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Original poster

Don't seem to like private schooling

269 replies

Chickpea17 · 26/04/2023 10:55

So off the back of a thread I just seen why do so many people on MN seem to dislike private schooling so much? I'm not judging one way or another just curious.
I have a almost 5 year old and we can't afford private schooling so haven't given it much thought.

OP posts:
CurlewKate · 26/04/2023 18:49

@gogohmm You misunderstand me. If you live in a grammar school area, theoretically all children have an equal chance of getting in, regardless of social class or background. This is, of course, not true. But many people believe it to be true.

twistyizzy · 26/04/2023 18:51

Chocolatefreak · 26/04/2023 18:32

Bursaries are not the answer- they don't create equal chances for people who are just not wealthy enough to get into private school.

The fact that you think that this is enough to create equality of opportunity shows how little you understand about the poverty in the UK. Which is exactly the point of everyone arguing for state schools over private on this thread - private schools generate a bunch of entitled elite who think they've made it though their own talent and that poor people are poor because they just don't work hard enough.

🤣🤣 but neither myself or my DH went to private school, in fact DD is the first person in our family to go. My DH is comprehensive educated and I'm grammar educated. So our entitled elitist attitides have come as a result of being state educated 🤣🤣

twistyizzy · 26/04/2023 18:56

@Chocolatefreak and there you go perpetuating the cliche of people you know nothing about. If anyone posted comments such as these about working class people they would be rightly condemned.
You assume you know all about me because of 1 element of my life. I don't give a toss what you think of me but incidentally I vote Greens, believe in higher taxation + redistribution of wealth but also the fact that I can choose to spend my money on whatever I chose and I choose to spend them on my DDs education.

CurlewKate · 26/04/2023 18:57

At least the trope that most parents who use private schools are well above average financially is accurate. Th "parents buying into grammar areas"...not so much.

twistyizzy · 26/04/2023 18:59

@CurlewKate above average yes, rich no!

SoTedious · 26/04/2023 19:00

Honestly say if your child(ren) were offered a full scholarship or some other means of paying (that couldn't be used for anything else) you would turn it down.

🙋‍♀️
We had the choice and chose state education. It's not that unusual.

Buebananas · 26/04/2023 19:14

We had the choice and chose state education.

You must be very lucky and have great state schools nearby - unfortunately many are not so fortunate.

Sherbs12 · 26/04/2023 19:14

All of the arrogant assumptions that ‘jealousy’ is the main reason why people are against private schools is a massive part of the problem - a total lack of understanding that it’s the values of privilege, entitlement and inequality that they represent which is the issue for so many. We both went to state schools now in special measure in areas of social deprivation, but managed to do well academically and now have successful, professional careers, mainly due to the good fortune of supportive parents and wonderful teachers. We are now in a position where we could afford to send our own children to private school, but we’ve chosen diverse inner city state schools instead (in which they are thriving) because we value a comprehensive education system and want our children to have social awareness outside of wealth. We have many friends and colleagues who received a private education, so we’re aware of all the connections, confidence and advantages that it can give, so it’s not that we are bitter or naive, they’re just not the things that we place value on.

lililililililili · 26/04/2023 19:19

As much as I respect bursary places and those who need them, I have seen quite a few frauds winning places. Those running businesses (e.g. tutors I've seen most) saying they accept cash only or cash in using their family bank accounts to avoid getting their revenues recorded and avoid tax as well. Sending two children on full bursary to change to a luxury make 4x4. Telling others private education is the answer, that if you send your child to that local grammar they'll be pushed to the edge with the lack of pastoral care.
As a salaried worker working hard to afford DC's private education sometimes I just don't trust it anymore. I hope more people who really needs it benefit from that system.

Educating children privately, yes it's been good. Not worth the full amount perhaps but with my children I'm prepared to pay for anything for something marginally better. May not sound reasonable, but that's my choice.

SoTedious · 26/04/2023 19:22

You must be very lucky and have great state schools nearby - unfortunately many are not so fortunate.

The local school is not what I would call great (no Oxbridge places this year, for example), but it's not horrifically bad. Good enough to make state more attractive than private for us.

Funnily enough DD left to do A levels at a sixth form college that is even 'worse' than her pretty average school.

usernother · 26/04/2023 19:24

Because they hate people choosing how to spend their money

Heatherbell1978 · 26/04/2023 19:29

No different to someone moving to a great catchment area to go to the league topping state school. DH and I are crunching the figures at the moment and figured we'd be cheaper going private when the costs of moving are factored in. Wasn't in our original plan for the DC but if we want to prioritise our kids education over trips to Disneyworld etc, why shouldn't we?

twistyizzy · 26/04/2023 19:30

Sherbs12 · 26/04/2023 19:14

All of the arrogant assumptions that ‘jealousy’ is the main reason why people are against private schools is a massive part of the problem - a total lack of understanding that it’s the values of privilege, entitlement and inequality that they represent which is the issue for so many. We both went to state schools now in special measure in areas of social deprivation, but managed to do well academically and now have successful, professional careers, mainly due to the good fortune of supportive parents and wonderful teachers. We are now in a position where we could afford to send our own children to private school, but we’ve chosen diverse inner city state schools instead (in which they are thriving) because we value a comprehensive education system and want our children to have social awareness outside of wealth. We have many friends and colleagues who received a private education, so we’re aware of all the connections, confidence and advantages that it can give, so it’s not that we are bitter or naive, they’re just not the things that we place value on.

Same as the arrogant assumptions about why we send our DC to private school then? There is zero ethnic diversity in our rural area at the state schools. Our DD has an excellent awareness of social inequality but not from her state primary, only from her private secondary who go to great lengths to highlight their privilege and teach social responsibility.

SoTedious · 26/04/2023 19:33

Are there no poor people where you live @twistyizzy?

(If your DD can only learn about inequality in her lessons at private school instead of mixing in it at state school.)

thing47 · 26/04/2023 19:34

CurlewKate · 26/04/2023 18:49

@gogohmm You misunderstand me. If you live in a grammar school area, theoretically all children have an equal chance of getting in, regardless of social class or background. This is, of course, not true. But many people believe it to be true.

Further to @CurlewKate's excellent posts on this topic, it's worth adding that anyone anywhere in the country is allowed to sit an 11+ exam for a grammar school. This is enshrined in law, it's known as The Greenwich Judgment and means that theoretically any child can get into a grammar school in the sense that they can take and pass the relevant exam.

The issue is that some grammar schools require you to live in catchment so passing the test is only one element of qualification and others (the so-called super-selectives which take the top scorers) you have to be able to physically access. So you can take a Kent test from Newcastle but even if your child gets the top score ever recorded they aren't going to be able to get to school.

(FWIW this also slews the 'people moving to access grammars' figures as in the latter instance the family could, other circumstances permitting, then re-locate to Kent).

twistyizzy · 26/04/2023 19:37

@Chocolatefreak I completely understand the levels of poverty in this county however I am not responsible for poverty and neither are private schools. My DH grew up in a family where they often didn't have enough to eat and has sworn our DD will never be in that position so shoot us now!!
Your comments are downright offensive and prejudiced, based on sweeping assumptions and cliches. We are high earners and are free to spend our money where we see fit.
FYI 10% of our salary goes to charity every month.

Chocolatefreak · 26/04/2023 19:38

@twistyizzy I agree with you, lots of the smaller private schools are cheaper and not so difficult to get into. Lots of my family went to small unknown private schools. Judgemental snobs, the lot of them! Country houses and horses and hunting! Not exactly shining stars as far as brains go either. Hardly any of the women work and them men all do something in the city, if they hadn't inherited Daddy's farm.

And at these jumped up indy's the quality of teaching won't be any better than a good state. But the social advantages are many, compared to state schools.

It's a personal choice to send your kids to private school, yes. But your kids will be mixing with majority middle and upper middle kids who are all wealthy. None of those ghastly common working class types for you, eg?! They are invaluable as connections, I agree. It's just a shame that you can't see the social harm in making something as fundamental as education exclusive. I think that placing kids in a bubble such as a private school this will just perpetuate the terrible and entitled decision- making that goes on in the UK.

As a country, we are missing out on the innovative talent that a truly diverse and quality education could bring to today's youth. And if there were more state school decision makers in government perhaps our education system wouldn't be so underfunded and in such a dire state.

twistyizzy · 26/04/2023 19:38

SoTedious · 26/04/2023 19:33

Are there no poor people where you live @twistyizzy?

(If your DD can only learn about inequality in her lessons at private school instead of mixing in it at state school.)

We are a predominantly white middle class rural area. Not very different from a lot of rural areas in the UK. Not everyone lives in London/ethincally diverse areas you know

CurlewKate · 26/04/2023 19:42

"Because they hate people choosing how to spend their money"

That really is bollocks, and I suspect you know it is....

Sherbs12 · 26/04/2023 19:51

My comment, as I clearly stated, is aimed at those who think the issue is jealousy. Also, I know many people who send their children to private school, so I’m well aware of the many reasons why they do this - raising their child’s awareness of their own privilege and a sense of social responsibility have never been factors, oddly. Your comments on this seem both patronising and clueless. Is this satire?
Private education is a key factor in the social inequality in this country. Yes, it’s absolutely your choice to send your child to private school, but that facts remains and my point is that there are people who are lucky enough to afford to do it, but who choose not to.

SoTedious · 26/04/2023 19:55

Not everyone lives in London/ethincally diverse areas you know

I understand that - I don't live in London either. I thought that many rural areas were quite deprived, that's all.

twistyizzy · 26/04/2023 19:55

@Chocolatefreak wow with the sweeping stereotypes and judgement yet you have the audacity to call others judgemental! Surely you can see the irony?
Yes we are white rural area but all the Mums I know have full time ordinary jobs.
So in a mono-culture how do we expose our DD to diversity? Sending her to state would expose her to economically diverse pupils but this would mean disadvantaging her education which I'm not prepared to do. You may be lucky and have good state schools near you, we aren't lucky. The choice is poor state or private.

twistyizzy · 26/04/2023 19:58

SoTedious · 26/04/2023 19:55

Not everyone lives in London/ethincally diverse areas you know

I understand that - I don't live in London either. I thought that many rural areas were quite deprived, that's all.

Definitely not deprived, average cost of house in our village ie 400K. Only a tiny amount of social housing but most of that has been privately bought now. There are pockets or deprivation in surrounding areas but also lots of large landowners. Also absolute zero on ethnic diversity within our village, 100% white British with mean age of 60+

Sherbs12 · 26/04/2023 20:05

Sherbs12 · 26/04/2023 19:51

My comment, as I clearly stated, is aimed at those who think the issue is jealousy. Also, I know many people who send their children to private school, so I’m well aware of the many reasons why they do this - raising their child’s awareness of their own privilege and a sense of social responsibility have never been factors, oddly. Your comments on this seem both patronising and clueless. Is this satire?
Private education is a key factor in the social inequality in this country. Yes, it’s absolutely your choice to send your child to private school, but that facts remains and my point is that there are people who are lucky enough to afford to do it, but who choose not to.

In response to @twistyizzy

Labraradabrador · 26/04/2023 20:07

BreathesOutSlowly · 26/04/2023 16:22

Education is the key to social mobility. Private education buys privilege and connections which bypass a model of advancement based on merit and endeavour. It ensures that those who are able to access it remain at the top of the pile and it blocks the social mobility which, in other circumstances, would allow those most deserving to thrive.
It is morally wrong.

The privilege is already there whether the money is spent on private schools or nor. The real privilege is financially secure parents who prioritise education. Abolish (or on a personal level forego) private schools and the advantages remain. It is naive to assume it is the schools that confer the privilege.