year 8 is probably one of the better years to move to be honest.

XelaM · 01/01/2024 21:45

Why is Year 8 a crucial a stage? It’s the best year to move schools.

Notapremiummember · 01/01/2024 22:04

XelaM · 01/01/2024 21:45

Why is Year 8 a crucial a stage? It’s the best year to move schools.

Absolutely agree. Some school GCSE courses start in y9. There would be zero point struggling to pay for y9 to move in y10. In addition, grammar schools places come up for y9.

WombatChocolate · 01/01/2024 22:19

Agree Yr8 is a good time to move. Kids choose options for GCSE either in yr8 ready to start a 3 year GCSE programme in yr 9, or choose in yr9 ready to start a 2 year GCSE programme in yr10.

Yr 8 is a good time to move. After this, it will get more tricky.

But perhaps you will choose not to move them, as you have some savings and equity and so could make some adjustments and choose to pay. Like everyone for whom it is tight, you’ll have to weigh it all up - the likely above inflation fee increases, your likely income trajectory etc etc. When things are tight,some people decide to get out - and actually for your twins, the next term or two is a straightforward time - and others decide to struggle on.

You will kick yourself if you keep going wIth paying and then decide in 2 years that you need to move the twins, because the easy window of opportunity in yr8 will have passed and it will all be more complicated once GCSEs have started.

You can’t rely on helping hand-outs for them at this stage. Schools might give a short term bursary to a family with a child mid-way through an exam phase, who is really struggling to get them to the end of that exam phase. However, you have savings, plus your younger ones haven’t started GCSEs. They will not be high up the priority list to help out - it could be years or help that are needed. So you need to decide if you can afford it or not.

These days lots of people opt in and out of private education for different phases. Many don’t pay for the whole of schooling but choose Prep or Senior to GCSE or Sixth Form. There is always movement of pupils and schools know this.

Of course they say the ‘right’ things about valuing you and wanting to keep you. But those yr8 places need filling to the end of GCSE by fee paying students. People come and go and often some others would like to come for GCSE and your places could probably be filled in a popular school. It’s the reality.

Expect help to only be given if you have no savings to draw upon and can’t release any equity. That’s what many families will already be doing to fund their fees. The school cannot allow you to be different because when you started out, you envisaged keeping a bigger pot of savings and building more equity, but circumstances have changed.

And remember the full term of notice you have to give. If schools go back later this week or at the start of next week, if you haven’t given notice by then, you’ll be looking at not being able to stop paying until the summer term is over.

It is usually possible to give provisional notice. This can also open up further channels of discussion as it becomes clear you are serious about going. But again, whilst you just might get a little help for a sixth former part way through, if you have no other means to pay, you couldn’t expect anything for those in yr8. They will say all the right things and sympathise, but if you don’t get a concrete figure offered, they will be waving you goodbye and forgetting you as soon as you’re gone. I know that isn’t what you want to hear and you’d likeo think they value you and want to help you in your changed circumstances. Well, yes, they will on a short term basis when there is no other means to pay. But every year families find their circumstances a bit reduced. Many could scrape together the fees by sacrificing their savings and equity, but decide to cut their losses and move their kids so their entire lifestyle and possible future (think oension contributions) isn’t ruined - and in these cases the school will let them go, as it’s not their responsibility to subsidise fees so parents can choose to boost or maintain their savings.

SheilaFentiman · 01/01/2024 22:33

@WombatChocolate speaks a lot of sense.

OP, you may be a long term customer but you probably aren’t the only one going to the bursar to see what can be done, given COL raises etc, and other families may not have the savings you do.

rochethenut · 02/01/2024 06:23

it’s possible they may do something for the 6th former,

the bursar has been clear. As has the OP. From the outset!. They are not going to provide:

Financial support via a bursary; and

No academic scholarship is available as the school do not offer these.

So… i wonder what this “something” could be.

SausageCasseroles · 02/01/2024 06:51

You say you won't be the first in your position....

But surely most private school families are sacrificing something to be there. Many families really do pull it all together to be able to go.

I'm not sure "we don't want to use our savings/equity " is really as bad a position as many using private ed are in.

I think, like many many people, you need to look at priorities and work out what the path forwards is. There have been many suggestions here.

Private school isn't an "entitlement" just because you have quite well off. Many people with a good income use state schools and many people from educated m/c families that are in state amd would.like to use private can't afford to amd equally many are happy with state!)

aramox1 · 02/01/2024 06:55

State schools are great but the chances of finding two y9 places in the most popular/academic ones in London are tiny, even assuming OP is in catchment. Outer London super-selective grammars very unlikely to have places, and they require exams. Spend the savings, and reconsider the paying for care.