contacting mumsnet about article

[singingmum]

Does anyone know how to contact mumsnet as I would like to know why they wrote such an ill informed article on home education.I know I have commented on this on another thread but the article is still there.I am severly dissapointed that this was written in such a way as to make He seem like a foolish thing to do.The article was badly researched and had no information that was helpful.Mumsnet has been a godsend on the advice front except for this and I am a little shocked that they have done this.
Any help or opinions appreciated.

BTW I learned a LOT more about people's different backgrounds and opinions from books than I did from being dumped with 30 white, middle-class suburbanites who jumped on differences and ridiculed them! In the main, their opinions on race/class etc would have made Enoch Powell blush.

Wasn't expecting this many replies etc.To the person from mumsnet thanks.To the ones who mentioned scottish ed I agree not enough is said.
To dadslib and others with same opinion.I am not being conceited.I enjoyed school at first myself and had a thirst for learning,however,the teachers as I got older hated this they acted like I was a freak.I was told to do more sport and was even put in a reading group for those who couldn't even though I have been able to read fluently since I was 5.As school went on I was hassled for my likes and dislike,for my parents religion and for my classical tastes in music(ie. singing opera).I met my best friend at school and my partner,so yes there were good things but the bad far outweighed them.Not all teachers are complete arses but a lot are.I put my son in nursery at 3 and he could both read and write both through his own choice.The teacher informed him that children his age should not do either and as you can imagine I was annoyed.She continued to annoy me by making him go outside on a wet day without his coat and as he's asthmatic you can imagine my anger(another child put my sons coat on)After this she then told me that my ds was backwards because he had let a stencil slip while using it.This and incidents of bullying caused me to remove him from school and look at other options.AS time has gone by I have studied hard the subject of HE and from the smallest argument(ie socialisation) to the putting your hand up to use the bathroom(which for a girl of 12 having her monthly is embarrasing)I agree with almost everyone.I am not religious but do object to any religion being pushed upon a child without choice.My children are not doing religious studies but are doing cultural studies which gives them a wider understanding and respect for others.
Anais,I agree with your comments wholeheartedly.I find that my children get so much out of HE that the benefits far outweigh all other concerns.My children are taught a lot of subjects between myself and my partner and at a wide range of levels(for example my son is studying KS2 level through to some at GCSE level)My MIL teaches him geography and her partner teaches history,woodwork and metalwork.My brother has offered to give them electronic lessons and my mother art when possible.I feel that my children interact better with the world around them and that they have better language and social skills& manners than a lot of other children.My friends eldest goes to the best school in our area and she is having problems even there.
As for the suggestion on what could be termed 'drop-in schools' I remember reading about an ex teacher who now studies HE stating that HE is better for the child however schools could be changed so that a child and parent could use it as a drop in centre for life long learning.I thought,after reading some of the people on here saying the same thing,that obviously he has an excellent point.
If anyone does wish to contact me other than through this thread please feel free.
HE does mean you have to work but for myself I have found it so rewarding.I am able to learn certain things alongside my child and am still able to work towards my own personal goals.Being a HEer does not mean giving up who you are anymore than being a parent does.

FairyMum, I don't mean to sound rude, but have you actually read any of my posts?

I think I've answered all the points you raise. HE children gain their independence over time and as they're ready, rather than having it forced on them in one go. They make friends in all the normal ways - excepting school. Home-education doesn't mean that they stay shut up in the house all day only seeing one parents. Do your children go to school at 9am and come home at 3.30pm and stay shut in the rest of the time? Do you let them out at weekends? Other than school, HE children have all the same social opportunities available to them. I agree wholeheartedly that you can't learn eveything from books. My children have the whole world as their classroom - they learn from life. They have far more opportunity to learn about real life than children who spend 6 hours a day sat in a classroom.

FairyMum, I don't mean to sound rude, but have you actually read any of my posts?

I think I've answered all the points you raise. HE children gain their independence over time and as they're ready, rather than having it forced on them in one go. They make friends in all the normal ways - excepting school. Home-education doesn't mean that they stay shut up in the house all day only seeing one parents. Do your children go to school at 9am and come home at 3.30pm and stay shut in the rest of the time? Do you let them out at weekends? Other than school, HE children have all the same social opportunities available to them. I agree wholeheartedly that you can't learn eveything from books. My children have the whole world as their classroom - they learn from life. They have far more opportunity to learn about real life than children who spend 6 hours a day sat in a classroom. (Their 'curriculum' is also limited only by imagination, leaving them to explore any interest, and discover any talents at will)

Ooops, sorry.

Thanks Sobernow, I've found the book on Amazon and will be putting it on my wishlist!

Robinw, I hope things continue to improve for you and dd.

Anais, I am afraid I hadn't read any of your posts when I wrote my one. I think I must have scrolled up to quickly and missed many posts, but I read them afterwards and as well as finding them very interesting I also realiased that my own post must look pretty dum.....apologise

To reply to your question, Anais, of course I don't lock up my children after school hours, but a lot of the socialising they do still centres around friends from nursery/school. If my children didn't go to school, I imagine their friends to be children of my friends. This is normal when you are little, but I do think its imortant to make your own friends too. Of course you children would make friends through other activities too, but wouldn't most kids there know eachother from school already or at least find it strange that your kids don't go to school?
You say they "learn from life". Well, school is a huge part of life. Of course we all have a life outside school too where we can meet bus drivers etc like mentioned below....

I am not the greatest fan of everything in the school system myself, but I do think it's important to give children the chance to go to school and fit in. The fact that a child can read and write and might be a bit understimulated for a few years wouldn't worry me. It happened to me and believe me, it was just a phase. The others did catch up with me. Just because your child seem to be a bit advanced for his or her age doesn't mean you've got a little geniuos on your hands. IMO it's important to learn that the world is more than mummy and daddy.

singingmum and anais, I can see you are both very happy with your decision to home educatee your childrem. You and your children are benefitting. Right now, you feel fulfilled helping them to learn. You can follow your own ambitions by studying alongside your children. And, anais, as you say, you take it one day at a time, so I guess you feel the decision isn't irreversable.

But, I don't think I can agree with your statement, singingmum 'being a HE-er does not mean giving up who you are anymore than being a parent does'

Just imagine you decided you wanted to become a nurse or open a restaurant. It became your life's ambition. If your children were educated at school, you would have time to turn your energies to this, but how could you fit in HE around this type of commitment? Aren't there cricumstances where HE would very much conflict with who you want to be?

I guess the only thing you could do is spread the responsibilty amongst other HE adults (your family etc) so you are not your children's only educator. So is it the keeping-your-children-out-of-school-thing that detemines HE for you, more than the fact you are their main 'teacher'?

My other oldest friend - I've known her for, gulp, 33 years, was someone I met at Saturday morning ballet classes. I never went to school with her, yet we're very close friends. I think sometimes 'fitting in' at school can be quite harmful - I came from a different background to most of my school peers and learned to be deeply ashamed and secretive about it. I do think the advantages of school are really overhyped. Having said that, I work so won't be educating my son myself - I want the free childcare!

Tigermoth may I refer you to the fact that my children are educated not just by myself.They are taken care of by a whole family not by just a part of it.I believe this helps to bridge generation gaps and promotes understanding.As for working,there are many HErs who both manage to work and HE with help from the family.The issue of 'just keping them out of school' does not exist.I wish my children to have a wide ranging education with life experience.My partner and I were 20 when we started to HE and we knew what the education system consisted of.We hoped when our son started nursery that things would be improved for him but they weren't.My children and other children are not pegs to be fitted into a slot and made to conform to an educational system that does not differ much from the origional victorian idea of school ie. fill the factorys and conform to societies idea of where you fit.
The education system takes an individual child and turns them into carbon copies of the governments ideal.
Education in most countries has been proven to fail a high percentage of talented children.As every child has a talent of one kind or another then it is our duty as parents to allow them to discover and use those talents to the best of their abilities.It is a case of round pegs being forced into square holes.
Fairymum, the best person to tell in what area their child is a genius is the parent.We know our children better than anyone.My son finds languages and science easy but is susspected to have dyslexia and therefore is lousy at spelling,he also is susspected to have dyspraxia, this therefore makes writing difficult.
When a teacher tells a child that they should not read or write till a certain age then there must be something wrong with how they are being trained.I am not willing to take the chance that my children will not be allowed to fulfill their talents and dreams because of bad training and a bad system.I do not want this on my consience.
As for the point again made on socialisation,my son has friends who are in school and they think that he has the best deal ever.He does a lot that they wish they could do.One example is his best friend also aged 9.He likes to learn and they talk over the things that they know.He did not evn know that as he was born and lived in wales he would be considered welsh.He didn't even realise that that was where we lived.This is atrocious and for me does not inspire confidence in the system.He is bullied by children in his school and wishes that he could be taught at home.School is not a social club.Yes we are around people there but so are HE children around people.My sons friends range in age from 3yrs old to teenagers and for me that is better than only having friends his own age.He has experienced bullying from the children of a mother who does not agree with HEing.I do not allow my son to bully children who go to school and I feel that therefore she can have no right to allow her son to bully my son.Predjudice comes in many forms but for some reason some people seem to believe that if you do not follow what they believe to be the norm then you are crazy,deluded or arrogant.
He may not be right for some but when someone does HE it would be good if the people around would research the subject before making un educated and unfounded comments.

Incidentally, does anyone here use HE materials just to back up what is done in school? I like the idea of introducing "fun learning" like trips, games etc to reinforce what's being done in school at weekends (when ds goes) and also to prepare him before school (I'd like to teach him to read if he's interested before he goes), introduce a second language while he's young, etc. At the same time, want to make sure he gets plenty of time to be a kid too, and not push beyond his interest! Are there HE materials that help with this?

Also, as an aside interested thought - do any of you HE-ers ever come across problems with truant officers stopping you when you're out? There have been a few newsreports fairly recently about them cracking down on truants and wondered if it becomes a pain having to explain why your child is not in a "real" school during school hours (real in inverted commas because that's how I suspect the truant officers would see it, not because that's how I see it).

(ds only 2.5 now - so plenty of time to think about it!)

Have been lucky enough to never have been bothered by truant officers.There is a card which HE children can carry around on them so that the officers know they are HE'd.It's available from one of the HE organisations.
If your looking to back up school then you could try SBS or hope education websites or even Galt.Although these are school suppliers mainly they will supply to HEers and private customers.SbS has some great games for children that help them learn with fun. have a look at

Obviously did link wrong sorry. The address for sbs is www.sbs-educational.co.uk. They have a good online catalouge also www.schoolsurplus.co.uk are good and have plenty of stuff on sale.

lovely, will take a look - thanks singingmum!

Glad to be of help.If you can't find anything then just put a note on here and I'll dig up some more addresses as I have a box full of catalouges.Comes with the HE territory.
Just a thought on the languages, I found that my 3yr old responds well to games,ie. saying a colour in another language and then repeating in english and getting her to find something in the room which was that colour.She also loves counting and animal names in other languages.Dora on nick jr is excellent to introduce spanish and if dora counts then so do we.Kids really do find languages so easy to pick up even when they seem to not be listening or understanding they are often just to busy enjoying the sounds.

Glad to be of help.If you can't find anything then just put a note on here and I'll dig up some more addresses as I have a box full of catalouges.Comes with the HE territory.
Just a thought on the languages, I found that my 3yr old responds well to games,ie. saying a colour in another language and then repeating in english and getting her to find something in the room which was that colour.She also loves counting and animal names in other languages.Dora on nick jr is excellent to introduce spanish and if dora counts then so do we.Kids really do find languages so easy to pick up even when they seem to not be listening or understanding they are often just to busy enjoying the sounds.

Singinmum, I don't think my comments are uneducated just because my opinions differ from your
I have known a fair proption of HE-people in my time. I went to an "open experimental" school where around 50% wehre either Steiner or HE educated. To be blunt, they could bake cookies and grew their own vegetables. They knew very little else. The biggest problem IMO was that they just didn't fit in with people who were not like themselves. I find all this talk about emphasis on "the individual" can backfire. It can easily produce people who have been "moulded" by their parents (or people sepcifically chosen by their parents to educate). I am making very general statements as I am sure HE can be right for some. There are always exceptions to the rule. However, I think HE is mainly done by well-meaning and naive parents with very little belief in the eductational system. I am not a fan of the British educational system either, but I don't recognise it from your description Singinmum......
I think children need to go to school for a variety of reasons. I think HE-children miss out on so much. I can't think of anything more unhealthy than walking in the heels of your parents or other family all day....

Woops, I apologise for bad spelling. Judging from my post, you would think I hadn't been educated at all.....

Yes, ds loves Dora too, and as we spend a week or two every year in Spain I think it would be nice for him to learn some Spanish. Was thinking about the Muzzy course, but it looks so expensive!

Delicioso G!

Fairymum wasn't trying to say that you were uneducated.I am not naive and I am certainly not trying to mold my children into something that I would want.I want my children to be allowed to develop their personalities and ideas.I was never allowed to.I don't know how much you know about the education system but I was talking from experience and thats as a mother an older sister and my own personal.Also I see how schools fail to understand that not everyone is say good at sports etc.
The only things that my children miss out on is being spoken down to by teachers who expect respect but do not wish to give it,bullying without a reply(ie teachers ignoring problem,I refer you to kidscape)and the careers teachers who tell you not to aim for anything as it's not worth it as you are basically not worth it.
In saying un educated I meant on the subject of HE I refer you to groups such as education otherwise HEAS etc.Also if you follow the links on these pages,you will find that HE is a proven method of education.Not only do HE children interact better than school educated,but they have more qualifications,a larger thirst for knowledge and a better rate of job and personal success.There are links also to information from ex teachers and prof's that back HE as a better more real form of education.
A point I would also like to make is that it is more natural for a child to learn from their family and in a lot of cultures the extended family are all responsible for the welfare of the children.This is something severely lacking in the world.We are more dependant these days on HV docs and others we perceieve to be in the know than those who really are.I have seen to many parents trusting the bad judgement of a teacher than in their own because the teacher must know whats right.This is something that is a growing problem and most HEers have chosen to HE to stop some of these things.

singingmum, have you any more info on those HE'ers who manage to work a 35 hour week or more (daytime, weekday hours and not from home). I can understand how children can be HE'ed with the help of family and how it's a really good idea to do this.... But for a typical 35+ hour a week commitment, don't you still need one partner to be mainly a SAHM or SAHD during the day? Or do He'ers who work away from home use a network of other nearby HE'ers and family who will step in and take their place? Or pay for private tuition? How does it work? do you have any links to other sites that give examples of this?

Singingmum, it is exactly the way you write about the educational system that makes me weary of HE. I have great concerns about the British education system. As I grew up in Sweden a lot of it is quite foreign to me. For example, I think it's far too much emphasis on results and exams. So far though, I have been positively suprised by the school my dd goes to, but I am sure it depends on the school and the area. I am not sure I believe the statistics that children who are HE perform and interact so much better than other children. It depends how it is measured and how you interpret the statistics, don't you think? I am sure a lot of HE kids come from well-resourced backgrounds and surely those kids tend to perform generally better anyway?
I think you have definatly been exposed to some pretty bad schools and teachers the way you write. I can definatly promise you that not all teachers talk "down" to pupils or disrespect them.
I think HE-kids miss out on preparing for Christmas and Christmas-performances, reading a poem in front of other kids,listening to the kid in class who can't read and yes, even being picked on or involved in little playground conflicts (I am not talking about serious bullying here of course...). I think certain forms of rejection (like being ignored by teacher or other similar situations) is also an important thing to learn. I don't think this can be taught in an HE environment. So not only do I think that parents can not teach their children the range of academic topics (how many languages do you speak for example?), but I don't think you can learn the necessary social skills if you are only exposed to your family or the people/things your family have chosen to expose you to.As I said in my previous post, I have known many people who have been HE and they definatly have not performed much better than school educated people. Not worse either (not as bad as the Steiner lot, that's for sure LOL), but like I said earlier- the main thing I have seen is that they become a group to themselves who find it difficult to relate to people who aren't like themselves. I also find that they keep quoting their parents opinions and beliefs which IMO is not natural for teenages. To much time spent with their parents I would think!

FM your comment "s I said in my previous post, I have known many people who have been HE and they definatly have not performed much better than school educated people. Not worse either (not as bad as the Steiner lot, that's for sure LOL)"
interested me. This is a link to the achievements of past pupils of the Steiner School in Devon

www.steiner-south-devon.org/master.html

These students will not have recieved lots of GCSEs because they won't have taken them- the Steiner movement doesn't believe in them- but look at all those people and what they have done. Some have been conventially successful- degrees from Oxford and Cambridge or medicine, others have gone into furniture making, or working for tailors, or even neurolinguistic programming. Lots seem to be doing something "caring".

The point being you do not need a conventional education to become a useful, successful member of society.

And what you describe as "little playground conflicts" can be precisely the type of thing that can make school life unbearable for some children.

HE kids do prepare for xmas etc- they do it in their home ed groups. I have yet to meet a home edded child who isn't part of a wider group.

HE isn't for everyone or every child. Families who home ed are no better than families who choose to school. But you do not need school to learn social skills.

I work on a website full of teenagers looking for homework help. I can spot the home edded kids a mile away as they are interested in learning, ask intersting quesions and don't talk in Ali G language. Typical schooled kids question: "teecha wot is da ansa" If that is social skills then god save us.

You have to click on "where are they now" to get the link.