Grammar or Private School for Oxbridge

[londonmummy4]

I wonder if you lovely ladies or gentleman can help me in my dilemma. My DS has won a place at a very amazing grammar school and a top private school. It is driving me crazy because everyone has an opinion on what we should do. We have no endless trust fund to help our 4 kids and who knows what the political landscape will be in the future. I'm inclined to go with the private school because I never went to one and I think it will be an amazing opportunity. But I am being told by various people that to get into Oxbridge in 5 or 7 years time for the private school students it will be a lot harder. I don't want to play that game. I don't care about Oxbridge. I think the journey and end result will be better at private school for our kids. Am I wrong in thinking this?

Most people apply to more than one place though (although not everyone is fortunate enough to get multiple offers) - and so it’s not unusual to have a period of indecision if they get offers from more than one place.

No problem with people with money, at all.

Problem with people hanging onto state places they have no intention of taking up meaning that people that can't afford private education miss out on the best state option. Because of someone's selfishness.

A period of indecision is fine. Usually a month between first and second round.

Beyond April is unacceptable I think.

“taffeta it sounds like you have a problem with people that have money, which can buy them choices.”
I don’t have a problem with people who have money. It would be incredibly hypocritical if I did. I do have a big problem with people-regardless of wealth- using the system unfairly. I understand that people might hold two offers until the cut off point, but holding a state place after that is pretty despicable. And of course, just not turning up is unforgivable.

private school children play sports that children in the state sector don't even know exist.

That's the killer, isn't it? Personally, I'm quaking in my boots, anticipating the day when DD realises that any problems she ever experiences in life will have been caused by us not having had her made to play lacrosse every winter from the age of 11, as I was.

*A period of indecision is fine. Usually a month between first and second round.

Beyond April is unacceptable I think* .

I complete agree - and it is April. Not even mid April yet. And the OP is asking for help with the decision. In April. So the fury you unleashed on her was uncalled for.

I think it is absolutely ridiculous to be trying to make a decision at 11, based on a possible university place in 7-8yrs time.
You can't guarantee your child will even want to go to uni let alone what the admissions systems will be by then.
Pick the school that suits your child and family.. I have used top girls private and uber selective grammar... Bar lack of sport in grammar there was really little difference.
My dd loved both, and the freedom from fees meant we all benefited from enrichment activities such as travel.
Four at private school... Even if it is day school is a huge financial commitment. We always needed the fees plus %25 to cover extras. So minimum would be £25k a year.. Now think about having even 3 out of 4 at school.. That's £75k out of taxed income.
My dexh and I had both dds at private school and were paying out £45k a year. We are both high earners but even we felt stretched and I had to work 6 days a week.
And then you need to think about how you might feel if despite all your efforts and hard work and sacrifices your ds says he isn't going to apply to uni... He is going off travelling... Friends of my dd1 are still bumming round the world travelling four yrs after leaving school, a school their parents made such sacrifice to pay for because they thought their dd wanted to go to oxbridge and study law!

ROFL @ jellycat1

Don't be such a snowflake -it's a public forum, I'm trying to get a message across to the wider audience reading this thread. I've already said I'm pleased the OP isn't hanging onto her place.

I would pick the school he would be happiest at. Anecdotally several friends and friends of friends have kids freaking out about exams and flatly refusing to do GCSEs. At all. And having mental health issues as a result. This is in state and top public schools. Whether he gets to oxbridge would fall far down the list in those circumstances.

My niece got into Oxford from a state school , first one from that school , she did so because she is very bright ,worked very very hard , and came over well in her interviews ( Oxford are more interested in how you come over in the interviews than your results ) .However you should not be planning his life out that far ahead , at the end of the day you dont know if he will even want to or even be capable of going to any university ( not to mention that depending on what he wants to study other universities may be better )

We gave up DD’s Grammar School place the same day she got the offer letter from her Private School. It’s not fair to hang onto a place at any school, State, Private or Grammar once you know you don’t need it.
Also, they mostly play football and netball at her school -which I’m pretty sure most people will have heard of!

Oxbridge is a red herring as the OP has said. It all comes down to money and your relationship with your dh. It doesn't sound as if educating four kids privately will bankrupt you, it's coming down to sacrificing buying a second home. Personally I'd rather spend that cash on four sets of school fees but these priorities are something only you and your dh can decide.

Which private school and which grammar. It makes a great deal of difference.

Where I live, the local 6th form college is great. It gets very bright children into excellent universities. The local girls’ private school is good and the local boys’ private school is outstanding. However, if I lived in a nearby town, the private school is not much better than a grammar school.

I was happy to pay ££££ for outstanding....

Unless we have details of the schools and your child’s strengths and weaknesses, it is difficult to help.

It just 100% depends on the schools in question. Some private schools (particularly in grammar areas) mainly cater for 11+ failures who aren't that academic and are more interested in sport/drama. Some on the other hand are incredibly academic and have amazingly well qualified staff.

Some grammar schools just take bright kids, give them loads of homework apply loads of pressure and get the kind of good results these kids were always going to get. Some also have appalling pastoral care and try to select out any kid who isn't going to get 8/9's across the board. Others have a real culture of intellectual curiosity and provide an excellent education. It is impossible to make a generic recommendation.

That's the killer, isn't it? Personally, I'm quaking in my boots, anticipating the day when DD realises that any problems she ever experiences in life will have been caused by us not having had her made to play lacrosse every winter from the age of 11, as I was shock

Quite frankly my Wednesday mornings in my teen years would have been significantly improved if I’d never heard of lacrosse.

The other rare and unusual sports we played that state school children will never have heard of were, um, netball, swimming and athletics. Very elite

Quite frankly my Wednesday mornings in my teen years would have been significantly improved if I’d never heard of lacrosse.

I went to a lacrosse-playing school and managed to get through 7 years without having to play in a single game. The trick is to be so poorly coordinated you get allocated to a remedial group where they just keep going over basic throwing and catching skills. Then become adept at bunking off PE lessons, while keeping your grades so high that the staff turn a blind eye.

“Oxford are more interested in how you come over in the interviews than your results”

Only because very, very good results are taken as read!

Which school does he prefer ?

I went to a lacrosse-playing school and managed to get through 7 years without having to play in a single game. The trick is to be so poorly coordinated you get allocated to a remedial group where they just keep going over basic throwing and catching skills. Then become adept at bunking off PE lessons, while keeping your grades so high that the staff turn a blind eye.

That is excellent advice and clearly where I failed.

The private school will offer more in the way of sport, Trips, Music. If you're son is likely to take advantage of these things then go private. My son has taken so much from his private school opportunities, equally there are boys who have done nothing.

I went to a comprehensive school and then to Cambridge. The interviewer showed zero signs of being interested in any sports I'd played, which is just as well seeing as I have two left feet and am pretty embarrassing even in a rounders game.

They wanted to see candidates who were passionate about their subject and had read widely about it, beyond the basic school curriculum.

Oh, and going to Cambridge did not set my career on fire particularly. I do perfectly OK in life but no better than my sister who went to a much less prestigious uni.

It's hard to advise without OP naming schools. Idiots London's top Grammar vs top private we are talking Tiffin vs Westminster or St Paul's. I would choose Tiffin over St Paul's but would think Westminster, for the right kid, is a league apart. Not because it does anything more or better in terms of teaching or extra curricula. It's more that it is like at uni from very early on, suiting a very self motivated intellectual child. Westminster would be a real advantage for Oxbridge, all other private day schools in London - I can't see the added value over grammar and in many cases grammar will be better than private.

*If it is, not idiots, sorry

If the private school for 4 children would mean working more for you/DH to make enough money then I'd say grammar all the way.

You say your top priority is that he is happy, well-balanced etc (or something like that) rather than Oxbridge. The best chance for that (in my opinion, obviously) is a chilled, stress-free home life with happy parents, and enough money and time to do nice things together as a family. Having to continually bust a gut for school fees will add a nice thick layer of stress and eat up lots of holiday and evenings.

Both schools sound like he'll have a great academic future, so I'd pick which will have the happiest family to grow up in.

"Who wants to move to Hackney!"

OP: Really? You actually posted that?

You are a horrendous snob and I think you should send your child to your local comprehensive so that he picks up some views from a wider section of society other than yours.