Coping with children's attitudes to private school

[GooseyLoosey]

There have been lots of threads here about the way in which adults view private education but I am looking for some advice in relation to children's perspectives.

I live in a small village and I took my children out of the village school in April. I am aware that some people have criticised my decision and perceive me negatively as a result. This upset and surprised me, but I am a grown up and can deal with this.

Because the community we live in is a fairly close one, I have tried very hard to ensure that the dcs remain a part of it. This means that they are still involved with village sports and I ensure that they still see village friends.

The problem is that ds (9) is now getting a lot of negative comments about the school he goes to, about how it is full of nerds and he will grow up to be a geek with no friends etc. etc. He is easily hurt and he wants to react to this by withdrawing from village life completely.

What do you think? Should I let him or should I encourage him to confront their views?

I find that astounding seeker and I have never, EVER seen that attitude and I can't think of a time when anyone has ever told me that had happened in real life.

Both dds have good close friends (dd1's best friend in fact) in state education and they all seem to muddle along perfectly well.

Yes our county still has the middle school system but unfortunately not in our area. I think it is great and I may not have made the move if we had had it (particularly as the comp that they feed to is really outstanding )

"I find that astounding seeker and I have never, EVER seen that attitude and I can't think of a time when anyone has ever told me that had happened in real life."

So you think the hostility is all one way?

I wish there was a [completely astonished] emoticon!

That's a shame, seeker. Maybe that is something that happens when dcs get to teenage years?

All we get at the moment are comparisions between length of holiday and homework (private school has more holiday, state school has more homework). I hope things don't change as they get older as that would be a real shame. Ds has known some of his state school friends since he was 2.

iseenodust - I am fairly sure that all of the boys in question will go on to the same local state school. If my finance remain as they are, ds will go to the senior school attached to his junior school.

Can't talk to the coaches. The two worst offenders are their children! I think if they saw it they would stop it but would not welcome me telling them it was a problem.

Seeker, I agree that it probably does happen both ways. However I am absolutely certain that it would not occur to ds to judge someone on the basis of the school their parents can afford to send them to. This makes it very hard for him to see why others judge him.

He wants to be proud of his school but peels off his uniform in the car on the way home so that they don't see him in it. Dd by contrast can hardly be prised out of hers!

Goosey that's really sad. When DS1 started at the village school there were separate classes for each year. It all got a bit problematic when numbers dropped and the classes started being mixed. Big classes with major age ranges. I can see why you are disappointed.

bisjo, know where you are coming from. None of the parents has said anything to my face either but I know they have said things. I think this is affecting the importance I attach to the things that have been said to ds.

Seeker, thinking some more about what you have said, I absolutely agree that the comments can go both ways. However, I am not sure that that reflects the divisive nature of our education system but rather some people's lack of tolerance to difference. I can easily imagine the same children picking on another child because they wore glasses or spoke with a different accent.

The bottom line is that you've just got the think fuck them.

Like my mum always says, you'll be struggling to remember their names in a few years time.

Sorry- the divisive nature of the education system is my own particular hobby horse, and I probably shouldn't have brought it up- it's a bit of a hijack. I live in a specific area where it is a huge issue- we have a real microcosm of the British class system in our town!

As I said I tell my ds to grit his teeth and get on with it- not to let other people stop him doing things he wants to do. it does get better, honestly!

You do say, though, Goosey, that your ds was unhappy at the village school. Even though I'm sure a lot of that was down to lack of intellectual stimulation, I don't think he would have been that unhappy if he had been in the centre of a group of very close friends. In a way he is suffering from the fact that he never fitted in in a way he felt to be acceptable and now he has an additional difference to contend with. And, whilst I suspect some of the comments are really intended to hurt - as I say, villages can be truly hateful places as well as peaceful havens - I think there is some truth in what one poster said about children identifying themselves with their school (and their village) and feeling a little bit betrayed and confused by those who do not happily accept it and love it, warts and all. It causes everyone to question what it is that they have and why others don't like it and whether what they thought was gold is actually mud. You get the same childish behaviour between Oxford and Cambridge, or between Oxford or Cambridge colleges - even otherwise rational, nice people can occasionally descend into a rather childish, herd mentality. It's when that spills over from friendly rivalry to genuine bitterness that life gets difficult.

Completely agree with OP that it is just about difference. When I was still at primary school my brother moved to an indie. I had at least a year of 'your parents must love him more than they do you if you're not going private'. As I said kids can be b*stards but, as someone else said up thread, when you're still there day in day out they get bored and another topic comes along.

Seeker - fortunately we don't have to deal with the divisions caused by the grammar system. I have no idea what would result from that.

I hope it gets better. I don't want it to stop him playing football, but, on the otherhand, I don't want him to end up hating them all. I tell him to ignore them but if their comments dent his new found happiness, even in a small way, I will want to eviscerate them (an over-reaction I admit).

I think you have to accept that the choices you've made have consequences, whether you like it or not. That's life. You're being unrealistic in supposing just because you feel it's no big deal, that everyone else is wrong if they think it is. You have to see that it is inevitable that withdrawing your DC from a village school will send out a message, one you may not intend, that 'this school isn't good enough for my DC' (but, by implication, it's OK for yours).

If you want the benefits of village life, you may find that cherry-picking 'the best bits' whilst rejecting those that you think 'aren't good enough' won't go down well locally. The village school is a huge part of most communities, the veritable village pump. As you're no longer there, unless you are prepared to put your reasons, as given to us here- on a village notice board, you're going to have to live with it.

Another facet of this is of course the perception that you are advantaging your DC over theirs. Well, of course you are! There are queues of MNetters who will tell you that it's 'no business of anyone else at all if they choose to send their DC private', which it wouldn't be if doing that didn't potentially deprive their cleverer but less well educated/trained/spoon fed DC of a RG uni place as your less innately able DC, one who's struggling and 'disappearing' in the cut and thrust of mainstream state education, gets that place due to you throwing money at it.

You may well find your DS begins to want to reject the village DC, too. I know a good friend of mind who 'went private' had the same thing happen to her and her DSs. Admittedly, she made no secret of the fact she felt the local school was failing her DC which didn't endear her to the local DC's families! I am not suggesting that you've done that, but I must say I do find her throw-away remarks about how her DSs are 'now getting a world-class education' i.e. 'private' might put some off her and her DC who of course, in the same way as people on here are suggesting the village DCs are just parroting their parents- well, my friend's DSs live in the same house as her and do tend to parrot her views!

" I tell him to ignore them but if their comments dent his new found happiness, even in a small way, I will want to eviscerate them (an over-reaction I admit)."

Oh, yes. I knowthat feeling!

LittenTree- excellent post.

One of the things we teach our children from babyhood is that actions have consequences, and sometimes unintended consequences.

This is from the parents rather than the children. DS1 is Yr5, he goes to a prep school and it wouldn't occur to him to make judgments about children who go to state schools. This is not because he is a saintly child but because he doesn't have all the baggage that us adults have about the education system so he doesn't make value judgments about which school someone goes to because he doesn't attribute values to those schools.

He would only make those judgments if I had started to indoctrinate him with shite like "people who go to state schools are..." Note - I went to a state school.

I am sure it goes in both directions state to private and private to state.

I'm with Litten and was rather surprised no one else said it earlier. Schools are the heart of family life in many areas (I'd say it was in our inner city neighbourhood) and I think by opting out of it, you may also be sacrificing those friendships that come along with it. I know that the parents of those in private schools round us aren't as involved in the informal weekly football game, the parents' drinks, the parties etc. It's not a deliberate policy of excluding them and their children, but you and your children inevitably feel closer to those that you see every day.
Presumably you feel that your children are getting great advantages out of their new school. Losing the village life might just be the collateral damage.
I speak as someone who wasn't sent to the village school. As a consequence I had absolutely no connection with my local area at all. I recently met by chance someone my age who'd grown up in the same village. We couldn't name anyone in common and I couldn't even remember the names of the local pubs. That's just the way it is.

Round here parents have to talk up the Grammar school to get their DCs to work for the 11+ and accept leaving their friends behind.

Clearly this can rub off on their DCs.

DDs DF is, periodically, being a smug little madam since getting to the grammar school. This is getting on DD2, who decided not to do the 11+, nerves).

Mean while DD1's Grammar school friend, can only be her friend at an club, because her Mother is an unmitigated snob.

Very ordinary house hold, but from the day she moved in she's only been interested in being friends with the right people.
Likewise she only encourages her DDs to do the same. It is a source of huge smugness to her having a clever DD1.

I just wish that DD, didn't look do sad.

PS that's not to say that the children or their parents are right to be mean to your children, but even if they were sweet as pie, something will be lost.

I know what you mean Litten. I think my reasons for moving ds would be widely known. Rabbit was right - Ds did not fit in and although he had friends, he did not have a strong core group of friends. There was never any thought that the village school was not good enough, only that ds was very, very unhappy and nothing we could do could change that.

I would not have moved dd if it were not for ds, but yes, I accept that the up-side for her is the educational advantage. As I have said though, none of her peers have expressed any problem with the move and so far as I know, their parents have not either.

I have done similar with DS1, but moved from one state High School to another better one.. I do find it hard to explain to my friends why I have taken DS away from a school that their children still attend. It was like saying it wasn't good enough for us, so far they have been very understanding.

I know that to a degree I have opted out of the life that goes with standing at the school gate. That is fine. I can live with that. It was my choice.

I also agree that I have "bought" an advantage for dd. She will probably do better than she would have done in the state system. However, her peers don't seem to object to that. They liked her before and they like her now and they honestly don't seem to care what school she goes to. She openly talks about her new school to them and they just seem to like hearning the stories.

Poor ds never mentions his new school and it still makes no difference. I have not had to explain to anyone why we moved ds, the whole village thinks they know why (not that they are all right). Some have openly applauded the decision, others have covertly condemned it. Fine, no problem with that, just don't let your kids take it out on ds. I did not opt out of the right for ds to be treated with a modicum of compassion, or is that a justifiable consequence of my choice?

Goosey
you should talk to the coaches. Don't name names; just say you think there's been some low-level bullying (which is what it is) arising from your decision to move your son to a different school; that this wasn't his fault so its not right that he's being made to feel uncomfortable about it. Ask them to keep an eye out and nip it in the bud (it may be more than the bud stage, but that's perhaps the way to put it).

This sort of behaviour is not inevitable. DD went to a private primary (local was faith, a no-no for us); now she goes to a GS rather than the local comp. She has had village friends all the way through - she hasn't reported any issues. No issues from parents either. You said your DD hasn't had problems either - I'm afraid that some children - sensitive ones like your DS are a target for bullying while others just let any silly comments roll over them, and not getting a reaction the comments stop.

Cr

From what you say it maybe that your ds would have been having problems with his friends even if he hadn't moved schools. The issues are more than a simple state v private debate.